I say Turbo all the way! If I had the cash I would love to have a SUV that would smack almost every car at a stoplight and get around in the snow. Plus it's a Porsche!!!

For those honest opinions about why not to trade the cars please read no further, for the too cool for school set please read on:

The man drives two 911's that appear by his signature to be BAD ASS. Clearly, this guy is not some gold chain wearing, cocktail party wealthy jackass with more money than brains. So lets move past the character murder and move to the issue at hand.

I am sorry to have to shout but WE ARE TALKING ABOUT A FREAKIN TURBO CAYENNE for gods sake not a Chevy Trailblazer. That "lemming mobile" will blow the doors off almost all of your "vintage" cars that you guys drive on a daily basis. And if that's not good enough, he takes it home and gets in a 750 hp turbo and giggles while the g's plant his rear end so firmly in the seat he can't even lean forward.

But back to the lecture at hand (blatant Dr. Dre reference), why would someone torch a guy for considering a vehicle that is built by arguably the finest automobile company in the world, at one of the finest factories in the world, by some of the finest autoworkers in the world? THIS JUST IN, ITS GOT A 996 Turbo MOTOR IN IT. Fine, its not a sports car, its not the .99g skid pad twister and its not going to win the 24 at Daytona. BUT HE ALREADY HAS ONE OF THOSE, if not two.

Clearly, he is looking for a comfortable ride that will get him to the local shop for his racing parts in a hurry. What do you go get your parts in? Your 911? How about a night out with friends? Where do you put your friends, might comfy back there in the back folks huh. (By the way, since I traded mine last year, I can testify that the back of the CL has no leg room and really is not comfortable.)

So get off the elitest high horse, respect the vehicle for what it is and use that 10 pound weight bouncing around up there for something other than spreading fertilizer.

Trade the vehicles and don't look back, well except to wave bye bye to the yawning Porche-o-phile and the sadly informed exc911ence!!!!! As the famous philosopher Earl Pitts says... WAKE UP AMERICA!

OFF SOAPBOX, breath, return to work.

"THIS JUST IN, ITS GOT A 996 Turbo MOTOR IN IT."

Uh no it doesn't:( It's a V8 twin.

Anyway I say go for the Pepper.

If someone likes or wants a Cayenne fine, but I'll just stay on my elitist high horse if you don't mind. Perhaps this thread on cayenne buying http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-cayenne-macan-forum/150684-cayenne-buying-advice.html will expand on "my elitist view".

Doesn't really tie into this thread but I didn't want to start another Cayenne bashing thread

Porsche said they where going to sell 25,000 of these over priced VW's a year. The last numbers I saw where 1600+ or - units a month. That is 19200 trucks a year. So they are under projections by a whopping 23%

Porsche must be limiting the availability to maintain exclusivity..... The dealer in town has 7 of those lemmings on the lot. For every Cayenne I pass, I see 12 Touaregs on the road.

Yep Porsche needed it to stay independent. Now think in a few years when the Cayenne is getting a bit tired. 1600 a month (it is still in the peak sales period*) will drop to a few hundred.

Porsche will have blown it's racing heritage on the thing and they will be touting their over priced Porsche badged VW luxo barge sedan.... I mean "Sport Sedan" as the savior of the company.

Yeah the idea of small light weight sports car priced under the Boxster and capable of blowing the doors off the competition is a stupid idea. I must be living in the past.

* usually the first 2 years of hot new car are sold out. Afterwards the sales are maintained at a constant level or slowly drop off.

A day in the life of a Cayenne owner: I went pheasant hunting today and parked my Cayenne behind a restaurant at the intersection of 2 rural highways in farm country. Came back 5-6 hours later and the owner of the restaurant was standing outside. As I was putting my guns away, he approached and I thought for sure he was going to b!tch about me parking there all day ..... nope. He says, "hey, anytime you want to park here, feel free. But please park right out in front. I've had 50 people come in today and ask me about your car!!!!!! Everybody from teenagers to 85-year old men. Nobody knows what it is, but they all love it!" That's an exact quote. :D

good or bad day for the pheasants?

Bad day for the pheasants ..... :D But this was at a private ranch. First time I've tried one of these 'organized hunts'. I pretty much felt like we were cheating ..... besides that, when you're used to pass-shooting at 40-50MPH ducks, pheasants are a pretty easy target. Especially with a good dog like my buddy's German Shorthair!

GOD MADE ASPHALT SO YUPPIES COULD GO 4 WHEELIN' :D

Stick with the Mercedes all the way, at least there's a car that's true to its nature. Mercedes was always intended to be high-powered luxury sedans - that's their niche. Porsche was always intended to be high-performance, high-end street / track cars - that's THEIR niche. I can't stand the fact that the manufacturer of my beloved Porsche has gotten on this stupid SUV bandwagon. I can't stand it!!! They're selling out to the desire of these chuckleheads that feel compelled to have some freakin' road hazard, gas guzzling monstrosity that can climb Mt. Everest only to drive it around town and stuff grocery sacks in it. STUPID!!! The vehicles (99% of them) are in no way necessary. Unless you're doing backcountry winter camping they're NOT NEEDED!!! Need to haul stuff? Get a truck! Need to drive in snow? BMW, Mercedes, Volvo, Saab, and even a few of the American manufacturers' cars handle just FINE in the snow now due to modern technology. Present-day cars can handle just fine in snow, on wet roads, etc without the need for these stupid "Eddie Bauer" poser inspired creations. They exemplify everything that's wrong with Western (especially American) culture - an in-your-face display of ostentatiousness, extravagance, and "I-can-piss-further-than-you" attitude - to say nothing about the pompous disregard for our dependence on foreign oil (and indirectly the lives of the American soldiers getting their asses shot off every day defending our "right" to it - but that's another whole discussion).

Look, if I offend anyone that happens to like the Cayenne that's just too bad - I think they're ridiculous and anyone that shells out $80K (or more) for one of them DESERVES to look like the fool they inevitably will. Are they well made? Sure. Are they a testimony to the fact that Porsche has excellent engineering and can tackle a variety of problems (not just make fast sports cars)? Fine. But ultimately just because someone CAN do something doesn't mean they SHOULD. A prototype or limited edition would've been fine and proven those points, but now every pompous dick in L.A. (and probably elsewhere) is driving around in one of these things with their cell phone jammed in their ear and their thumb jammed up their ass - that's what I can't stand about it. It's the culture (or lack thereof) behind so many of these "luxury" suv's - the "I'm better than you-ness" of it and the fact that they represent such a snub to the rest of society that irritates the hell out of me about them.

OK, enough said. Let the flaming continue. Whatever. I've said my peace on this - your decision. It's your money, but you asked for opinions so here's mine: stick with the Mercedes P-L-E-A-S-E!!! For the love of humanity!!!





And I believe the antichrist will drive an SUV.





Tpppphhht.

Ok Porsche has built the fastest, best handling SUV in the world.

It outperforms (almost) the 996 around the Nurburgring. And that is where my problem starts. If they can make a truck perform close to their top sportscar then my problem is that the sportscar is not the best that they can build. It's only good enough to satisfy the minimum market requirement.

To build this thing they didn't go racing (or more likely took a business decision that it didn't give enough financial returns and they could rest on their laurels while privateers and enthusiasts kept the racing name alive enough for some publicity). It might make short term business sense to take this line and to abandon the enthusiast market but it doesn't mean I have to like it or continue buying their products. I have only owned one new Porsche out of 11 in about 25 years, but lets not forget that to sell new cars someone also has to buy the used ones. There is nothing after the 993 that appeals to me enough to even seriously consider buying.

Look at 996 depreciation - looks like a bargain compared to a 993, why is that?;) What is the Cayenne going to do? Used, it will end up being priced to sell and fall into the hands of those that can't afford the maintenance. Isn't that why there are so few really nice 928s around? Stand by. The Cayenne will be worse.

But even worse they didn't continue the 911 line. The 996 is I am sure a worthy car, but it is in my eyes no more a 911 successor than the 928 was. Both good cars but they are something different to a 911. The forthcoming 997 seems to be little more than a facelifted 996.

Why couildn't they have given us a modern, light, compact 911 for the enthusiasts that has better performance than it's cheaper rivals?

<i>"but now every pompous dick in L.A. (and probably elsewhere) is driving around in one of these things with their cell phone jammed in their ear and their thumb jammed up their ass - that's what I can't stand about it."</i>

Once again we have someone who dislikes the Cayenne because he dislikes the <u>people</u> he perceives to drive them. Are there people like you describe who drive Cayennes? No question. Are their people like you describe who drive 996's and Boxsters? No question. Were their people like you describe who drove the older Porsches we now own when they were new? No question. This kind of thinking comes from people who are insecure about themselves or their position in life. The Cayenne owners I've met all own multiple Porsches, so they didn't buy it to say they have a Porsche! They bought it because it IS a Porsche - a Porsche that does things no other Porsche can do.

Take the vehicle for what it is - the best all-weather performance vehicle ever produced by any manufacturer. If someone can name a vehicle capable of hauling a 7200 pound trailer and equaling the feel and performance of the Cayenne, fire away!! :D

Trade!!

It's sad that Curt needs to keep defending his choice of car.

Wow, in just one thread I've been told that I'm misinformed and that I should "shutup". That's what I love about Pelican, it's a place where fellow Porsche owners can come and be judged, insulted and threatened by their peers. :rolleyes:

It's sad that we have ignorant people like Porsche-O-Phile living in our country, dictating what we can/can't drive based on preconcieved assumptions, stereotype and hatred.

Oh, I'M ignorant for pointing out that people happen to be categorized on what they drive - oh PLEASE!!! This has gone on since the early days of automobiles and people were first given choices about what to drive - why do you think there are luxury cars, sports cars, economy cars, etc. Because DIFFERENT PEOPLE HAVE DIFFERENT NEEDS AND TASTES!!! DUH!!! You claim I'm the only one that generalizes people based on what they drive? Oh, get real! Look at all the posts on this board (and others) about people that drive so-called "ricers", people that drive minivans, people that drive pickup trucks, people that drive new cars, old cars, American cars, Japanese cars, German cars and (yes) people that drive SUVs. I'm sorry man, but no matter what choice you make, you're going to be judged on it by people - like it or not and I'm HARDLY the only one that does so. Like you've NEVER generalized anyone based on their vehicle choice or driving habits out there - give me a ****** break! PLEASE!!! Now THAT'S an ignorant position!

All I'm saying is that the taste of anyone that sees the need for an $80K SUV is totally misguided and frankly, stupid. You want to think I'm "ignorant" for it - fine. I really don't care what anyone that sees the need for an $80K SUV thinks - their opinion is utterly dismissable in my opinion.

Porsche with the Cayenne is just responding to a percieved market demand. While I think it's pathetic that Porsche has whored out its highly-defended name and hard-won reputation to the current idiotic SUV craze, it's even MORE pathetic that people see the need for such vehicles - creating the demand in the first place. Leave the $80K off-road vehicles to Hummer and the military who might actually use / benefit from them, not the self-indulgent yuppie posers that want to compensate for their penile insecurity. Luxury SUVs! BAH!!!

<i>"Oh, I'M ignorant for pointing out that people happen to be categorized on what they drive - oh PLEASE!!! "</i>

And .... ummmmm ..... what do you happen to drive? I'm sure we'd all <u>love</u> to see it so we could correctly categorize you and critique your choice of transportation. Please post a photo ASAP! LOL!

PS: please hurry with your reply. I've got another cocktail party tonight and we're going to talk SUV's again!

exc911ence - <i> That's what I love about Pelican, it's a place where fellow Porsche owners can come and be judged, insulted and threatened by their peers.</i>

Obviously, you were looking in the mirror when you wrote that because you "judged and insulted" several of your 'peers' on Pelican with your previous post!

i.e. - <i>"Another lemming joins the SUV crowd... it's a sad day for all. </i>

:rolleyes:

CL or Cayenne. .. hmmm

What, you can't afford both!? . . .cheap-ass.


:D this has been the funniest thread I've read in a while.:D

This thread is hillarious. I find it incredibly funny how worked up a few of you get over what someone else drives. Step back and look at yourselves, really. I have to admit when I passed a Prius in my Range Rover yesterday I rolled my eyes:) Would I ever go into the tirade about these "eco" cars in a similar vane as has been taken against SUV's? Ofcourse not, that would be a silly waste of time. People can make whatever choices they want. I am really trying to figure out the massive emotional hatred of SUV's! I may buy another one just to piss some people off:) Is it fuel mileage? Can't be cause I doubt any of you laid into Amac for his surely < 12mpg 700hp 930. By the way, cars are not even close in winter performance, NOT EVEN CLOSE!!! I have an Audi A6 AWD and my RR laughs at it, no really I have ro break them up sometimes:) To contend that I don't need and SUV is about as asinine as someone telling you you don't need a Porsche. I am selling the Audi and will probably get another Rover, my wife and child ride in it and I value them more than I value your opinions. Man I still can't get over the venom you guys are spewing over a freaking car! WOW!

Just a further note on how loony these anti SUVers are. Why was there never a word of discontent regarding Pickup trucks? OK, how bout when a guy put a "topper" on the bed of his truck? What? still no problem. Ok now the topper is welded on, holy sweet eskimo balls, this man is now the antichrist! Really guys get a grip.

<i>"To contend that I don't need an SUV is about as asinine as someone telling you you don't need a Porsche."</i>

That's the funniest part of this thread ..... Porsche owners - <u>Porsche owners</u> for christ's sake!!!!!!!!! - telling people they don't "need" an SUV. Oh my god, it just doesn't get much more comical than that ..... if you guys were out running around in Yugo's, ya might be believable but ......

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1080522704.jpg

cegerer,

Wanna hear a stat about Porsches that justs proves we have no right to own them?

92% of all Porsches never see the racetrack! Burn them burn them all!!!!

I never trust a statistic I didn't make up myself. Let's see your source data. ;)

Oh man, that's priceless! Do I have permission to use that stat when the Cayenne-haters attack? :D -- Curt

trade it, 24 inch rim it (preferably techart or some body colored split 7 spokes), slightly lower it, then chip, exhaust, intake. no big deal, just another 500 plus horesepower porsche turbo for the amac stable.

oh, and i agree, this thread is pretty damn funny and has little to do with whether or not amac should do the deal.

db in TKO

I would like to thank everyone that responded.
Special thanks for the more outspoken entries,
they made me smile. Even though I was the goat,
I ask for opinions and I got them.
I hope you guys had as much fun as I did reading
the replies.
News on the trade coming soon!!

Sounds like something one might see on FOX.

Hey Porsche-O-Phile and osidak!! Were either of you guys in downtown Flint, Michigan this afternoon? I was sitting at a traffic light and there was a guy in a beatup pickup truck on the other side of the intersection. The guy - out of nowhere - just started flippin' me off!!!!!!!!!! When the light turned green and we passed each other the guy looked like he was going to wig out! I was laughing so hard thinking it was probably one of you 2, I could barely stay in my lane. The guy pretty much looked like this (I ain't makin' this up!!) ......

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1080605199.jpg

any resemblance? :D

Cayenne v. CL, who cares? All I want to know is, how does one become an int'l...what is it you do for a living again?

He's in Florida, whoops, Texas, another "border state"...think about it. Doesn't matter what I think. But it might matter what our local Federal Peace Officer thinks...;)

Curt wasn't me but you should really stop posting pictures of your family on the web ;)

I laugh my @ss off when some one claims they are not a gold chainer / poseur and then go on to stay

"a day in the life of - 50 people said they like my car......"

I drive my Porsche because I get enjoyment out of it.... Not because so other jackass on the street thinks it looks cool. I could care less and would prefer the car isn't even noticed.

So let me see your definition of what makes a Porsche is if it has a Porsche Engine then it is a Porsche (You despise the V6 model) And you drive yours because it can tow 7000 pounds. Do you tow 7000 pounds? I don't and never plan on it. Oh and it is an all weather vehicle. Yeah I would never take my 911 out in the rain or snow it might melt.... Oh wait a second I have done both and I still have that pesky thing in the garage. Funny thing is the 911 did great in the snow.

I also laugh my @ss off when people say they need a AWD car for snow and ice. Last snow we got around here I saw more stuck SUV's than I did cars. Imagine that.

My 911 has seen the track, guess I am one of the only 8% real Porsche drivers ;) Show me some pictures of you towing a 7000 pound trailer and doing some real off road driving. ;)

Actually, when I bought the Cayenne I was convinced it would pretty much blend in with the other SUV's on the road (check my past posts prior to me purcashing it ....). I bought it because #1, I could, #2 I'm a P-fanatic, and #3, I couldn't fit my inspection equipment, a 12 foot ladder, 3 passengers and pull a trailer in a 996C4 ...... :eek:

I am truly amazed by the attention this thing gets and I like to remind the "Pelican cognescenti" of these types of unsolicited positive reactions to the vehicle they love to hate ..... :) My dealer told me 2 of his customers are actually considering trading in their Cayennes because they are so uncomfortable with the attention they draw. These types of reactions occur daily and are in stark contrast to the "ugly", "glorified VW", "Hyundai lookalike" comments heard only on Porsche BBS's ..... :rolleyes:

What's important for you to recognize is that nobody knows what this vehicle is. If it had 'PORSCHE' emblazened on the sides, you might have a point about somebody trying to impress others with it. But it only has the small hood crest ..... they don't know if it's a Kia, a Toyota or a Ford for that matter. They just know they like it. :)

Love to hate it so much sales are under production by 23%

The more important fact is the car is still in the honey moon period where if it where hot they couldn't make them fast enough.

Was down at the dealer on Saturday checking out the new stuff while giving my wife a little down time (took my son with me)

Think they had 3 996's, 1 Turbo, 3 or 4 Boxsters, 4 or 5 Touareg$$ ;)

While there (maybe 45 minutes) I saw all the 996 go out on a test drive and 2 of the Boxsters.

The only person looking at the Touareg$$ was me. I was shocked to see a $55,000 price tag on a V6 model. An $80,000 sticker on a V8 model. The salesman said he could work on the price if I was interested.

Now here is the funny part. When I let my Almost 13 month old son run free everytime he went for the Turbo (996) except once and that is when he spotted a customers 993 ;) He walked around the Touareg$$ to get to the Turbo.

Yeah I am proud of him.

So does that 12 foot ladder weigh 7000 pounds?

$80K for an S???? Don't think I've ever seen one that high???

I'm a very selfish person. As such, I don't care if the Pepper sells well or not. As long as I've got mine and there's at least one more available in either silver or white when I sell this one at the end of the year!! Then again, I could always look at a used Turbo ....... :D

I thought the whole point of the Porsche Touareg$$ where to boost sales and save the company.....

Granted Porsche is selling 1600 more cars a month because of the Touareg, but I wonder what the true cost is. Porsche has lost some of its luster and has suffered from brand dilution. I believe the Touareg will be the downfall of company. Time will tell.

The most expensive Touareg S they had stickered at $78,XXX something. Almost $79,000. On the option list $200 floor mats.

I think the VW version of the Touareg comes with floor mats standard.

Porsche - there is no substitute, even the Toureg wannabe. :D

Didn't this exact conversation take place in 1965?

Yeah..those damned 6 cylinder cars ain't Porsches.....

Actually, the "hatred" that some people exhibit towards SUV type vehicles, in particular the high end units can probably be explained by a number of factors.

1. Most people who purchase them will never use them as the designer/engineer intended

2. They are heavy and dangerous to lesser massed vehicles, particularly if the SUV driver is inexperienced

3. They are ostentatious, and some people take umbrage to that; call it envy

4. They are looked at as being gas guzzlers, using more than their share and making gas more expensive for the more "prudent" vehicle owners

Just what I can come up with from remarks made by friends, some of which own SUVs and trucks as well as sedans

My objections are not in this category. To me, the Cayenne has limited stowage, no third seat, no spare tire included in the base price (what about the guy who gets a flat out in the boonies..How does the AAA get there?) and costs 'way too much for my simple pocketbook. I have driven both the NA and the turbo, and they are fine vehicles. However, if it is engineered like most Porsche products, it is now, and will be a bear to keep up as it ages, particulary if used as a daily driver. Given the option for utility, I would probably look elsewhere for the best return for my money

I drive an older 944. Most people can't tell the difference, and it's my secret that including all maintenance for 5 years the entire outlay has been less than $7k. And I have the same crest on my bonnet.