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A Man of Wealth and Taste
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Out there somewhere beyond the doors of perception
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If America Retreats
If the US should pull out of Irak under the current circumstances. It will have proven Osma Bin Laden right. When the going gets tough America leaves.
America retreating from Irak would be considered a great victory for Muslim Fundlementalists. They would be embolden to take even greater action. Many of the people who are our friends or are on the fence would have no option but to desert us. If several countries such as Pakistan and Saudi goes over to the religious fanatics, they would not only control the flow of oil to the west but have Nuclear weapons to back up thier position. The price the WEST would have to pay to defeat Muslim fundlementalism would go up exponently in not only manpower, wealth and time. Instead of 12 dead or 30 dead or 500 US troops being dead the numbers would go into the 1000's if not 100,000's. At some point the WEST would have to step up and do whats necessary or SURRENDER to the forces of religious intolerence. In conclusion if the US retreats from Irak we could very well have lost the war on Terrorism.
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04-07-2004, 10:05 AM
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A Man of Wealth and Taste
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BTW: This is not Vietnam, in this war we are fighting against a virulent strain of one of the major religions in the world. The Cold war was a backdrop to the war in Vietnam, and that limited the options we could employ in waging that war. This war by contrast is about the very way we in the WEST live our lives and conduct business. The xenophoobia of the Muslim Fundlementalists is anthetical to our very existence
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04-07-2004, 10:12 AM
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I don't see how it has been any benifit for Spain to back down. I feel we can show no weakness or they will just get more bold.
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04-07-2004, 10:50 AM
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I totally agree, but we shouldn't be driving around Fahla-*****in-jah in Humvees in the first place.
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04-07-2004, 10:56 AM
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drag racing the short bus
Join Date: May 2002
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Tabs, why do you continually insist this is not a Vietnam. What is the goddamned difference between Iraq and Vietnam? We are fighting an ideology now as we did then. We're an invading force, who once again, have not studied the history of the country and personalities involved, and by late, have underestimated those who we have provoked into becoming our enemy. It's just like Vietnam!
To say it is not another Vietnam is denying proven historical fact.
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The Terror of Tiny Town |
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04-07-2004, 11:13 AM
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Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Lacey, WA. USA
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Yes, Tabs, and that is why this decision was one of histories most severe blunders. Virtually the only way to disagree with the statement I just made, is to infer that this war should be taken to its logical conclusion, which you come VERY close to doing.....GENOCIDE.
If there is a bee in your car, you have two good options and one bad one. You can leave it alone, or kill it. The mistake would be to swat at it and then allow it to live.
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Man of Carbon Fiber (stronger than steel) Mocha 1978 911SC. "Coco" |
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04-07-2004, 11:20 AM
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A Man of Wealth and Taste
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Out there somewhere beyond the doors of perception
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You better read your history of the Muslim religion...it's xenophonic...It was Charles Martel who beat the Muslim at the Battle of Tours in 748?, it was the Polish army who beat back the Turks in front of Vienna in the Middle Ages...It was Ferdinand and Isabella who finally kicked the Moors out of Spain in 1492.
If Osma Bin Laden gets hold of Pakistans Nuclear arsenal, do you think he will hesitate to use them to further his cause. That of defeating the West...Is the USA prepared to respond with the use of Nuclear weapons in return. Since when in the history of mankind hasn't there been blood baths. The consequences of leaving the field in Vietnam were relativily minor..the consequences of leaving this field can be catastrophic...This has nothing to do with whether we are right or wrong in being there..It's the nature of what the fundlementalist movement will do with their victory...The US as the guarntor of global security will be over, no one will trust that our words mean anything. It could bring down the house of cards... Everything will turn to *****... The best solution we can realistically come up with is to be able to hand off some responsibilty to NATO....install another dictorial regime that will impose order. Irak is a state that doesn't have a reason for existing...as I said after WW1 France and GB decided to creat Irak lumping 3 disparent groups together who don't get along. The worst possible sceniro of a Civil War has come to pass.
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04-07-2004, 12:04 PM
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A Man of Wealth and Taste
Join Date: Dec 2002
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Assinate Musharef or throw a coup and that would be possible if the USA is shown to be weak...that he backed the wrong side...There is a lot of fundlementalist oposition in Pakistan to his government.
NATO is a weak sister..the only countries that have any backbone are the former Soviet satelites...Ukarain, Poland, Rumania all have troops in Irak...all know just how important the war on Terrorism really is..
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04-07-2004, 12:40 PM
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drag racing the short bus
Join Date: May 2002
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Tabs - your diatribe is enough to raise my pulse - which I don't like. For as many non-Islamic victories there have been in history, there have been losses. The British could never contain either Iraq or Pakistan, for example. So what you point out with war victories is a wash.
Bin Laden can of course get hold of Pakistan's nukes, if he hasn't already. The current PM in Pakistan, barely has a hold on the country. And his military is pathetic. Twenty to thirty al Queda wiped the mountainsides with the Pakistani army only two weeks ago. All this language you use about anyone not trusting our word is lunacy. Who cares about that crap? Our word is currently a joke in the world community. Face it, Iraq is a disaster, and NATO won't come to our rescue - which is what it will be - OUR RESCUE - without us sucking down a whole lot of humiliation sausage. But of course, any good president with "friends" in his cabinet - not cowtailing lackeys - would think this through and use real advice - not make up stories and delusions. They'd take Vietnam as an example, and weigh their odds with that.
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04-07-2004, 12:50 PM
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Quote:
It sounds like above is a historically based apology for your support of a possible genocide. Why must the military route be taken? Sounds like a review of Sun Tzu might be in order. "Hence to fight and conquer in all your battles is not supreme excellence; supreme excellence consists in breaking the enemy's resistance without fighting. " I think we'll be able to solve the problem with product placement, personally. I am dead serious. JCM
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04-07-2004, 12:50 PM
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drag racing the short bus
Join Date: May 2002
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Quote:
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The Terror of Tiny Town |
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04-07-2004, 01:00 PM
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Quote:
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04-07-2004, 01:06 PM
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Quote:
 JCM
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04-07-2004, 01:13 PM
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tabs,
you have it all figured out. i salute you 
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04-07-2004, 02:37 PM
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A Man of Wealth and Taste
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Out there somewhere beyond the doors of perception
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As the esteemed Senator from Arizona said before the Senate....Irak is nothing like Vietnam...I think I will take his word for it on this matter, cause he has seen Vietnam from the inside out as it were.
Product placement is what puts a bee in the fundlementalists bonnet, and makes them want to leave large swaths of vacant land in the name of Allah....After all they blame Mickey D's for corrupting little Abdul for not wanting to eat the goat that his mother spent all day cooking over the campfire.... Their idea of a utopian society is where they bring an Islamic theocracy to your neighborhood.
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04-08-2004, 02:36 AM
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Quote:
Nice characterization of the billion Muslims on the face of this planet, btw. JCM
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04-08-2004, 08:20 AM
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Schatzi
Schatzi
1979 Porsche 911SC 3.0
