Ain't that the truth! My dad owned a very small paving company when I was a kid. He had to watch every dime. If he underbid a big job, things were tight around the house for a while. Imagine if todays small paving company had to shell out $27.18 for a flagger! He'd be out of business in a hurry.

Goverment projects are great. If you go overbudget-so what? Nobody goes hungry or loses their job. So easy to spend somebody elses money.

Comeon Sup! Don't leave me hangin man. I already called the wife and gave her the good news. She wants to hit Sonic tonight to celebrate. Do you have any conections in my area? Maybe you could pull some strings? I know we've had our differences, but please do me a solid here:)

I can see a new horizon underneath the blazing sky
I'll be where the eagle's flyin' higher and higher
Gonna be your man in motion, all I need is a pair of wheels
Take me where my future's lyin', St. Elmo's Fire
I can climb the highest mountain, cross the wildest sea
I can feel St. Elmo's Fire burnin' in me

Yeah, Super, you really should get len one of those sweet gigs.

I know he is one of those business owners . . .but give the guy a break. Besides, it will be good for the government when those 25 people len is employing are put on welfare.

Win-win. . .all around. :cool:

You're on. The figure I posted includes benefits, which do not multiply in the case of OT. Some crafts have 2x OT rules, but not Flaggers. Theirs is 1.5. so the wage, of roughly $20, is multipled by 1.5 in the case of an OT hour.

Laborer apprenticeship programs are four years, and you start low and end at this wage. You wanna be a Flagger? Okay, but they get killed all the time. They're working a few feet from traffic. Ever notice how people drive? Also, when it snows, they get cold. When it rains they get wet, etc. Futher, their work is seasonal, so you cannot assume that wage times 2000 hours per year. And finally, it's really hard to find an old Flagger, or any kind of old outside construction worker. Not just because the cold is uncomfortable. Their bodies just give out after maybe 20 years of this work. So, that's a "career" for those guys. If you wanna apply for an apprentice position, I can hook you up.

Oh, and after being called "out of touch," I saw a post that seemed to assume that being an inefficient contractor and going overbudget is no problem, I guess the government just opens its pocketbook? Is this what you think? and I'm the one out of touch? Sure, when a contractor finds buried "surprizes" during an excavation, the agency will pony up. We try not to drive contractors into bankruptcy due to situations beyond their control. but if you're going to take the position that government has no regard for its spending, you'd better know what you're talking about. And you don't.

Sure, there are stories of silly decisions. Unlike in the private sector, I am sure. But my experience with public agencies (and that of the State Auditor) is that their budgets are TIGHT and they do the best they can with that.

Quite frankly, and EMPHATICALLY, I can promise you that the contractor play WAY WAY WAY WAY more games than the agencies. As emperor, there are a few that I would simply jail for what they've pulled. But that's the private enterprise that some folks here think is more responsible than government folks. Are you guys thinking when you say that? Think of the difference in oversight (government files are public records, contractor files are "priprietary" secrets). Think of the difference in incentives (government workers manage a project...private companies maximize profits).

I'm sitting here, daily, looking into just over one million dollars worth of construction each day, and ....I'm out of touch. Coulda fooled me.

I would never vote for a Democrate. I just don't believe in their ideology.


BTW, the prevailing wage is designed to place union shops in a level playing field with the private contractor for projects constructed with public funds. The workers rights are protected by statute and contract. In CA, Laborers with about 2000 hours are up to about $32 an hour for ST, including benefits.

In CA, an employer who fails to pay the prevailing wage is liable for back wages, interest, waiting time penalties (30 days wages) plus attorneys fees and costs. A single employee can bring a representative action on behalf of all workers employed by that employer to obtain a restitutionary order under the unfair business practices act. I know, I recover wages earned on public works for workers every day of the work week. The cheating that goes on is mind blowing.

To get back on the original question, no, I probably wouldn't vote for Kerry with McCain, (I'd think about it though). I'm not real pleased with Bush at this time. I believe he thought Saddam had WMD. Hell, the French, the UN., the Germans, the Russians all thought he had WMD, they just differed on how to deal with it. No for the Dems. to say that W lied is bull. Kerry thought Saddam had WMD, so did Kennedy, before we invaded. For them to say they were mislead, is also bull. Both of them were on the Senate Select Committee on Intelligence. They say everything (or had the opportunity) to see everything that Powell, Rumsfeld and W saw.

Regarding the second part of this thread about government in general... Exactly how many private sector jobs has the U.S. Department of Commerce created? Answer, None. So what purpose do they serve. The problem with taxes and government is that the average person doesn't pay taxes that are commensurate with the services that they pull out of government. Thats right, the "average" American family of four doesn't even pay enough taxes to put their own kids through K-12, let alone pay for police, fire, roads, flood control, etc. When the top 5% of wage earners pay over 50% of the taxes, somethng is seriously wrong. Yet those who don't pay the taxes, and their representative electoral party (the Dems.) are saying "No tax cuts for the rich!! Who the Fxxx do you think are paying the taxes! That's my beef with the Dems., they want everyone else (the Republicans) to pay for their great social ideas and programs.

It's bad enough when my neighbors use my wife without asking, but my tools? That really chaps me . . .

No can of worms here. I completely agree with this statement. This is why I think McCain would make a good match for Kerry. Kerry strikes me as a tax and spend Democrat with a great love for huge government. McCain would invariably keep Kerry on the straight and narrow (if they don't kill each other first). Campaign financing is only the tip of the iceberg with McCain, though I believe for McCain, campaign financing was a personal crusade given the big-money whipping Bush gave him back when GW was elected.

As far as detached, McCain's quite detached. He marches to his own beat, and frustrates the hell out of many, Dem and Rep alike.

The question for the Republicans on the board is if McCain ran with Kerry and a Kerry-McCain venture lost in Nov., would you still support McCain, or do you think he'd be in a political no-man's land?

I think the bigger question is; would the dem's vote for a guy so lame, that he had to go, across party lines, to get a Repulican running-mate.
I mean, really; going across party lines!? . . that has got to be the height of ideologic bankruptcy!

I think Hillary is waiting for Kerry to get a bit futher wounded. . .she'll be able to step in and rally the troops, and Kerry can apply for another medal.

Kerry and H. Clinton would be a circus. It's time the dems get serious if they have something to offer in lieu of Bush.

Island: I think dems these days are more to the right than left, or at least the majority are. I actually think in some respects, McCain speaks more their language than Kerry. Iraq for instance: McCain is for the war, but not the way it's being executed. That's a dem platform, too. Abortion rights is another story, however, which McCain is against...

DD
I think you are right about Kerry and Hillary...also McCain would not be enough to fix the problem unless Kerry was running as VP. People don't generally vote for the VP..and after the election, Kerry could just ignore him when making policy. Although I don't agree with evertything he does (spends too much and too weak on immigration)..I think I will stick with Bush. Even on the issues that I noted where Bush is weak, Kerry is even weaker.

I'll vouch for flagging being a suck ass job, during my apprenticeship I spent many overtime hours flagging & it's not as pleasant & easy as it looks.

I worked for contractors for 10 years before getting a goverment job. None of the companies were as efficent as the department I work for now. IMHO when privatization of public utilities takes place, the customer loses qaulity of service & thier rates will eventually sour.

John McCain is the real life
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1084669512.jpg

I think its going to rule when we go to the DMV/IRS type governtment office to get our perscription medication. Those places are sooo efficent.

McCain walks a fine line and many of us gun strapped on the side, anti abortion, pro kickin the $hit out of terrorists before they kick us, dont use my tax money for stupid things I wouldnt vote for, tell the UN to see a doctor to get an addasactomy(pronunced add a sack to me) so we dont have to be thier backbone, if arent willing to pay 5 times as much shut the hell up about outsourcing types are sleeping with one eye open and re-election for him just might reflect that. This is the land of Sheriff Joe, come on!