My dog killed another dog.........

J Smith · 09-05-2005, 12:24 PM

Here's the story:
My in-laws have a house on a lake in the Poconos. My wife an I frequently visit, and bring our dogs (male lab, female mastiff). They both love to swim. My lab loves everybody and everything, wouldn't hurt a fly. The mastiff is very sweet with people and has never shown an aggression towards another human. She is generally good around other dogs. There have been exceptions, usually when another dog is aggressive first.

Last year, new neighbors moved in next to my in-laws house. They have 2 chihuahuas. We let the dogs get to know each other, and the one chihuahua got a little nippy and loud, and my mastiff didn't like it. I grabbed her (my mastiff), no harm done. We agreed that we'd keep them apart because it wouldn't take much to do some serious damage. Usually he or his wife are holding the dogs, so it's not an issue. They are super nice people. We have had dinner with them, and he lets me and the rest of my wife's family use his motorboat whenever we want.

Yesterday, I left to come home early and my wife stayed. She had the dogs down at the lake swimming, and the neighbor walked down with chihuahua following him. My wife told him that maybe he should pick him up to be on the safe side, and he blew it off saying they'd be fine together. My wife immediately started walking towards out mastiff to get ahold of her before anything could happen. Too late....

The chihuahua started barking, and then took off running. My mastiff took chase, caught it, and with one bite and a shake, it was over. She didn't even know what she did, to her it was a toy, not a dog.

The neighbor blames himself, I blame my wife. I am a little puzzled as to why he didn't pick up his dog when my wife mentioned it, but it's still no excuse for my dogs attack. Apparently, everyone was crying, but there were no hostile feelings whatsoever.

Question: What do I do in this situation?

speeder · 09-05-2005, 12:49 PM

Josh, Apologise and offer restitution, ie. buy them a new dog. It's a sad situation, but animals are animals and some people just do not understand this. Considering that your wife told him to pick up the dog, he definitely shares some responsibility. I am very protective of my dog, and if I had a little one I would take no chances like that.

J Smith · 09-05-2005, 01:56 PM

I plan to apologize profusely (through a written letter and in person), and offer to buy another dog. As a dog owner, I know that won't make anyone feel better about what happened. They want their dog back.

We definitley will need to watch her closely now, although if you met her, you'd wonder how a dog this sweet could do this. She'll be on a short leash the rest of her life (she's only 1.5 years old). There usually are other dogs in the area, and there was never a problem before. I won't take any chances from now on.

Icemaster · Icemaster's Garage

Take him out for several beers during which he'll confide in you that it was all part of his master plan to rid himself of one of the most annoying dogs in the world that his wife wouldn't let him get rid of.

vash · vash's Garage

josh, that sucks. you and your wife are now not dog "owners" but dog "managers". gone are the leisurely dog things. everytime you hear a dog bark or see a dog walking down the street, you will always have to check your mastiff.

i am going thru a very similar situation. nothing has happened yet, but i see the potential. i have hired a pro dog trainer, for a temperament evaluation, and some training for ME. how do i socialize my animal? if anything happened already, i would be calling my vet to ask some hard questions. i would probably put her down easy. sorry this happened to you. but do not surrender your dog, dont pass on the problem. get a trainer, go from there.

J Smith · 09-05-2005, 02:55 PM

I know the main issue was the size of the dog (the chihuahua) . There are plenty of groundhogs around here. I regularly take my dogs to my parents where groundhogs are frequently brought back to the yard as a trophy to show off. Both by my dogs and theirs. No one says a word about that. How would my dog know the difference. My dad has always had at least two dogs in our family, all very well behaved. And he said if there was a little dog like that running around the yard, the same thing would probably happen.

I'm not making excuses. There is no way this should have happened. Clearly she either needs more training (we did do puppy kindergarten) and acclimation to other dogs (all kinds), or we just have to stay out of these situations.

Ice - You're not the first person to say that.

J Smith · 09-05-2005, 03:01 PM

I also just talked to my father-in-law. He spent some time with them last night. The guy said he takes full responsibility. He knew the potential and ignored it. Said we should not feel bad about this at all, that he did nothing to prevent or stop the situation. My wife was running around trying to stop this, and he just stood there thinking nothing would happen.

And apparently, he is some serious hot water with his wife.

Moses · 09-05-2005, 03:05 PM

Here's my take. In the Poconos, you are a visitor. They live there. Seems to me you have an absolute responsibility to keep your dog leashed.

Imagine the dread of worrying if the visitors dog plans to make lunch of your pet. Awful.

I would certainly not take the dog to the Poconos again. The neighbors have been gracious, but they do not need to be reminded of the dog that killed their pet.

Personally, I would lose the Mastiff. Unpredictable aggressive behavior is dangerous.

Victor · 09-05-2005, 03:11 PM

Terrible thing and by the sounds of it nothing you could have done about it given you where not there.

As a fellow dog owner, I would have it put down. If you can't leave your dog alone with others and cannot vouch for it's behaviour at ALL times - it's got to go. Plain and simple.

Next time it could be a little kid running down the street.

Neilk · 09-05-2005, 03:22 PM

I would keep a close eye on the dog and just apologize profusely. I don't think anyone here would have a problem with a dog hunting squirrels, which is about the same size as a chihuahua. So it seems to me that it was more of a mistake than anything else.

scottmandue · 09-05-2005, 03:34 PM

Neil beat me to it...

Not to be rude or crude but it does seem possible the Mastiff though it was dealing with a rodent. A behavior that was not seen as negative and treated as such.

I'm just saying this doesn't sound like a vicious dog. Much like cats can be raised with mice so they won't try to eat them but most cats will go after a small furry thing if given the chance.

One of the most amazing things I have seen (actually I just heard the event going on outside my tent) was a bear walking through a campground at night being harassed by someones yippy dog much to the horror of the dogs owners. Somehow the wise old bear knew that dog was not on the menu.

Ronbo · 09-05-2005, 04:27 PM

One of our first Great Danes was very dog-aggressive. He was great around people and kids, but simply would not tolerate other dogs (except his sister who we also owned). He was like this when we got him as a 7 week old puppy, while his sister showed no aggression at all. During his life we kept him away from other animals and was always leashed when on walks or otherwise away from home. We were careful, and it worked for us. It was very puzzling, as he was very sweet otherwise. BTW I agree with Moses' suggestion of not returning there with the dog again. Good luck.

stomachmonkey · 09-05-2005, 04:42 PM

I have had and currently own a Mastiff.

I doubt the Mastiff meant to kill the little guy.

The problem here is an 18 wheeler vs. a soap box derby car, if they meet head on, no contest.

My male Mastiff could pick up and pop a basketball without any effort.

We are talking about an obscenely strong animal here.

If the other dog were 50+ lbs it'd probably still be alive.

I always walk my dogs on a leash. When I encounter another owner with their dog off leash I warn them that if there is a tussle I will drop my leash, my dog is in more danger by remaining restricted, and if their dog ends up dead it's their own fault.

Your wife tried to do the right thing, the other guy should have learned from the prior incident and should have heeded your warning.

You shoulf feel no guilt and the dog is not at fault either.

Victor,

Kids are safer with a Mastiff than just about any other breed. They are highly tolerent, patient and only resort to violence as a last resort.

Only problem with Mastiffs and kids is that Mastiffs are lap dogs and you have to be carefull that they don't sit on the kid.

Scott

Victor · 09-05-2005, 04:49 PM

I hear what you are saying.

Maybe it's the fault of the average owner that I see over here that has put me off bull mastiffs, pit bulls and other such types of breed. It's usually physically and mentally inadequate young males trying to compensate with tattoo's and an aggressive dog that have "trained" them to be killers.

Obviously you guys do not fall into this category and maybe it's that type of owner that should be put down instead of the dog.

911carrera1984 · 09-05-2005, 04:50 PM

I would keep a close eye on the dog and just apologize profusely. I don't think anyone here would have a problem with a dog hunting squirrels, which is about the same size as a chihuahua. So it seems to me that it was more of a mistake than anything else.

i don't post much but here goes.i think i would lose the dog. i've got a giant schnauzer which are known for their strong prey drive and she's never hurt the very small dogs in our neighborhood. she'll push em into the ground on ocassion and even the larger dog's for that matter, but they know the diff between" prey" and other dog's. sorry to hear the story. very unfortunate

Neilk · 09-05-2005, 05:06 PM

One more thing... get the dog trained to be under voice command so that if it even starts pulling on a leash it will heal at your feet.

creaturecat · 09-05-2005, 05:12 PM

I would shoot that mastiff in a second if it killed my pet . You are 100% responsible . How would YOU feel if the shoe was on the other foot? Get rid of that f'n killer.

J Smith · 09-05-2005, 05:23 PM

She's not going anywhere, nor will I even think about putting her down. Not even a question. If you would meet her, you'll know why.

We're not visitors there. My inlaws have owned the house for 15 years, and I have spent many weekends there for the past 8 years. The neighbors moved in last year. Makes no difference, just wanted to clear that up. It's a weekend getaway for both families.

My wife's family owns a ski shop, my wife is in there alone much of the time. Both our dogs spend alot of time in the shop, with customers. Kids especially. Families come to her shop just to visit the "big dog". She just rolls over and lets the kids rub her belly. Never ever an issue. People can't believe how sweet she is. Is she intimidating? Absolutley. Would she hurt a person? No way.

I know what most of you think when you read things like this and the visions that come to mind. Trust me when I say, she's not what you're thinking. Aggressive would be the very last word I would use to describe her.

I appreciate the comments and suggestions, but I realize now that it's hard to ask an opinion on a situation that one is not familiar with. But feel free to keep 'em coming.

Flatbutt1 · 09-05-2005, 05:29 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by creaturecat
I would shoot that mastiff in a second if it killed my pet . You are 100% responsible . How would YOU feel if the shoe was on the other foot? Get rid of that f'n killer.

Do you keep pets? The responsibility here is shared .

I control my dog and my neighbors control theirs. Whenever dogs are off the leash bad stuff can happen. One neighbor has a pitbull that WAS a sweet dog. Then one day it went off and attacked a Rottweiler. Well it got its ass kicked. But now it tries to go after every dog that goes by that house. It can't be let off the leash for a moment. Now thats a dog that needs to be put away. My dog has never gone after a dog or a person though she is quite protective. I never let her around other dogs unleashed. They're dogs for cryin' out loud. No matter how well trained they're still dogs.

J Smith · 09-05-2005, 05:47 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by creaturecat
I would shoot that mastiff in a second if it killed my pet . You are 100% responsible . How would YOU feel if the shoe was on the other foot? Get rid of that f'n killer.

Honestly, if for some unknown reason I owned a teacup chihuahua, and knew that there may be an issue with the 150lb dog next door, I'd keep a close eye on it. Everyone involved knew that there was the potential for something bad to happen. As soon as my wife saw the chihuahua, she said something immediately, and the guy blew it off. He could have very easily reached down and picked up the dog. He chose not to claiming that the chihuahua was fast, he could get away. Guess what, mastiffs are fast too.

I feel horrible, I really do. I don't mean to sound unapologetic. He has taken full responsibility, even though I know it we are equally to blame. If I saw anything in my dog that would lead me to believe she was dangerous, I wouldn't have her as my dog.

At the end of the day, they're animals. S**t, there are human beings in New Orleans acting worse right now.