i have a co-worker that shoots a sig like he sleeps with it. he just brings masking tape and tapes up the ragged little hole in the target and keeps re-using it. (funny thing is, he even has an wandering eye). i vote sig.

Wow. That's pretty trick. I hear the new ones come with nightsights too. That's a $100 add-on for most guns. Any FTE with the 9mm version? I already have a 9, and it would simplify ammo if I got the RAMI in 9mm. Is there really much diff between 9mm and .40SW? I calculated that it's .136 (inches) difference in size. Doesn't seem like there would be that much diff in stopping power.

I looked at the shells and there is a significant difference (to my eye). I didn't notice much of a different kick between the two. I've had more than one person talk up the 40SW saying that a lot of LEO and military are moving away from 9mm.

I like 40SW but I shoot like garbage with my G22. It's all about the trigger pull (ok Tabs, we get it). It's why I actually like shooting my .44 mag better.

9mm hold 10 rounds, I think. .40 holds 8. Of course add 1 round for the chamber.

I read a post on The High Road from a ER Doctor. His theory was the .40 has more stopping power based on the fact he sees alot more < 9mm gun shot wounds in the ER. To paraphrase the > .40 cal gun shot victims never make it to the ER. They go to the morgue.

Yea, I've heard that many times too. Realistically, would a bad guy in my house really notice the difference between three 9mm center mass wounds and three .40SW wounds? I think either way, it's a bad day for him.

Simple...the 9mm is much more popular than the .40SW. :cool:

????

My G22 holds 15 rounds in the mag and one in the pipe.

They're sold with 10-round mags.

the glock 40sw will hold 10 cartridges. their .45 does too.

THe Rami is a sub compact, so the clip is limited in capacity as compared to a fll sized.

Blue Sky, in the Peoples Republic of Kalifornia, we are only trusted with 10 round clips.

Wow, sometimes I need to be reminded that I really do live in the "Wild Wild West". :D

9mm = why bother
.40 S&W = "short & wimpy"
.45 = juuuuuust right
:D :p

RE: stance - Sounds like you are using the "modified weaver" stance, or a variation.
Just for info, here is the "complete package" to that stance and grip (assuming you are right-handed):

left foot forward, left shoulder cocked towards target.
torso at a 45+ degree angle to the target.
right arm very slightly bent.
left arm bent, elbow down.
grip the gun high with right hand, thumb high.
overlap with left hand, left thumb low and pointing toward target.
slightly push with your right (towards target), and pull with your left.

Don't be "that guy" who puts his weak hand under the grip/magwell "Miami Vice" style (especially on an auto). :D

Good job. Just one pointer comes to mind - you mentioned you focused on the rear sight and let the target and front sight go blury. You should actually be focusing on the front sight at all times. I have three decades of competitive shooting under my belt and a great deal of profesional training as well. If you can see nothing else, make sure you see that front sight. It's kind of unnatural, even counter-intuitive at first, but make yourself do it anyway. You will be glad you did.

Good call Jeff.
Another often-overlooked factor to accuracy is your breathing technique.
People have their different methods and the general rule is: use whatever works for you (kinda like grip/stance). Just try and keep it consistent but focus on the target, not your breathing (if that makes any sense).
When shooting for accuracy, I use a relaxed slow/deep breathing style, and squeeze the trigger about 2/3rds thru the exhale.
A lot of beginners have a tough time with this, and end up holding their breath for every shot.

The instructor definitely said to focus on the rear site, but I'm not sure he was "all there", as he put 9mm ammo through one of the student's 40SW Sig. It would fire once, then not. He'd clear it, it would fire once, then quit. Did this like 4 times until he figure out he'd put the wrong ammo in.

So...I'll take Jeff's advice to heart. As for breathing, I've got that pretty good. I would do it almost at the end of the exhale, but I'm pretty good at "belly breathing" and not heaving my chest (score one for meditation and qi gong).

Like a lot of the posters here I have had enough time and training to offer comments and advice.

Rather than offering comments which would be best offered one to one on the range I would make a suggestion.

Try and track down a copy of competitive pistol shooting by Dr Lazlo Antal. It is out of date as far as the hardware goes, but the best on the theory and instruction for basics and traditional one hand target shooting.

For two hand practical style shooting there was a small book by Martin Speirs (sp?). I don't remember the title on this one and I don't have my copy at hand. I am sure there are lots of others now but I haven't kept track.

;) (advice given to me by a captain of a national squad, "it doesn't really matter what you see, as long as you see the same thing every time!");)

Nice job! Thats damn good for a first trip to the range!

So the real question is why someone who previously spoke negatively about guns now wants one? Sport or fear?

David, good question. It is a couple of things. Ever since almost taking a 9mm slug back during my "lost years" I've been pretty terrified by guns. I also, as you note, have been pretty anti-gun during the past, and still hold some of those beliefs (eg assault weapons really aren't necessary for the average joe). But the more I learn about myself and the world, the more I change. Hopefully it is for the better, but I'm sure there are those that would disagree ;)

So part is to get past a very old and deep fear...I still was cringing at the range but I forced myself to stick it out. Part is that it is fun and a challenge, and part is that I have come to the realization that in the event of a large disaster, I am on my own to protect myself and my family (whatever that form is at the time), at least for some period of time. I have no visions of defeating the occasional burgular, etc...in that case I'll rely on my hands and/or my 34" Louiseville Slugger if need be. But in the event of civil unrest, I want to have a leg up.

Plus its fun to blow things up. And shooting is also very zen, although that perhaps seems incongruous.

AHHHH SOOOO Grasshopper....the fear was within yourself and not the gun....

I could go on and express my opinion as too how the fear works but won't.

Actually I wouldn't mind hearing it.

The conundrum here is that learning more Buddhist thought actually helped me get to the range. It is all about "leaning into the sharp points" in life. Fear is to be embraced rather than...well....feared. The terror is not in events or objects but rather in our perception and reaction to them. Fear is healthy and not to be avoided, but it is not to rule your life

WHAT, NO HEAD HITS! You are weak!


Just kiddings, nice grouping!

Oh yeah, before you buy... you MUST try a .357.
I went with the 9mm for the "firepower" and ease of finding ammo. While I do think it is a good round and I'm 99% sure if I hit a person in the chest with a 9mm hollow point it would put them down (God forbid).
After firing my friends .357 I wish I had got one of them.

Nice choice. You can use the .38 ammo for inexpensive shooting and the .357 for stopping power. The recoil on my 3" Ruger .357 snubby can be pretty harsh, but it's fun to shoot. If you do try the .357 mix up the .357 and .38 rounds to learn how to avoid the recoil of the .357.

Todd, personally I see you as a 1911 .45 ACP guy.

If you try a .357 I would start with a 6" barrel. Less kick+more accurate=more fun.

Interesting you mention Buddhism, I have studied that philosophy for awhile and I have read that devout Buddhist are vegetarian and refuse to harm insects.

Although most people are surprised that I as a devout Christian study Buddhism... and own a sports car... interesting how stereotypes fail so often.

Get a good rifle or shotgun if you are worried about S hitting the fan. More fun to shoot too :)

a 12 guage will be the other noisemaker. As for Buddhists, there is nothing that directly says you need to be vegetarian. But many interpret the "do not harm sentient beings" to include animals, hence not eating them. Interestingly in Tibet a lot of areas can't grow a lot of grains/vegetables, so meat is a staple. So you go with what you can eat...

So... anybody else bought, thinking about, or close to buying a firearm after reading this thread?

I'm getting close to a final decision;
Springfield Armory XD9
HK USP9
Glock 19
Para Hawg 9
Taurus Millenium Pro 9

Really down to the SA XD or the HK. I'm leaning towards the HK. Decided to go with the 9mm since I already have one and it will simplify ammo for the range.

Todd,
Good shooting! Try a Beretta 92FS 9mm, I bet you'll like that one, it's my favorite!