Why is campaign finance such an issue?
 

I don't understand the importance of this whole thing with Tom DeLay. I haven't been following it close enough to really understand the whole thing, but I know it has something to do with corporate $ being used to finance the campaign.

Are we as a nation so dumb that we vote for a guy based on how much money his campaign spent? How good his Superbowl commerical is? How his NASCAR team is doing?

Oh, wait, I just answered my own question... :D

Seriously though, is that all this is about. I'm inside the beltway and don't understand or care enough to understand it. How does the rest of country compare....

I don't care too much about it, unless it is a demacrook that is getting busted!;) :D

So you think: corporate money = evil?

Now we have the many hundred millionaire Corzine running away with the NJ govenors race and the multi-billionaire Bloomberg crushing the democrat (!) in the race for NYC mayor.

When all the campaign finance laws are enacted - and only the super rich can get elected - we will be sorry..

Because a Republican is in office...and Democrats are out of power...When Republicans are in power they are too cowardly to investigate Democrats, and when Democrats are in power they are too corrupt to investigate themselves.

Campaign Finance Reform created more corruption than it "fixed", it was lobbied for by "big-left-media," put forward by a lefty and a RINO...Smoke and mirrors...Exception made for Delay (where no scandal exists).

Yes, so far every study I know of says that is just about right. Asking the question puts you ahead of most of the electorate in critical thought.

If you have enough money, you can buy the State Representative seats. Once you have the State Reps, you can gerrymander your way to buying your National Senate Seats.

Despite what the faithful of the right will tell you, this IS important: It is alleged that money from outside of Texas was (illegally) spent to elect Republican State Representatives so they could redistrict to assure the election of Republican Senators.

MONEY CORRUPTS...

My belief is that most of our "elected" officials are bought and paid for.

We get to vote but THEY DO NOT REPRESENT US

There are a few exceptions but they are rare and mostly vilified by the rest

That is why it is incumbent, in self-defense, to vote for smaller government and less taxes.

Did you vote for Ross?

Last I saw him he was at the helm of huge speedboat in Bermuda w/ a SEG on his face.

He tried to do the right thing

Maybe John McC. will have better luck though he was raped the last time.

Problem is, Ross was a loon. If only we had real choices.

He wasn't in the center but he did have some good ideas

The only way McCainiac has a chance is if he joins the Democrat party...McCain is his own undoing, he raped himself by being absolutely off his rocker.

http://0cents.com/Merchant2/graphics...Republican.jpg

I would seriously consider McCain for my vote if he were put up for President. I kinda like the fact he does step to the tune all the time. Plus if you have ever heard of his actions as a POW it is seriously impressive stuff. Talk about character and integrity.

Whoops, make that DOESN'T step to the tune...

Please! McCain's the only guy around who can save the Republican asses by netting in the fence sitters.

If you haven't figured it out, the extreme conservative christian right-wing dogma, a la Dr. Dobson, has run its course. Many Repubs don't like the course Bush has put this country on and most of his agenda is based in conservative right policies.

Be that as it is, what's worse (for you guys) is McCain doesn't want to run...

Re: Why is campaign finance such an issue?
 

In short, yes. But I don't think it's so much being dumb, or confined to the US. Advertising works. Period. That's been proven over and over, time and time again, in relation to anything from selling consumer products to ideologies. Therefore, the guy with the biggest advertising budget will win. Coke doesn't spend hundreds of millions of dollars each year on advertising on the hopes that it might improve sales. They know for every dollar invested in advertising they'll make $1.20 back (or whatever the actual amount is). It's no different with political parties, and ALL parties know that.

It's long been my view that campaign financing by anybody, private, corporate, whatever, eats away at the very root of democracy.

Be a Dem judge in Brooklyn NYC for $20-50,000. Decide quickly before the game is over. There will be 10 open judicials open very soon.

Fund raising after the seat is acquired is ok and party supported.

Re: Re: Why is campaign finance such an issue?
 

I can only agree w/above if it's operation is as it's structured today.

Seems that if all contributions with the donor's name was posted on a web site by law there wouldn't be a prob?

No, I don't think you understood what I was saying. I'm saying that it's campaign financing which contributes to advertising which gets someone elected, rather than actually convincing your audience of your argument. Advertising can sell anything because it sells a complete package, rather than simply the product (most obvious example is selling sex with your beer). Campaign financing allows the party with the best advertising campaign to win, rather than the party with the best ideologies, strategies, plans, budgets, thoughts, ideas, etc. It *is* due in part to the fact that the average voter is uncritical of political advertisements, which in some cases can be attributed to lack of intelligence, but obviously there's more to it than that.

I think all political advertising should be illegal, and campaigning should be done solely through things like organized debates. And not slanderous trash-talking debates, but debates where candidates are forced to answer the questions asked, stay on topic, and not slander their opponents. Almost more like a trial :)

Obviously corporate money was important enough to DeLay that he was willing break federal law and launder it through his organizations.

He's possibly the biggest money-raiser in the Congress.

From WaPo:
Using corporate funds for state election purposes has long been illegal in Texas, as it is in 17 other states. Earle's probe of the contributions began after 17 Republicans who received the committee's funds were elected, giving the party control of the Texas House for the first time in 130 years. One year later, following a road map that DeLay and his political aides drafted from Washington, the Texas House approved a sweeping reorganization of the state's congressional district map meant to favor Republicans.

Then, in 2004, five more Texas Republicans were elected to Congress, enlarging the Republican majority in the House .

The facts of one of the central transactions at issue in the case have never been in dispute -- the transfer in September 2002 to an arm of the Republican National Committee in Washington of $190,000 in corporate funds collected by the committee in Texas and the subsequent donation by the RNC arm of $190,000 to seven Texas House candidates on Oct. 4, 2002


and link: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/09/28/AR2005092800270_pf.html

I was going to let this go until I just noticed you're from Canada.

So.. back on topic.
You're being logical. US politics has never been logical or civilized. As a matter of interest it's currently pretty mild compared to the US' early decades.

Imagine yourself at a location in the DMZ, everything is cool and you are on your way home. You hear John McCain was captured after crashing his second airplane and you feel for the guy. Hanoi is hell!...Imagine somehow the communist butchers got your position, you and 1,000 of your bros, nurses, brothers, sick and wounded...Imagine that they killed every one of you, slaughter, from napalm to just coming in and butchering every last person...Imagine it was John McCain who gave away your position, and a few other thousand American soldiers and South Vietnamese warriors.

John McCain is a traitor by definition of the UCMJ...There is nothing heroic about selling out your bros for your ass...Heros DO NOT do that...McCain stabbed his brothers in the back.

But, if your name is John McCain and your father and grandfather were famous admirals, violating the Code of Conduct by "aiding the enemy" translates into fodder for a political career, book deals, and adulation bordering on sainthood.

Even though news reports of McCain collaborating with the enemy continued from the time he was captured in 1967 through 1970, the Navy never considered prosecution as an option.

Instead, Pentagon pencil pushers chose a political spin that lifted McCain, the former POW turned U.S. Senator, up to a glorified pedestal where he sprouted a halo and wings and became America's "POW-hero" and today a presidential candidate.

No such luck for the two lowly "grunts."

http://www.usvetdsp.com/smith_mc.jpg
http://www.usvetdsp.com/smith_mc.htm

McCain must enjoy stabbing his bros in the back...In 2004 he stabbed them (Swift Boat Vets) in the back defending the traitor Kerry.

After the Democrats crucify him, sacrificing him to the god of political power, that is about all he will have for support, the fence sitters.

Thing is, there are many, many fence sitters these days; many more so, I would say, than Dems or Reps would like to say are "their people."

I know quite a few diehard Democrats who'd vote for McCain, and honestly, McCain is still a Republican.

Hence, better to have a hoarse voice to project party beliefs - Republican in this case - than no voice at all, don't you think?

Without the Republican base, McCain has squat...FYI...The base DO NOT like McCain AT ALL!...Put your money on it.

What Republican base? If any base exists, it's eroding day-by-day. In 2008, I bet you won't even recognize the Republican base.

Either side can't win without solid base support. McCain can't do that. Nowadays the Rep base is more organized than most realize. Not that I find that unusual. It was after all the organized Christian base that spread John Adams' writings challenging England. They do have a history.

that said the Dem base has no policy and no insight into the future. Hillary is gonna have her hands full. Big Bill was in NYC recently pumping a mayoral candidate. Probably paying back someone a favor.. meaning he's turned into a glorified water boy. So far Hillary has been doing great but she hasn't had to mess with the base yet.. party hearty.

lol...Right dd...You are paying way too much attention to Chris Matthews...If you REALLY want to know what Republicans think, listen to Rush Limbaugh...you may learn something, even open your mind a bit more.

"I think it was on the fourth day [after being shot down] that two guards came in, instead of one. One of them pulled back the blanket to show the other guard my injury. I looked at my knee. It was about the size of a football ... when I saw it, I said to the guard, 'O.K., get the officer' ... an officer came in after a few minutes. It was the man that we came to know very well as 'The Bug.' He was a psychotic torturer, one of the worst fiends that we had to deal with. I said, 'O.K., I'll give you military information if you will take me to the hospital.'" -- US News and World Report, May 14, 1973

Must have been some darned good info...He got kid-glove treatment...which suggests his "military information" must have panned out, i.e. good intel.

POS...Then, of course, there is the POW/MIA back-stabbing by McCain:

While a member of the Senate Select Committee on POW/MIA Affairs (1991-1993) he referred to POW/MIA Family Members and POW/MIA Activists as "whiners, vultures and the lunatic fringe."

McCainiac the traitor

Rush? No way. I thought you and I agreed to put our personal moratoriums on bad news media.

I used to be the guy in the basement at the Rep. Nat. Comm. who photocopied the checks like the one for $190k that DeLay is accused of telling the RNC to earmark for him. Yes really. The check was written by DeLay's PAC to RNSEC (Rep. Nat. State Elec. Comm.) and $190k is pretty small for those checks. The Wash. Post ran a photo of the check and it brought back a lot memories when I saw it. The reason we photocopied them was to back up our FEC reports. Remember, every penny of this stuff is publicy disclosed, so I don't see much opportunity for intentional malfeasance here. I was also the guy who often drove to the post office to deposit $250k-$500k at a time to cover the RNC's direct mail postage. So I have a little experience with how this stuff got divied up.

Unless some email or vm surfaces in which DeLay personally and explicitly told the RNC to redirect his PAC's funds to such and such candidates in TX, I don't see how any crime was committed. Furthermore, if a crime was committed, DeLay would not have been in a position to do it, since he isn't the guy who signs the RNC's checks. The RNC would be the guilty party here, IF they mixed the funds. But even if the RNC sent $190k in state money to some TX candidates DeLay supported, there's nothing illegal about it, as they keep state and federal money in separate accounts AND they are allowed to donate money to all levels of political races.

On another note, I am close to some folks in DeLay's office and have met DeLay many many times. I personally think he's a good guy, certainly a nice guy and nothing like the news describes him. They call him the Hammer, but he's pretty friendly, though unapologetic in his views. Dems hate him because he ALWAYS wins and ALWAYS outfoxes them. If you heard some of the staffers' horror stories about the infighting between Pelosi and Hoyer and how inefficiently their side runs their leadership posts, and you're a Dem, you'd hate DeLay even more because he's so much more effective than the opposition.

As for campaign finance reform, I think it's outrageous that any limits exist at all. The Supreme Court ruled long ago that money equals speech. Now that McCain/Feingold is law, the government restricts who and how people can criticize politicians in their ads. Does anyone think that's right? Does anyone think someone running for Senate in CA should have to abide by the same spending limits as someone running RI? The gov't. should get out of it altogether.

House seats, House Members.

Gerrymandering?? How? I don't think so. The legislature is supposed to redistrict House, Senate and Congressional lines every 10 years, they did not in 2001. The then House speaker wasn't going to allow it. Since the legislature didn't draw any new maps, it was the duty of the Leglislative Redistricting Board. The LRB is composed of the lieutenant governor, speaker of the house, attorney general, comptroller, and land commissioner, it was created by constitutional amendment in 1951. The board had a 4-1 Republican majority, the new Texas Senate and House plans that were adopted received a 3-2 vote. The LRB didn't have constitutional authority to draw new congressional lines.

The Republicans then took control of the House and Senate after the 2002 electons under the LRB plans. They then exercized their constitutional duty to draw new lines for Congress during the 2003 legislative session. Well the democrats didn't like that much, so, like panzies, they ran to New Mexico (Senators), and Oklahoma (House Members) on two separte occasions to avoid a vote in their respective chambers. Finally, a deal was compromised, and a new map was enacted.

On another note, Congressional redisticting in 1991 didn't change much from the previous map. Essentually, Texas was electing members to Congress from districts that had not been redrawn since 1981.

For all those years, especially 2001, there had been protection of several democrat US House seats. How can it be that Martin Frost always gets reelected when everyone around him votes republican? Frosty has a big democrat base with a little finger that shot up and grabed him, and his neighbors. It wasn't just his district either. Complete gerrymandering!! With the new lines, the percentage numbers actually grew closer. The "plan" was actually drawn as a 19-13 R majority map. The R's actually only picked up 4 seats, Ralph Hall had already switched parties.

To the victor goes the spoils, and if you look at data, the numbers don't lie, Texans were voting republican. All the statewide races have been swept by the republicans since 1998. Poke around and have a look for yourself. http://www.tlc.state.tx.us/redist/redist.htm

Back in 2001, when the LRB was meeting, you never heard nor saw of Tom DeLay. It wasn't until 2003 that he started licking his chops, and became a popular specticle around the pink granite building here in Austin. Earle is a pissed off man b/c of the results after redistricting, and this is simply a publicity stunt. He tried, but couldn't pin it on any other republicans, so he went after DeLay. Earle's son is running for a state House of Reps. seat by the way.:rolleyes:

so where is Mul these days?:D