Leaving a job a month before bonus payout...what can one do?

MotoSook · 10-30-2007, 05:34 AM

The company bonus program is pretty lucrative, and the past year's performance of the company has exceeded the performance targets. With a month to go before the bonus is paid out, can a departing employee do anything to get some of the bonus?

Rick Lee · Rick Lee's Garage

I'd be sure to stay until you get it, unless you're getting more for starting somewhere else before then.

mikester · 10-30-2007, 05:48 AM

Nope...been there done that.

I used to get a pretty hefty bonus at a company I worked for...it was hard to leave but I managed to use that income number in future negotiations resulting in a higher overall salary. So now my salary basically includes that bonus in a way. But...4 weeks man...If your new employer can't wait for you the questions are is the new job so good that another one like it can't be found?

Lots of hard questions on it, my general advise is to never give more than 2 weeks notice. Maybe make up a little excuse to stay that is reasonable for the new employer (assuming you haven't already accepted). Maybe something like you had some classes that obligate you to the current employer for X number of months and you only have 1 month left or you have to pay the whole chunk back. Generally I'm not for lying but there are occasions where you may be required to bend a little.

My most recent employer waited patiently for me for an extra 2 weeks after the job offer. I was waiting for an educational benefit to pay out at the employer I planned on leaving. It was a few thousand and I had been fighting for it for a few months. The fact that I had to fight for the benefit itself (paperwork, numerous phone calls, redo the paperwork, etc) was a major reason I left the first company to begin with.

MotoSook · 10-30-2007, 05:52 AM

RL - the subject has an offer for higher pay for a higher profile (better future) position, a signing bonus to help offset the loss of the bonus (but not all of the loss). The loss in bonus (net $ at the end of the year between the two situations) is not huge, and over time the net difference is negligeble. However, this has been a really good year for the departed company with a large contribution be the departing employee. Without being overly greedy, and demanding a portion of the bonus, how could the subject see any of the bonus for the departed company?

Rick Lee · Rick Lee's Garage

I don't know what the law says, but I've never received any kind of bonus other than $50 AMEX gift check. I would think bonuses are only for current employees. Seems to me they're gravy and not exactly salary or commission.

MotoSook · 10-30-2007, 05:59 AM

Mike- the subject had a conscience conflict and decided that leaving a week after the payout was a bit shady. Although the new emplyer was willing to wait, the subject negotiated for more if the subject left before bonus payout. It was a good ploy and will have better returns in the coming years at the new job.

Subject is now having another conscience conflict..and would like to see a little of the bonus from the departed company.

MotoSook · 10-30-2007, 06:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rick Lee

I don't know what the law says, but I've never received any kind of bonus other than $50 AMEX gift check. I would think bonuses are only for current employees. Seems to me they're gravy and not exactly salary or commission.

Funny thing is that the company management expects key employees to work over time (at least 10 hrs/wk) without pay, or what ever it takes to meet cclient deadlines. In a consulting environment, this is like the emplyee giving money away after 40 hrs. The company continues to bill after 40 hours while the employee is dangled a bonus carrot. Performance and deadlines fall on the key employee's shoulders.

einreb · 10-30-2007, 06:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Souk

Mike- the subject had a conscience conflict and decided that leaving a week after the payout was a bit shady. Although the new emplyer was willing to wait, the subject negotiated for more if the subject left before bonus payout. It was a good ploy and will have better returns in the coming years at the new job.

Subject is now having another conscience conflict..and would like to see a little of the bonus from the departed company.

i know what your saying... do the OT and expect to get paid, but thats not how it works. nothing wrong with leaving a week after payout. actually... nothing wrong with cashing the check and leaving then. its a bonus. right to work/right to not work state.

i cant see ever paying out for a bonus leaving prior to it being given. i saw a couple guys ask for it when i worked in the consulting engineering biz and they expected to be 'pro rated' their bonus and the owners said no way. i would do the same thing in the owners shoes.... matter of fact, i think a better idea (as an 'owner' now) is to hold back bonuses until several months after the year ends. it keeps folks around and then they are already a few months into the new year.

DByers · 10-30-2007, 06:20 AM

Souk, Seems as if you have already made a choice. If the bonus was that important you would have stayed at a job you did not want to be in anymore. Your new employer has made it worth your while to leave your current situation. Forget about the "bonus" as you are moving t greener pastures.

Quote:

Funny thing is that the company management expects key employees to work over time (at least 10 hrs/wk) without pay, or what ever it takes to meet cclient deadlines. In a consulting environment, this is like the emplyee giving money away after 40 hrs. The company continues to bill after 40 hours while the employee is dangled a bonus carrot. Performance and deadlines fall on the key employee's shoulders.

This is a way to pay you less! If you were paid overtime your bonus would become part of your overall compensation and they would by law have to go back and issue you a check for the difference of the overtime $ at your new rate. This is a wrong and they know it. They will always say that overtime is not required so the employee willingly works with out compensation because the love the company that much.?! It is better your moving on.

By the way, hows life?

MotoSook · 10-30-2007, 06:30 AM

Even more funny, they asked the subject to give additional week(s) before leaving as the handoff of work won't be easy, and clients will surely be disappointed. Subject said no unless they made it worth the extended time.

It isn't uncommon for companys to award bonus payouts, then hold off a few months to pay.

Bernie - consulting company owners are greedy jackasses

Dan - things have been hell. It's been a hectic yr. I got married and we are expecting a child in May. Hopefully, next year will be better

We need to catch up.

RickM · RickM's Garage

It's one thing leaving voluntarily and losing a bonus. How about getting layed off a month before?

Most companies clearly outline the formula and terms of a bonus in the employment agreement. Other than toughing it out there's not much one can do. It's typical to see mass exoduses from corps in the weeks following bonus time.

stomachmonkey · 10-30-2007, 06:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Souk

Mike- the subject had a conscience conflict and decided that leaving a week after the payout was a bit shady. Although the new emplyer was willing to wait, the subject negotiated for more if the subject left before bonus payout. It was a good ploy and will have better returns in the coming years at the new job.

Subject is now having another conscience conflict..and would like to see a little of the bonus from the departed company.

Staying an extra week to collect a bonus based on the PREVIOUS years performance is not shady in my book. Especially since new employer was willing to wait. It was earned so it was deserved.

Since new employer has conceded to make good for the loss of income then subject has what he has coming to him.

Getting a deal from new employer that compensates for lost income from old employer and then still trying to get something from old employer rubs me the wrong way. If I was new employer and got wind of it I'd seriously rethink the hire.

Subject sounds like they are being greedy.

Sorry, just the way I see it.

Was working for a company in bad financial shape.

Was basically counseling my staff to find new employment ASAP.

One guy gets a great new gig, lot more money, more prestigious etc...

He wanted to stay for 3 weeks instead of 2 so he could qualify for an additional 2 weeks vacation pay. The company had no cap on accrued time so the guy was looking at 5-6 weeks vacation pay.

I told him "don't be stupid, it's not worth it, do the two weeks and go."

He did not listen, stayed 3 weeks, on Friday of the 3rd week (his last day) the company announced bankruptcy.

The guy lost ALL the vacation pay PLUS the last 2 weeks pay.

Bulls and Bears make money.

Pigs get slaughtered.

Rot 911 · 10-30-2007, 07:00 AM

If bonuses are not part of a contract, but something an employer can choose to give, they have complete discretion to decide who gets one and who doesn't. Souk, go enjoy your new job.

CRH911S · 10-30-2007, 07:50 AM

A conscious conflict this day and age? Souk, this kind of indecision is a sign of weakness. Stay the week and collect your share of the kill. Simple survival...is all it is. Good luck at your new job and future hunts.

Super_Dave_D · Super_Dave_D's Garage

The company I work for has it written that if you leave for any reason before the check is actually in your hands - then you are not getting it (or something like that).

MotoSook · 10-30-2007, 08:41 AM

Guys, the deal was done and over well before this thread was started. The subject was honest and fair with the departed company and the new employer.

Something about consulting companies is that they are not always about the employee. They might have the right intention when it comes to employees, but in the end the mighty dollar is more important.

I think I'll start looking for a new job now since everyone was telling me to go enjoy my new job

the · 10-30-2007, 10:28 AM

You have to read the agreement/policy to see what the rules are. Most of the time, bonuses are "not earned until paid." Which means if you aren't there to collect it, you aren't going to get it.

As to moral conflict, I don't think there is any. If you are there when you collect the bonus, you've earned it. It's for your work done up to that time, not future work. Stay, collect the bonus, then head to a new job.

Rick Lee · Rick Lee's Garage

FWIW, I had a previous employer try to get out of paying my commission for deals that I had closed before I left, but not yet been paid on and even a few that closed after I left, but I had still continued to work on until they closed.

Boss's excuse was I didn't give two weeks notice. I replied, "Who the hell gives two weeks notice for a 100% commission job?" I called the VA State Employment Commission and they reminded me VA is an at-will state and commissioned employees have to be paid on deals they originated, no matter long after termination they close. I called the HR boss and left an angry voicemail, mentioning "wage complaint with the State Emp. Commission." Not 20 min. later I got a call from a lawyer in HR asking me where I would like the check mailed.

MRM · 10-30-2007, 10:44 AM

Usually bonus plans are written so that anyone employed on ___ date receives the bonus. Sometimes there's a provision that if you are there six months or more you get part of the bonus prorated. You need to check discretely with HR to find out how your bonus program works.

A law firm in town pays out its partnership distribution at the end of the first half - based on the previous year's profits. To leave any way other than retirement means that you lose the bonus that would go with at least six months' work.

When I left to start my own firm I waited until the bonus check was in my hand. It got paid out at the end of the first quarter so I planned around leaving sometime after April 1. The check came a week or so early, so there was a small interval between the checks being handed out and me leaving, but no one batted an eye. As a result, my new firm was founded on April 15.

AMG · 06-06-2011, 09:20 AM

I have a variation of the question. Our fiscal year ends June 30 and I have already made my goals to entitle me to my year end commission. I am planning to leave this company and start a new job July 5. I wanted to give 3 weeks notice to give my current company a long transition time, but could they fire me early do I don't get my commissions? There is no early-out clause in my contract. Should I just give 2 weeks notice to be safe?