Why is Rice Burners/Ebay Thread Closed?

Natchamp · 07-10-2001, 07:11 PM

Why is this thread closed? I think its an interesting topic (is Pcar related) and good discussion material. No one should take offense to other peoples opinions.

My short 2 cents (without going into detail)is this:

Greg, I totally agree with you.

Enamuel, You just don't get it.

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Mark
The Beast
mark@hargett.com

stray15 · stray15's Garage

It got moved to the OFF TOPIC room.

Porsche, through and through
Tim
'83 944
http://community.webshots.com/user/strayer15

http://www.geocities.com/tstray15/Home.html

Natchamp · 07-10-2001, 07:30 PM

Well that show's how up to date I am, I didn't even know there was such a thing.

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Mark
The Beast
mark@hargett.com

Greg-slant/cab · 07-10-2001, 09:03 PM

I did not either.

mideastmafia · 07-10-2001, 09:12 PM

that is exactly why the offtopic forum sucks. no one knows about it and no one takes the time to check.

SHAUN

911pcars · 07-10-2001, 09:19 PM

I think we got off the subject a tad as one of Greg's points was about bashing other Porsches, then it sequed into a Ricer thing.

Case in point. There was a recent, long thread about the two SC's in the latest issue of Excellence. I didn't receive mine until the other day (seems like us west coast guys are last on the delivery list), so the only comments I could add at the time was some speculation as why there seemed to be animosity toward these two gentlemen.

After reading the article the other day, I just didn't have the feeling these guys were flaunting their wealth. I think it was just another reporting angle by David Colman, whom I admire for his many articles on Porsches. Colman merely stated what the cost was for these modifications. I didn't see anything unusual here except the fact these guys somewhat sheepishly admitted to spending more than they had expected. If every article divulged the build budget, we'd be used to it by now. Some don't volunteer that information, some aren't asked in the first place.

Don't we all fall into that overspending category to a certain extent? Sure, these guys had a sizeable budget, but I'm sure it's not that far beyond what many Porsche owners (and PP forum participants) have spent on their hobby. Serious concours participants, I'm sure, spend many, many thousands of dollars. There were some fabulous RGruppe cars in attendance at Cambria that had serious dollars (and work) invested; and if it wasn't necessarily the owner's own sweat and blood, it's was someone elses, but paid for by that particular Gruppster.

Those of us who perform some of our own mechanicals save some money. Has anyone added up the hundreds, thousands of hours you spend on your car? It adds up, especially at $$70-80/hr, but we don't keep track of the manhours nor do we pay for it (with cash anyway). Now if you're not as mechanically inclined or are fortunate enough to have it done professionally, then the labor cost is directly translated into a form one can record and archive for your heirs and writers of Porsche articles.

So what is it that makes us feel so superior because the guy's real Ebay/RS doesn't look like one, then we proceed to call him an ******* before we know the whole story, then Cris tells us that it's real with circumstances. Man, we were quick to jump on this guy's case (not Cris, he's not an *******). I've seen it too with other threads; the mirror isn't period correct, the ride height is too high/too low, I hate the paint color, wrong engine in wrong car, what is it with the headlight washers? etc. etc.. All in all, it doesn't make me feel too comfortable when there's so much of a "quick-to-judge" atmosphere lurking under our common car interest. Perhaps the only way to remain out of scrutiny is to keep that sucker stock as it came from the factory, then no one could complain; "make sure it doesn't have too controversial of a color" (never mind you had a more favorite color in mind), and "forget about bolting on those 7x15's as they weren't available from the factory until a year later."

Do you know what one of our esteemed Porshe gurus said about chrome/polished Fuchs? "They look too la la land or ethnic." What's that all about?

The above words might seem like I'm hyperventilating. Sorry if it seems that way; I'm really not. Now what was it about those ricers?

Sherwood Lee
I'll leave out the link this time :-)

tchanson · 07-11-2001, 07:39 AM

Well stated, Sherwood. I was also somewhat mystified at the apparent "nannyism" of some of the posts re the two SC's in the latest issue of Excellence. Who exactly is the arbiter of what constitutes "too much money" spent on a car? Where is that line? It seemed from that thread that the answer was "any amount greater than I did or would spend".

The owners stated that they had built exactly what they wanted. They're happy. More power to them. Its their money. Would I expend a similar amount if I owned an SC? Probably not, but that doesn't make these two guys people "with more money than brains". Just different priorities, maybe.

I don't think that the amounts spent are all that unusual when you get into the realm of serious mods/engine/paintwork, etc. Additionally, the expenditures are never a lump sum..."Gee, I think I'll buy an SC for $70K!". Instead, as we all know, one thing leads to another, and to another until an amazing stack of receipts has been accumulated. The difference in this article seems to be the inclusion of the costs, which is not the common practice in Excellence feature articles.

Do the costs make sense? Objectively, of course not. But 911's, as many other things, are in large part about emotion. Its like attempting to do a cost/benefit economic analysis on your children. They're expensive, contribute little in the way of household work and do not add to the revenue stream. Thus, why would anyone have them since they obviously make no fiscal sense?:-)

[This message has been edited by tchanson (edited 07-11-2001).]

911pcars · 07-11-2001, 08:29 AM

I really like your analogy with our offspring. In fact, I did do a cost-benefit analysis and came up with a solution. I've decided to discourage our children from reading to save on college costs. They're outside right now practicing oil and filter changes. Next is valve adjustment. :-)

BTW, why has this thread been relegated to the outlands of this forum .... again? Do these comments offend the populace? I did mention the P-word didn't I? I didn't notice the prior discussion on Excellence and twin SC's "making" it this far. Moderator... what are your comments?

Sherwood Lee

Z-man · Z-man's Garage

Quote:

Originally posted by 911pcars:
...BTW, why has this thread been relegated to the outlands of this forum .... again? Do these comments offend the populace? I did mention the P-word didn't I? I didn't notice the prior discussion on Excellence and twin SC's "making" it this far. Moderator... what are your comments?

Sherwood Lee

First off, I did not move this here, but that said, the Off-topic forum is NOT a place to put all offensive and objectionable content: it's a place for all types of off-topic discussions (Please see Off-topic forum guidelines thread). Seeing that the title had more to do with rice and ebay than Porsches, and why a topic was moved, that's probably why it was moved here. The thread did evolve back to something 'Porsche' related, but that's ok too: discussing Porsche stuff in Off Topic won't get you banned.

That said, regarding the topic at hand: a rule of thumb I have in life is this: "Maximize the fun, minimize the cost." I recently purchased a 944S2 that cost me about 1/5 of what a new Boxster costs, but performance wise, it can probably do about 85% of what a Boxster can do. (No offense to the Boxster owners: after all that is my favorite car, period.

)

But for some people, the pursuit of a quest, the journey to automotive nirvana, involves creating a fantastic car. This involves $$ that will probably never be recouped. And that's ok. I have the greatest respect for people who are willing to go the extra mile and dollar to get everything done just right.
And to those who have such pursuits, I say: "More power to ya. When you get bored with it, and wish to sell it, give me a call."

Just my $0.42.
-Zoltan.

[This message has been edited by Z-man (edited 07-11-2001).]

whitemike_04 · 07-11-2001, 10:48 PM

mixing rice with porsche is the ish!!! You guyz dont know what u missin!!!

911pcars · 07-11-2001, 11:53 PM

Thanks for your thoughts Zoltan, but when you say, "Please see Off-topic forum guidelines thread", I failed to find the guidelines. Can you direct me to this location?

You mean this was moved to Off-Topics just because a thread title was named one thing, but the discussion was actually about Porsches? I suggest the moderator look a little closer as to the actual discussion rather than just the title. I've wandered over to many a mysterious topic only to find out they're talking about something else. And yet the "off-topic" remained on the "technical" forum. Please explain.

In addition, there was no explanation why this was moved. The off-topics area is not well-traveled by regular contributors, so the ideas discussed here are pretty much lost and not available for valued input by many forum participants.

Sherwood Lee

911pcars · 07-11-2001, 11:57 PM

Okay, I found the off-topics forum thread. However, this doesn't explain how threads get moved over here in the first place (no offense). I'll try asking at the tech forum.

Sherwood

Z-man · Z-man's Garage

Quote:

Originally posted by 911pcars:
Thanks for your thoughts Zoltan, but when you say, "Please see Off-topic forum guidelines thread", I failed to find the guidelines. Can you direct me to this location?

You mean this was moved to Off-Topics just because a thread title was named one thing, but the discussion was actually about Porsches? I suggest the moderator look a little closer as to the actual discussion rather than just the title. I've wandered over to many a mysterious topic only to find out they're talking about something else. And yet the "off-topic" remained on the "technical" forum. Please explain.

In addition, there was no explanation why this was moved. The off-topics area is not well-traveled by regular contributors, so the ideas discussed here are pretty much lost and not available for valued input by many forum participants.

Sherwood Lee

The moving of the thread was a judgement call. Bear in mind that the 911 forum is primarily a "Technical Forum." Whether the thread should have been moved or not is a matter of opinion, IMO! Anyway, at least more people are now aware of the OT forum.
Although the thread did involve Porsches, it really wasn't too technical in nature.

I don't believe this version of UBB has a way to indicate that a thread has been moved, but most moderators indicate this in the thread by stating: "Moving to off-topic" or "Moving to whatever-forum."

I often check the 914 and 911 forums even though I don't own either...yet...

Although the OT forum may not have alot of technical information, I am sure that as it's popularity grows, it will have many interesting and even controversial threads.
This forum was created to allow users to contribute non-technical threads without crowding up the technical forums with non-tech information. I know: now you gotta check another forum: but it's only a click or two away.

So spread the word, and have fun!
Hope I answered your questions,
-Zoltan.

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My toy: http://www.pelicanparts.com/gallery/Z-man

[This message has been edited by Z-man (edited 07-12-2001).]