Tell Me About Reloading Ammunition
 

Tell me about reloading.

I'm starting to wince at the cost of shooting .45 cal. A day at the range, 150 rounds, and I've spent $40. I'm trying to go 3X week now and the cost is really adding up.

Either I need to (1) make more money, (2) reload, (3) switch to .22LR, or (4) shoot less.

1 and 4 I'd say!

I've given a lot of thought to this...my .44 mag is costing me tons, and it's damn hard to find wadcutters other than online.

Get a Progressive Reloading press...for reloading 45 Acp.

I've reloaded for many years, but mostly for rifles to achieve either velocity increases, or for additional accuracy with custom tailored rounds, or both. I wouldn't hesitate to reload for hunting purposes, still do in fact.

Handguns are a different deal. First, you shoot a lot more generally unless you shoot a rifle competitively. I think that a progressive reloading press makes a lot of sense for pistol shooters, in very short time you'll recover your initial outlay of cash for the press, dies, and so forth.

Buy several good reloading manuals first. I have them from Sierra, Speer, Hornady, and Nosler and a few others. I have some more than 30 years old, but I buy new ones to keep up with current powders and ballistics. These manuals contain a wealth of information on what you need to get started, and of course safety information. Reloading is not risk free, but you probably knew that.

The one thing that I don't reload for is self defense. The actual ammo that I use, no matter whether shotgun, rifle, or handgun; for self defense is factory loaded only. The rate of failure to fire with factory ammo is one in several million, or better. That is never true with reloads, no matter how careful you are. I view self defense firearms as life support equipment, and I demand as close to 100% reliability as I can get for it.

I've done a lot of reloading. Once you become a smart shopper, it can cut your ammo costs by about 2/3. I mainly reloaded .44 mag and .45 ACP.

Before you go dropping cash on the press, dies, scales, etc., why is it costing you $40 for 150 rounds? You can get that much ammo at Wal Mart ofr $30 and get it on www.lancerammo.com for about $22. Buy a batch of 1000 rounds from Lancer and see how it goes.

Depending on wha kind of .45 you have, you may be able to buy the cheap lead semi-wadcutters, which punch a perfectly round, crisp hole in paper targets. It doesn't feed very well in some guns. The trade off with smooth-feeding ball ammo is it tears the targets and makes your groups a little harder to see.

If you get a modern reloading set up and really learn to crank them out, you can make huge batches of ammo for little money. My dad put me to work on our assembly line on our kitchen table when I was about 6 yrs. old. I'm just too lazy now and don't have the space for it in my tiny house.

That's why I shoot a 9mm at the range, the ammo is cheap and I like my Beretta 92FS and (soon to be) Sig P239, both in 9mm.

Pat is right. Don't use homemade stuff for self-defense. Until this past Thanksgiving, my dad insisted on keeping the batch of hollowpoints he and I probably made 25 yrs. ago in his night table .45. I finally bought him a box of Federal Hydr Shoks and insisted he give me that old ammo and keep my factory stuff. A few days later I went to the range to shoot that old ammo. Guess what....in a clip of seven I had two failures to feed (FTF). The lead tips had become so coarse or pourous over the years that they were like sandpaper on my SIG's feed ramp and hung up. If a SIG P220 won't feed it, it needs to be thrown away. Thank God he never had to use that old ammo to save his life.

Besides, ammo is cheap. Life is expensive!

$40 is $10 range fee, $30 for three boxes of ammo. You're right, I could save some money buying in bulk. Thanks for the Lancer link. I'm also going to the next gun show to see what they have. Even in bulk, I think it'll still cost like 18-20 cents/round for hardball.

My current 1911 won't feed SWC; I'm going to insist that my next one does.

Someone told me he reloads his .45 IPSC ammo for 6.7 cents/round. That got my attention.

I don't have the space for it just now, but I'm interested in reloading as soon as I can clear out some space.

I just don't trust old ammo. I recently fired some 9mm hardball that had been sitting around for over 10 years. Out of about 25 rounds, I had two squibs.

1911's can sometimes be made to feed SWC's pretty well. You just have to have the feed ramp polished by a gunsmith. Newer 1911'a probably have this done at the factory. On my old Commander, I had to have it done by a pro.

Rick, this is my Detonics w/ 3 1/2" bbl. The feed ramp is already polished. I'm not hopeful . . .

I've had good results with the Lancer stuff in 9mm. I buy 1K rounds at a time. I looked at .45ACP prices and that's one reason I stuck with 9mm for the second Sig. I think I need a p220 though...but the next one will be a Mosquito so I can hve *really* cheap days at the range. I've got a year membership at two local ranges (same ownership) so each visit is "free" (ie I can go as much as I can afford ammo for). But the .22LR prices are really attractive...

You can get .22 inserts to fit in your .45. This would save some money as the .22 stuff is cheaper. I reloaded some a few years back to save money. The .357, .44, and rifle cartidges seemed to save me the most.

I shot lead a few times, but would not load to lower velocities to hopefully lead the barrel less. Once I loaded the jacketed stuff, the gun seemed easier to clean after a session and that became my normal mode of operation.

I still have the reloader, but have not used it in several years.
If you decide you want one of these, email me. They have a no BS lifetime warranty.

http://dillonprecision.com/template/p.cfm?maj=24&dyn=1&cookieClean=1

Another option:
http://www.natchezss.com/ammo.cfm?contentID=productDetail&ammoRecID=2&brand =ZY&prodID=ZYSBA04501&CFID=1804042&CFTOKEN=1891890 7

If you find Wolf ammo works for you (some people complain that it's too dirty; I've shot a good bit of Wolf's 9mm without problems):
http://www.natchezss.com/ammo.cfm?contentID=productDetail&ammoRecID=2&brand =DZ&prodID=DZ45FMJ&CFID=1804042&CFTOKEN=18918907

Or Fiocchi, it's good and inexpensive: http://www.aimsurplus.com/acatalog/copy_of__45acp.html

Can I hijack the tread to explore the .22 options? To late....

I was looking at some of the Ruger .22s for target shooting. Any opinions on these guns?

John, I have a Dillon Square Deal B almost new which I don't use anymore. I think that has .38 Super dies, but I should have the .45 ACP dies somewhere.

I was a 100 rounds a day 6 days a week type of person, reloading is the only way to go.

Let me know if you want it. Is your for the cost of postage.

My Ruger Mark II was my first gun; I can't say anything bad about it. I did get a blued one, but am planning on getting one in stainless steel eventually.

I love my Bearcat, but some people don't like the small size.

I have Ruger's SP101 in 9mm and plan on getting one in 22lr eventually too.

Ditto that! I can't get to the range as much as I'd like, but when I go I typically do 100rds through whatever I've brought, plus at least 200rds of 22LR through the Ruger MKII! Point is the 22LR is a lot of fun and so cheap that it's a no-brainer to bring it along every time. I've got a bunch of the Federal bulk 525rd boxes which are <$12! Even the upper quality stuff is like $3/100rds.

Personally I don't see reloading as a viable option for me unless/until I get to the point of shooting a LOT of large-caliber and/or powder-charge loadings [$1/rd starts to add up quickly], and also am comfortable with the lead and chemical exposure aspects...

(Disclosure: ATK is one of my customers so I don't mind buying their brands/products, which happen to be great ones IMO)

Jordi, I sent you a PM.

I tried a friend's Ruger at the range last week. Long bull-barreled stainless "Government Target" model, $525 on Ruger's website. It was very nice. Really nice trigger, practically no recoil, nice sights, grip had a thumb shelf, did about a 2" group at 25 yd. I am positive the pistol will group much better than that.

Another friend had one of the 4" barrel blued ones, 15 years ago, and I don't recall liking that one too much. This one was so much nicer.

commercially loaded .45 isnt too bad, but if you shoot A LOT (like Jordi said) you are definitely going to save some money by handloading. Its senseless not to reload for things like .38 super, 10mm, or 9x23.

.22 and .45 are two worlds apart. I will probably get one of those Ruger auto .22's one of these days, but don't get all confident because you can get 1" groups with one of them and then think you'll be like that with a .45 in a life or death situation. Since I CCW all my SIG's, I am very serious about being super competent with all of them in their original calibers. My two .357 SIG's are getting expensive to shoot since I live walking distance from the NRA HQ range. But a box of .40S&W ammo (when ordered in bulk) is only about $.75 cheaper than .357SIG. So it would take a LOT of shooting in .40 to make the $100 or so back I'd have to spend on a .40 barrel.

Nostatic, I have the nicest P220 around and have put many thousands of rounds through it in the last 10 yrs. Get one. You won't regret it. .45 is a super platform. I'm building my own 1911 now too.

BTW, if anyone is interested (through their FFL, of course), I'll soon be selling two .22 revolvers. One is a stainless Ruger single action bicentennial edition and the other is a blued S&W double action with a super light trigger.

A rangemaster at our local range summed it up well, I think. When I asked him about reloading, he replied that the cost per round will go way down, while the number of rounds fired will go way up. In other words, saving money is a good way to sell a reloading bench to your wife, but actual money savings may not happen. ;)

I received an RCBS single stage press for a wedding present many, many moons ago, and reload everything I shoot except the .22's. I can see the advantage of buying bulk for the more popular rounds, but it's not possible for my 45LC and I can load all I want to shoot in the 44mag for a whole lot less.

I will be getting back into a semi-auto soon, probably a 45 or 40, but even then I imagine I will reload for them as well - I just like to tinker with loads too much.

Anyone here have any experience reloading .357SIG? How does that work with the tapered neck?

I dunno, I'm getting frustrated with live ammo guns. I'm thinking of switching to BB guns. Something like this

http://www.pipersprecisionproducts.com/

Its not supposed to work very well at all. I entertained the idea soon after the cartridge came out and dropped it quickly after I read about how the brass didnt last very long and the case mouths split real easily. Its an over pressured cartridge built on too weak of a case. Worse than .40 S&W in those respects. It works well in smaller subcompact autos, but Im not a fan of the round in general.

If you want a 125gr bullet w/.357 ballistics out of an auto, try a 9x23. The case is basically chopped .223 rifle brass. Factory ammo can be tough to find at times, but the brass will last. Its also a real hoot at the range.

Well, I can't change the fact that two of my SIG's fire .357SIG, so I need the ammo. I bought a batch of 500 from Georgia Arms, which I believe to be reloaded brass and had not a single problem with any of them. I want to get a .40 barrel, but the savings on ammo doesn't offset the cost of the barrel until after around 7000 rounds.

In the past, I've annealed cases to prevent case mouth splitting. It's pretty easy, and low tech.

You might want to go as far as getting a sizing die custom fitted to your gun, but I see you have more than one, so perhaps that won't work. I see one other issue, trapped sizing lube denting the shoulder, not too bad, that straigtens out on firing if not too extensive. Care with the lube will help.

Pat, what do you shoot it from? Not related to the mouth cracking issue so much, but out of curiosity, how long before before the brass starts to bulge at the shoulder and become questionable?

Bottle necked cases, and my experience with them is only in rifles, stretch just a bit above the web, which is just above the extractor groove. Since rifle cases are much longer, you can probably use them longer, but then again they operate at much higher pressures than even a .357 Sig, so maybe that's not an issue. With a rifle case, you measure its length, and when it gets to the safe maximum, you trim the case back to the minimum length, or close to it. Typically, rifle cases can be fired at least five times, and trimmed once. The brass at the web thins out, and the case splits there, you can see it sometimes as a smile like on a golf ball. Cases like the .30-30 Winchester that head space on the rim can be used longer, but I don't know how much longer.

I have used Dillon presses for the last 15 years. First was a 650 and last one was a 550. Best in the industry and are guaranteed for life. If you ever have a problem or issue with them, send them back and they will be completely overhauled FOR FREE for LIFE!

Its easy, just be careful and do it with no distractions. DO NOT SMOKE while doing it and no hoards of kids running through the area. Its easy to make a mistake when that happens. Make sure that your reloader has a powder check so if something happens and you double charge a load, its senses it and you stop.

Well worth your time and money.

JoeA

John, if your .45 is on a 1911 platform, you can use one of the Ciener or Kimber kits to convert it to a .22. Or just buy a .22; one can never own too many guns. Unless you see reloading as a hobby unto itself it will quickly turn into just another chore. There are two kinds of reloading shooters out there - those who reload so they can shoot, and those who shoot so they can reload. That's a bit of an exageration, but suffice to say if you do no have an equal interest in the reloading, you should probably look at other options.

I've been reloading ammo my entire life. I started with an old Lymann nutcracker loading stuff for my dad's .45 Colt. After awhile he even "let" me cast bullets for it. By the time I was a teenager I had sworn the whole thing off; it was too much like work. I picked it up again in my early 20's for my own enjoyment, and to feed some oddball calibers for which commercial ammo is not available. That's where I'm at today; reloading oddball stuff as the only means to make it go "bang". The scrounging components, playing with different bullet molds, and stuff like that keeps me interested. If I were just feeding an ammo-hungry auto pistol I would be buying bulk stuff from the sources these guys mention.

If it looks like something that may interest you, by all means give it a go. It sounds like you have a line on one of the best progressive presses around. The guys that I know that use them tend to be competitive shooters, like IPSC, traditional 2700 bullseye, or whatever. They demand lots of high quality ammo and can only get it if they make it themselves. They love those Dillons, that's for sure. On the other hand, the non-competitive shooters, the "plinkers", that start reloading purely for the cheap ammo usually give it up and go back to the bulk stuff. It works great for what they like to do. So, give it a try and see what you think. I think it's fun in its own right. You may or may not; time will tell.