My sons first car? YIKES!!!!
 

My son is getting his driving permit. He'll have his license in September. He's an extremely good kid. Never been is any trouble, gets pretty close to straight A's in school and always impresses me with how level-headed and responsible he is. Having said that, he's still a teenager and that means I still worry a lot.

Anyway, Justin has been saving his money forever. He wants to buy a used Mustang GT. We've been looking but just haven't found the right car. Last night the thought just came to me; I have a Porsche in the garage that only sees the road on sunny weekends. In fact, sometimes I go as much a month without driving it in the winter. Why not let my son use the car?

Believe it or not, the insurance hit is the same wether he drives the 911 or a used Mustang. I'm not concerned with him scratching or banging up the Porsche. If I was, I wouldn't even consider this.

So... I'm trying to make a list of the positives and negatives.

Negatives;

1) A 911 SC with a 3.6 transplant is a LOT of car for a new driver.
2) No airbags. I'm worried about safety, but my son remings me that I never owned a car with airbags till I was 35.
3) Justin will not have the pride of ownership that comes with buying your own car.

Positives;

1) My son is a Porsche enthusiast and has always treated my things with respect and care.
2) He is surprised and thrilled that I would even consider letting him drive the 911. He would rather drive the Porsche than a new Mustang.
3) The money not spent buying a Mustang will be spent on insurance and upkeep.
4) In truth, the Porsche needs to be driven more. It's becoming a garage queen, something I never intended.

Well, my wise brothers, what do you think?

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1146336993.jpg

I earned my first car and subsequently took decent care of it. It was the first in a long line of beaters. A 911 is something your son should aspire to.

Two weeks after my son got his license, and a car, he back the 72 Cutlass into a jacked up pickup, didn't see it. He was sick about it, I was a little bummed. How would you feel if your son did the same thing to the Targa? I've offered to let my son drive my Targa, but for that very reason he doesn't want to.

too much car. I started with a '67 bug and could still manage to get into trouble with it.

My advice: No. I don't believe you're doing your son any favors by supplying him with a free Porsche 911. It's a bad deal all around for him. Good lord, how the world has changed since I was a kid!

I agree with the above. Plus, isn't that car prone to coming around in a corner hitting the brakes or maybe letting off the throttle?

Nope - too much temptation and not enough experience.

Then there is the alternative method...first, take out a $5 million term policy on your son...toss him the keys and a bottle of Scotch, saying: "Happy birhday son, have fun!" :rolleyes:

Disclaimer...the above was VERY tongue in cheek, and my vote goes with the majority opinion. :)

I know how hard it is for me to keep my foot out of it, and I'm 41. No way a 16 year-old will keep it on the road. Not to mention the insurance you're looking at.




http://www.spartanhood.com/images/BAPbanner6.png

Hmm, no way on either the GT (I have had one fo those too) or your 911. I got a 1966 Mustang as my first car, a six banger, its still in my garage. If you want him to have a 911, which is cool, get him a stock one, not a killer one with a 3.6 like yours. Or better yet, find a 914 for him. That way he can't have a ton of freinds in the car etc, or a 944....

Moses,
Please think long and hard about this decision--it is a very tough call. When I was younger, my father always had fast cars around (Corvettes and muscle cars) and my parents used to let me drive them on a regular basis as did my older brother. I was very responsible, an outstanding student, and very level headed--I also drove the Corvette like a little old lady when mom or dad was with me. Now, when my parents were not with me is when I really learned how to drive a high horsepower rear wheel drive vehicle :) . Then one cold January afternoon when I was 16 my lack of skill and excess speed caught up with me and I spun my father's pristine low mileage Corvette three times off the road into a telephone pole, off that, through a cable box (big one), and finally into a big ass oak tree. It happend faster than I could say oh sh%t--I knew I was in trouble when I saw fiberglass flying past me. I walked away with only minor injuries--the state police couldn't believe I was the driver b/c of how bad the car looked.

Now, fast forward 10 years and I have a 911 that I have since graduating college. Being 26, I still get the urge to drive my car like it is ment to be driven, we all know our 911's reward good driving and it is fun to do. However, most of us understand the consequences of what can happen, at 16 I did too, I just didn't think it would happen to me--it can and it did. Would I give a beginning driver a 911 with a 3.6? God no, I would let him drive it with his parents but never alone. The limits are just too high on a 911 for an inexperienced driver to catch in time on a two lane country road when it steps it's tail out. Look how many experienced guys here have put them into ditches.

Sorry this is so long, I just know what your son will tell you and how he will will be a perfect driver when you are in the car--that is what I did. In the end it is you decision, let him drive the car with you or your wife occasionly and get him a nice Honda or something that he can't kill himself in, then when he goes to college if he has a clean driving record let him get something more sporty that the chicks will dig. Good luck.

I was a responsible kid, but I could certainly be encouraged by my friends. It only takes one bad decision, and the temptation is just too great to always resist.

My 2.2 liter Plymouth Turismo certainly kept me out of trouble...

Ok - here is a younger opinion. :)

He may be reponsible in school, etc, but that won't count as much out on the road. Have you been training him about traffic flows, what to look for, staying out of the way of stupid people, etc? I studied driving two years before I even got my permit. (Test wise, got the written perfect(lady was shocked to see my soo quickly to. :)) - only thing I missed on the driving test, was coming form being parked on the side of an empty road, to driving again, without using my blinker).

As a 16 year old, I would be very wary of driving a nice powerfull 911 - lets not say would be - lets say was. Sometime before my 17th, I was looking at buying my first car, low miles Porsche 968. Decided against it, I wasn't comfortable with it at that age. Now at twenty, I'd drive one, but not at 16/17.

The 911 - either you ove to drive it, or you don't. I've only driven similar cars in racing simulations, I've never driven a 911 out on the roads. One of the properties that can realy weird you out, is to keep some pressure on the riht foot if the car goes squirly, natural reaction is to lift and slam that middle peddle.

my first car was a '85 944. Over 200K miles, with a good engine. Car was mostly original except for shocks, paint and tires. (wheels had been switched for some reason, but where still Fuch's). Realy, it was the perfect car. I didn't realy realy feel bad when it was shortened between two pick up tricks. I had no place or thing to do to avoid that accident - I'd manged to get my self out of a coillision path on several earlier occaisions, but this tme, oncoming traffic, and no room to the right, and stopped a stopped lifted pick up in front. I was fine, few visits to a chioropractor to get my back straight, other then that...

So stasticly, expect there to be a pretty high chance of the car being gone in the first 1-2 years of driving. I lost my '85 last August at age 19.

I throroughly beleive that young teenager can be perfectly responsible in a powerfull 911 - the thing is, it takes one willing to set rules, follow them, and stufy what is going on around. I did not consider my self at age 16 to have what it takes to drive a car like that. I'd love to today though. :)

Throughout my teenage years, I wanted to earn the money for my own car, and buy the car I'd fallen in love with(the four cylendor Porsches). In my case, on two counts, I wouldn't think it was a good for me at age 16 to have what you are offering to your 16 year old. I'd said, love to, but not a good idea. I might of taken it out on weekends on lesser traveled roads, but would not of wanted to learn city driving in it.

What sort of value do you place on the 911? Perhaps he could buy it from you?

All the posts above about not having a powerfull car keeping them out of trouble - eheheh. Well, that wouldn't work in my case. If I drove a poor handling slug, I'd push it even harder in respect to its limits - which would probably be more dangerous. My 944 is enjoyable at 30-50% of what it can do in a corner.


I agree with this post. At least, for the 6 months.

Overall, I say if you think he can handle it, and is likely to push it in under a safe environment, learn it in and out, then I say YES!

No way. It would be cool to let him borrow it once in a while, but it's too much car for a kid. He just doesnt have enough driving experience.

let him drive it only with you as passenger.

Someone need to vote yes here. I´ll do it.

I think it all depends on what kind of person your son is. What habits he has and what crowd he hangs out with. You have described him well. Out of my four children I know I would say no to two of them. One of them would get the go ahead. She is (rather as you describe your son) very responsible. Takes good care of her own and other peoples things. She has a stable, calm temperament. Careful and cautious. She is not the kind of person I associate with a bad crowd during week ends.

I would teach her to drive that particular car. When we both felt comfortable with her driving it - I would let her have it.

Some kids will have an accident in a Honda Civic on a straight road at day one. Others will never even have a dent in the bumper after 20 years of driving.

i think you should give him my SC! then of course we trade.

mine is the blank slate that your son dreams of. you and him can work on it together. think of the bonding! PM me if this works for you. at least put my fuchs on the car first.

Even if he is responsible and never succumbs(sp) to the temptation of the loud pedal, he's inexperienced and will have passengers that are distracting. He is nearly guarateed to get into an accident. Even though you don't want it to be a garage queen, you don't want it bent either I'm betting.

Not to mention that unless you've had him driving some serious machinery eventually he'll hit the brakes in a corner. We all know what that leads to.

My older brother did that...Scraped the whole underside when he went over the curb sepearting the different traffic dierections... Left his foot down on the brake when coming in a bit quick. For him it was understeer, as the braking was initiated before the turning. If you turn, then brake, oversteer is going to generaly be more prominant.

My only issue with such a thing is experience, what kind of driving experience does he have? Any sort of racing, does he watch when you drive what you do? Do you have any racing sims like ay, Grand Prix Legends or something? I also recommend Vic Elford's Porsche Performance Driving, great book. :)

You know you posted it here because you know in your heart that its wrong to let him drive it unsupervised.
In the UK you cant drive until 17 and there is pressure to raise that to 18.
The section of the public most likely to die in a car crash is the 18 to 25 year olds.
Our village had 6 people killed when a Peugeot 106 with 5 people in it aged between 18 and 22 hit a Ford Focus head-on two miles from here.
My son is 21 now and is driving his second small hatchback 1400cc. The concession was alloy wheels and a bigger exhaust pipe.
Get him some professional advanced driving instruction - get him a car with ABS, airbags, ESP and a great safety crash record - in a bright colour - spend the money on superb servicing and great tyres. Teach him about the importance of tyre pressures and defensive driving. Get him to read the British Police advanced driving manual.
Theres plenty of time for him to have lots of power under his foot later.
Imagine having to tell his girlfriends parents that he just wrapped the Porsche round a tree and killed her.
Sorry to be so blunt but I cannot believe you are serious giving him the Porsche at 16.

Car accidents

Car Accident Statistics

There are about 3 million car-related injuries a year, 2 million permanent injuries and 40,000 deaths in the U.S. each year. The Department of Transportation's statistics indicate that accidents are generally related to irresponsible driving behavior. About 40% of fatalities are related to drinking and driving, 30% to speeding and about 33% from a car going off the road (these groups are not mutually exclusive). Seat belt use is only at about 68% nationally, despite it being a highly cost-effective means to prevent fatalities and serious injuries.

The very young and the very old are much more likely to be involved in accidents. Car accidents are currently the number one killer of people ages 1 to 37. About 1 in 30 young drivers will be injured in an accident each year. Young drivers are four times more likely to die in car accidents and are much more prone to speed, drive recklessly, not wear their seat belts and drink and drive than middle-aged drivers. If we could reduce these dangerous behaviors, we could prevent these needless deaths and injuries.

http://www.car-accidents.net/car-accidents-statistics.html

Six men have been killed in a crash involving two cars on a main road near a Hampshire village.

The vehicles collided on the A31 at Ropley near the Chequers Inn pub on Wednesday night.

Police said five of those who died were in a Peugeot 106 and in their teens or early 20s. The sixth victim, driving a Ford Focus, was a middle-aged man.

The only survivor, the 18-year-old son of the Ford driver, suffered internal injuries, police said.

He was taken to the Royal Hampshire County Hospital in Winchester with what were originally thought to be minor injuries, including two broken fingers.

The teenager has since been transferred to a high-dependency unit.

"It was immediately obvious that no one from the silver Peugeot was going to come out alive"
Resident Jude Ansell

"He is now thought to have internal injuries which had not been picked up on before," a Hampshire police spokeswoman said.

His condition was not thought to be serious.

Officers are hoping to interview him about what happened in the moments before the crash.

'Just horrendous'

A Hampshire County Council spokesperson said the stretch of road, now reopened, was not known as an accident blackspot.

Resident Jude Ansell, who lives 180m (591ft) from the crash site, was one of the first residents to get to the wreckage.

"I was on my computer when I heard an almighty bang," the 41-year-old said.

"My 18-year-old daughter, Marnie, who was in her bedroom, came down and said there had been an accident on the road.


"I have never seen anything like it, it was just horrendous.

"It was immediately obvious that no-one from the silver Peugeot was going to come out alive."

Both cars were severely damaged in the collision, which is believed to have been at high speed.

Simon Rogers, the landlord of the Chequers Inn, said he had not known of any previous accidents at the scene.

But he told BBC News: "It's a 40mph limit through here and a 50mph one up on North Street but it comes off a dual carriageway and people sometimes fly through the village."

"It's just one of those ghastly accidents. It's not, as far as I am aware, a typical accident blackspot "
County councillor Mark Kemp-Gee

Local county councillor Mark Kemp-Gee added: "I must say I often drive the route myself and I do think the traffic-calming and speed limits are very well advertised.

"It's just one of those ghastly accidents. It's not, as far as I am aware, a typical accident blackspot."

Hampshire Constabulary have appealed for any witnesses to the accident, which happened at about 2330 BST, to come forward.

Insp Tony Browne said three of the dead were local and officers were confident that all would be identified soon.

'Thoughts with family'

"The families are obviously devastated. This is an horrendous tragedy and lots of young lives have been tragically ended," he said.

"I have been in roads policing for 22 years and this is the worst collision I have attended for the total number of casualties."

Janis Bernard, head teacher of Perins School in Alresford, where three of the young men were former pupils, said in a statement: "The young men who have died were members of our school community.

"They have been cut off in their prime. With them has gone the potential to make the community a better place.

"Our thoughts are with their families and friends."


http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1146348354.jpg

I would agree with many here...

No matter how responsible the teen... He's going to give in to temptation when you're not around, that's what being a teen is all about. THe responsible ones just ignore the worst temptations.

Hell most of us can't resist the occasional fast blast around a corner or an empty stretch of country road. A teens muscle memory and driving experience probably couldn';t handle many of the situations we run into during those times. The 911 should be a privledge, let him drive it sure, occasionally and under specific circumstances... But VERY RARE the kid I think that could handle that sort of temptation. I was a very careful kid (too careful) and never got into a serious stuff, and I know good and damn well I couldn't be trusted with one...

"Too soon old, too late smart."

If he likes sports cars get him an early '90s Miata. It's a fun car, convertible, not too powerful, easy on gas and insurance. Let him drive the 911 with you as a passenger.

There's a chance that he could drive the car and never have a problem, but there's a greater chance that it won't work out so nicely.

Stevo, tell me about the Brititsh Police Advanced driving book. I'm curious. It's not available online, is it? I did a search. It looks like it is available from Amazon. I also found a forum dedicated to advanced driving in the UK.

Don't do it.

You gotta earn a car like that. My first car...a piss yellow chevy citation. The only kids I knew that got sweet cars in high school turned out rotten.

Not to mention, a 3.6 in an old 911 is f'ing dangerous with an experienced driver behind the wheel.

Driving Tips for Teenagers

Teenage crashes are often not related to issues of driver skill. They are usually a result from lack of maturity and attitude.

How to reduce the risk of teenage accidents:

1. Passengers create distractions.

Teenage drivers often transport their friends. This practice should be limited and supervised carefully. Having more passengers in a car increases the chance of greater risk taking, primarily because of peer pressure. It also leads to greater distractions. It’s up to parents to limit their teenager’s driving time with friends in the car.

2. You are a role model.

You are your teenager's first driving instructor and coach. To be a credible supervisor, your own driving example and driving record are critical. Teenagers with poor driving records often reflect the behavior of their parents with poor driving records.

3. Supervise as much practice driving as possible.

Take an active role in your teenager's driving practice. Plan on supervising for at least six months in order to get your teenager acclimated to a variety of road conditions before he or she takes a driving test to get a license.

4. Be firm about safety belt use.

If you wear your safety belt every time you drive, your son or daughter can adopt this behavior more easily. Require that your teenagers wear safety belts at all times. No exceptions.

5. Discuss realistic consequences of drug and alcohol use.

Teenagers realize that driving under the influence of alcohol or drugs is clearly dangerous, and a face-to-face discussion with mom and dad is a strong statement reinforcing that fact. Let them know that alcohol and drug use is totally unacceptable when driving.

6. Graduated licensing programs.

Graduated driver licensing limits new driver's privileges, allowing teenagers to gain experience and develop their driving skills behind the wheel under optimum driving conditions. Learn more about these programs from these websites:

7. Limit night driving.

Many teenage car crashes take place between 9 p.m. and 12 midnight. Teenagers should be restricted to driving during the day, and gradually introduced to night driving as they gain experience.

8. Keep it slow and safe for starters.

Remember that teenagers need to stay away from fast-moving, high volumes of traffic at first. Gradually introduce more difficult driving situations such as highway driving, merge ramps, and major urban traffic areas.

9. Train for poor weather conditions.

Limit your teen’s driving during periods of bad weather until he or she demonstrates a high level of competence and confidence. Coach your teenage driver to drive in rain, snow, wind, sleet, and ice.

10. Restrict cell phones to emergency use only.

If it is necessary to use a cell phone, instruct your teenager to pull safely over to the side of the road before making an emergency call.

11. Choose safe vehicles for your children.

Avoid extremely small cars, trucks, and sport utility vehicles. Look for automobiles with high safety ratings and features such as airbags and crumple zones. Look at federal statistics and consumer report literature to help evaluate those ratings.

That was my inital thought to, but if he's saved up for a Mustang GT, then a miata would not go over well. I've done a couple of mods on mine, and it now handles, drives, and rides like my old '88 targa. The main difference in the driving experience now is the available thrust.

I'm not sure the kid would be happy with a miata after thinking about a Mustang GT and a 3.6L SC.

The Basic manual for UK Police is Roadcraft - available on Amazon.co.uk
A user Review...
"Roadcraft has been around for at least twenty-five years that I am aware of and the advice in it gets better with every day. It is the book that will teach you how to survive on the roads.
It will not teach you how to be a traffic cop. It will teach you how to read the road, how to see trouble coming and how to avoid it. It will teach you how to overtake safely, how to manoeuvre safely in tight situations and how to see escape routes when faced with other people's stupidity. Everyone should have to read and understand this book before they pass a driving test."

My daughter's first car was a Toyota Echo which I bought her. About a year later, going too fast in the rain, she went sideways and hit the K-rail divider at about 60. Deployed all 6 airbags (side curtain as well). Absolutely totalled the car. She walked away. If she'd been in a 70's or 80's car she'd be dead, no question in my mind.

No. No to the Mustang as well.

Up here in the North Bay, I can't count the number of teenage driving deaths, with a disproportionate number in Mustangs. The most tragic was four youths on their way to get Ice Cream. No booze, no drugs, just a second of over-zealous right foot - showing off a brand new Mustang. The car went off the road, rotated in mid-air, landed on the roof. Three lives lost as I recall.

Of my friends with kids of recent driving age, 100% have been in accidents. Not an exageration, and not all their fault. But you've got about 1:2 odds of paying for some bodywork in the next three years.

Something safe (airbags, ABS), underpowered (4 cyl) and reliable (Honda?).

A 3.6 conversion - Holy Moses! ;)

18 year old + new permit + 3.6 911 is a high probability of :

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1146352060.jpg

unless maybe the kid has the mental mindset of a budhist monk who passed the 3 quarters mark on the way to enlightenment,which i think is about as realistic as getting married to the first chick you date, and finding out while on honymoon that, is Bill Gates's daughter, looks stunning , never nags and gives you a CGT for x-mas, and a Ferrari Enzo for Easter...


Don, since when does Honday have a reputation for reliable car engines ??!?!

I've been driving my 911 ever since I got my license and now I'm almost 17. The car had given me a lot of experience through mechanics and handling. I think it would be a great car for your son. Mainly since he's responsible and gets good grades. Have him come out to the Mines Rd. drive tomorrow and maybe we all can teach him how to really handle a Porsche :D? Once he knows how it handles, and he knows it's limits, then I think it will be safe for him. The airbag issue is important too. 911's are pretty durable cars in collisions, IMHO, but not even close to safe as a new car. If he does inherit the 911, it will teach him a great deal about mechanics and rear engine handling. Like I stated earlier, come out to the Mines Dr. tomorrow and we can teach him a few tricks :cool:.

From the Times newspaper UK

Death rate doubles for young drivers
By Ben Webster, Transport Correspondent

THE death rate among young drivers has doubled in the past five years, prompting demands for greater restrictions on those who have recently passed their tests.

The steady improvement in road safety across the general population is masking a sharp increase in the number of drivers aged under 20 having fatal crashes, despite a tougher driving test.

A third more young drivers were killed in 2004 than in 2000 despite a halving in the proportion of young people with driving licences. The number of deaths per 100,000 young licence holders has increased from 9.7 in 2000 to 19.2 in 2004.

Many of the crashes involve groups of young people travelling together late at night, often with the driver under the influence of alcohol or drugs.

A study by the AA Motoring Trust found that the growing tendency among young people to defer taking their driving test, far from reducing the danger, could be increasing it. With fewer of the young having licences, they tend to drive in larger groups. Inexperienced drivers are less likely to realise that a heavily laden car is harder to control on bends and has longer braking distances.

The AA research also suggests that there is a greater tendency among young drivers to show off behind the wheel to the growing proportion of their peers who have not passed their tests. The smaller pool of younger drivers means there are fewer available to take turns as the designated driver and avoid alcohol.

Andrew Howard, the AA’s head of road safety, said: “If you are the only person in your group of friends with a licence and always have to do the driving, it may be more tempting to have a drink.”

Many young people are being deterred from taking their driving test because of the rising cost of insurance and new elements in the test that have made it more awkward to pass. An 18-year-old pays an average of £1,700 for car insurance, according to A&A Group, a leading broker.

The Department for Transport introduced a theory test in 1996, a hazard perception test in 2003 and now even requires candidates to have a basic understanding of car maintenance.

The higher proportion of young people going to university means more are putting off learning to drive until after they graduate. Financial constraints are also a factor, with the average novice driver spending £1,162 on lessons and test fees, according to a study published today by Churchill Insurance.

The AA proposes that new drivers should be obliged to sign a code under which they would agree not to drive between midnight and 5am and to limit the number of passengers they carried until they had gained two years’ experience.

Mr Howard said that breaches of the code would be taken into account if drivers committed a motoring offence, with courts issuing harsher penalties.

“A code would be more effective than new laws, as it would be difficult for police to enforce laws restricting young drivers.

Cameras can’t detect how old someone is or how long they have been driving.”

New drivers already face having their licences revoked if they accumulate six penalty points within two years of qualifying.

However, they can simply retake their tests and get back behind the wheel.

Here in the states they are well-renown for their reliability. Perhaps not at the mindless level of a Toyota (no oil changes for life), but with better drivability. We've owned three, I'd have another one any day. IMHO. YMMV.

Teen Drivers: Fact Sheet

Overview

Two out of five deaths among U.S. teens are the result of a motor vehicle crash (CDC 2004).


Occurrence and Consequences

* In 2002, more than 5,000 teens ages 16 to 19 died of injuries caused by motor vehicle crashes (CDC 2004).

* The risk of motor vehicle crashes is higher among 16- to 19-year-olds than among any other age group. In fact, per mile driven, teen drivers ages 16 to 19 are four times more likely than older drivers to crash (IIHS 2005).

* In 2003, teenagers accounted for 10 percent of the U.S. population and 13 percent of motor vehicle crash deaths (IIHS 2005).

* The presence of teen passengers increases the crash risk of unsupervised teen drivers; the risk increases with the number of teen passengers (Chen 2000).

Cost

In 2002, the estimated economic cost of police-reported crashes (both fatal and nonfatal) involving drivers ages 15 to 20 was $40.8 billion (NHTSA 2003).


Groups at Risk

* In 2002, the motor vehicle death rate for male occupants age 16 to 19 was nearly twice that of their female counterparts (23 per 100,000 compared with 12 per 100,000) (CDC 2004a).

* Crash risk is particularly high during the first year that teenagers are eligible to drive (IIHS 2005).


Risk Factors

* Teens are more likely than older drivers to underestimate hazardous situations or dangerous situations or not be able to recognize hazardous situations (Jonah 1987).

* Teens are more likely than older drivers to speed, run red lights, make illegal turns, ride with an intoxicated driver, and drive after using alcohol or drugs (Jonah 1987).

* Among male drivers between 15-20 years of age who were involved in fatal crashes in 2003, 39% were speeding at the time of the crash (NHTSA 2004a).

* Compared with other age groups, teens have the lowest rate of seat belt use. In 2003, 18% of high school students reported they rarely or never wear seat belts when riding with someone else (CDC 2004b).

o Male high school students (22%) were more likely than female students (15%) to rarely or never wear seat belts (CDC 2004b).

o African-American students (21%) and Hispanic students (20%) were more likely than white students (17%) to rarely or never wear seat belts (CDC 2004b).

· At all levels of blood alcohol concentration (BAC), the risk of involvement in a motor vehicle crash is greater for teens than for older drivers (IIHS 2004).

o In 2003, 25% of drivers ages 15 to 20 who died in motor vehicle crashes had a BAC of 0.08 g/dl or higher (NHTSA 2004).

o In a national survey conducted in 2003, 30% of teens reported that within the previous month, they had ridden with a driver who had been drinking alcohol. One in eight reported having driven after drinking alcohol within the same one-month period (CDC 2004b).

o In 2003, among teen drivers who were killed in motor vehicle crashes after drinking and driving, 74% were unrestrained (NHTSA 2004b).

* In 2003, 54% of teen deaths from motor vehicle crashes occurred on Friday, Saturday, or Sunday; 42% occurred between 9 p.m. and 6 a.m. (IIHS 2005).

Steveo - enough of that, please? Ok? I have NEVER spun my Porsche, and I've had one coming up on two years. I've been in storms at night, icey roads, etc. I've had it since I was 18.

You keep posting stastics, that have NO bearing on this guys son. its an individual case that you are treating by stastics. My brother and I are very differnet drivers, grew up in the smae house, same parents. He used to speed like crazy, I drive the speed limits(seriously). I even stop for sotp signs on a bicycle...

Many of the stastics you are posting have no bearing on this issue - other than there are other unsafe drivers out there. Which means anyone, driving any car is at risk. Not knowing his son, how can you say he fits exactly into the stastics? Its just like if all familes have an average 2 and 1/2 kids... I mean, does that mean all familes have 2 kids and then one half of another?

Negatives;

1) A 911 SC with a 3.6 transplant is a LOT of car for a new driver.(agreed)
2) No airbags. I'm worried about safety, but my son remings me that I never owned a car with airbags till I was 35.(Having never wrecked a 911, I honestly don't know. Airbag's aren't as important with good seat belts and driving posture)
3) Justin will not have the pride of ownership that comes with buying your own car.(For me, this was important, I wanted my own car)

Positives;

1) My son is a Porsche enthusiast and has always treated my things with respect and care.(Well and good, an issue is, how does he treat things that are his own?
)
2) He is surprised and thrilled that I would even consider letting him drive the 911. He would rather drive the Porsche than a new Mustang.(I would to!)


4) In truth, the Porsche needs to be driven more. It's becoming a garage queen, something I never intended.(I'm sure you could find a driver :D)

Teruven,

All of the stats do mean something because they speak to the average individual. On an individual basis they may not speak to whether Moses' son is the same risk, higher, or lower than the average. Nevertheless, it is instructive to note that many so-called good kids quite often fit the mold of average kids in statistics (probably because we all think our kids are good). It's just as baseless to believe that just because a kid gets A's he/she is more likely to not crash a car, as it is to presume the average applies.

More importantly, it has been shown by a number of studies, that teens have much poorer impulse control than older adults, and inferred that this is the reason for higher accident rates.

Personally, I am happy that Moses' son actually is ready to pony up cash for his ride (rather than getting it given to him), but if it were me, I would not start him in a sports car, even though it might be more "phat" or whatever the current equivalent of cool is. I got A's in high school, didn't get in (that much) trouble, and still managed to do my first car in - a Honda Accord. And that puppy understeered like you can't believe.

Get him a '92 Buick. Preferably with two different color fenders. Tell him that if he can go one year with no wrecks or tickets he gets to move up.

Not many people have ever read these statistics - I hadn't and was shocked - the more you Google this subject the more shocked you will become too.

Occasionaly you will get a TV news or newspaper article about some teenage friends killed on a night out - in a few weeks its forgotten.
The causes are still there - young untrained, inexperienced drivers crash - too often.
Doesn't matter which country - its pretty much the same everywhere.

As a parent it makes sense to do what you can to remove potential risk from the situation for your child.
The best training you can get, the best safety standard car and a minimising of dangerous situations that your child is exposed to should be natural reactions of a parent.

It brings it home to you when you fear, as I did, that the report on TV showing the teenagers crash, might just have involved your child.

Just like the pro gun people say - its the person, not the gun. Its the person, not entirely the car. Now - things like unsafe vehichle's can factor in here, for example, say a shock braking mid corner or something... or losing all your break fluid rom a rusted joint, whatever.

When it comes to one kid, go with what you know about that one kid, and you will do better then going by mass stastics - as he could fal on either side of the stastic. When dealing with large groups of people - or you know nothing at all - then stastics help. I worked on trying to predict people - the more I know about a person, the less I base my guess's on stastics, and instead use the facts I've seen. I then turn those facts about that person, into a stastic about that person. If I find several people, well, I'm going of topic here. But I've often surprised someone riding with me, point at a car up the road, and saying they will turn left two lights from now - and they do. I watched how they where driving in the breif time span I saw them, and put things together, and decided they where turning soon, but their speeds and braking, showed it to be dow nthe road, going by the type of car, it would fit in with the street two lights down the road making a left.

I however - was NOT your ordinary teenager. I'm homeschooled, and that builds a lot of respect for your parents. That respect transfered to my driving - as - my parents taught me, and I also taught myself.

The problem goes beyond a sportscar, its the kid driving, and how he's been brought up prior. If he doesn't ahve standards, and stick to them, then he is gonna break. My first car was a Porsche. I can think of a few instances where I intentionaly exceeded the speed limit in that car - pretty much interstate onramps, where the speed to merge was greater than the speed limit.

Even a perfectly responsible driver can have their car smashed. I had no where to go when my '85 was totaled. I could not of avoided that one. (other then not driving at all, and sitting in a bubble for the rest of my life).

If you do go with a yes - spend a lot of passenger seat time with him - a lot. Don't let him drive it alone until a year or more. (You'll have to renew the learners permit perhaps). That way, you can train him. if a person drives a certain way for a year or more, its a lot more likely to stick. Find deserted road turn offs with run off, practice cornering, over steer, understeer. Take it out in the wet, so he knows that the edge comes much much sooner in wet on most dry weather tires. if he is like me, he's gonna want to learn how to push the car to its limits. Set up rules for when to dive into a turn off and when not to.

I always always make sure I can see down the road I'm turning onto, and any driveways, side streets, cats, dogs, etc...

I do not push to both 95% of the road, and 95% of the car. Either I leave room incase I do mess up(haven't yet in two years, but I still leave that room) - OR - I do not push the car to 95% 100% is only for test situations or emergencies.

I test my brakes and stopping distances from different speeds. Your stopping distance from 45 and 65 are quite a bit different, this needs to be understood. In situations such as residential areas - YOU NEED TO DRIVE SLOWER! Blind driveways, etc...

Moses, what region of the world are you from? That would affect what I think about this. In the UK - I'd say no. Where I live, so long as he didn't go into the big city much - I'd say yes.

The UK spends more time on driver training - but also tends to be more dangerous, so they kinda balance out. In the US, varies from state to state, some are fairly lax, others more intense. I did not treat driving lightly, and still do not. I love to drive though. I know I could die everytime I get onto public roads - all it takes is one person not paying attention, and say, driving straight into a busy intersection. BAM! its happened...

My inclanation - is to let him get his own car. But have him drive you around in the 911 everynow and then.