Tow Vehicle
 

I am in the process of getting a new (probably used) car. Of course, it has to be able to do duty as a tow vehicle, too. Here are my contenders:

1. Nissan Pathfinder Armada
2. Toyota Sequoia
3. GMC Denali
4. VW Toureg V8


Anyone with experience in any of these (good/bad) would be appreciated.

Thanks!

Depends on what you are going to tow.

I'm a firm believer in overkill for towing. I tow with a 3/4 ton truck with 4:10 gears, big brakes and a tranny cooler.

Probably an open, aluminum trailer with an 88 Carrera. I think any of the above would be overkill, no?

OVERKILL is a CHEVY 1-TON DUALLIE LONGBED 4-DOOR 4X4 w/built to the hilt BIG BLOCK! and fiberglass shell and winch w/dual batteries and 8 hella lights!http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1150459880.jpg your next step is a peterbuilt and a 40 ft trailer with lifts to hold 4 cars. 2 people and this rig will carry both your kitchen sinks, more beer than you can fathom drinking in a day, entire wardrobe, spares, and best of all................2 drop dead good looking women if you find them either in BAJA or your local race track. and you can sleep in the back(after you clear all the crap out you stuffed in!) gas mileage...............WHO CARES ITS RACING!

I retired by Ram 1500 when I bought my car trailer. It pulled it "okay", but I wanted something that would pull the load with very little effort. Especially since I may upsize in the near future.

So I bought a used Ram 3500. It's a 1 ton, dually, quad cab with a 24v Cummins turbo diesel with a manual trans. Believe it or not, it gets better fuel economy than my 1500 does with it's 5.2 Magnum and AT. So far, it seems very win/win to me.

another view in BAJAhttp://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1150460512.jpg cool thing is we got this from original owner w/97k on it. ran car fax-never wrecked for 13K (YES $13,000) did valve job water pump flushed radiator new optima batteries new tires new bilsteins new brakes/bearings. 1/4" alum skid plate from front past tranny/transfer. extra capacity finned rear diffy cover. flushed all fluids, fixed a couple of FOO-FOO thangs and installed throttle body,MAS,K&N filter, lights bumper winch AND IT RUNS LIKE A RAPED APE!

the only PITA............i have to remind myself to drive it to charge the batteries every month! it is not a daily driver and sits waiting for the next race ONLY! the only way to cruise towing ANYTHING.have towed alot of trailers in our days, and this is outstanding!

GAS VS. DIESEL debate...........try and find diesel in the middle of BFE BAJA! we always carry octane booster for the poor gas we seem to find some trips in BAJA !

so in ending the price of a new tow vehicle is through the roof.......35K - 45K for a dura-max. buy a used gas tow rig, dump some cash in it and you are still ahead big bucks!

That's some rig... Mine will be a daily driver, and I frequently go into Chicago, so I need sometime a little more tame. I think I am leaning towards a Denali or an Armada.

parking sometimes can be a challenge................thats when we just push vehicles out of the way! LOL! make calcs on weight of car, weight of alum trailer(the only way), how much crap your gonna bring, how many people, and then add a 1000 pounds and youll have figured out what vehicle will work. nothing worse than being underpowered and going 35mph on single lane uphill. people get pissed and throw things at you!!!!

So I suppose buying a used Duramaxi is out of the question. Compare a used Duramaxi vs. new gas tow rig.

didnt say that. comparison was used gas vs new duramax. used duramax obviously will be less than new. but if YOU EVEN THINK OF EVER GOING TO BAJA and getting out into BFE, plan on bringing drums of diesel fuel with you! we have had to use t-shirts to strain gas out of 55 gallon drums via hand crank pump to get fuel before.

the days of pulling up to airstrip in baja and getting AV gas are long over due to every drop of AV gas being accounted for and signed off to "N" number on fueselage of plane due to drug running. airstrips that sell AV gas are checked weekly by federales for fuel sales. example (1) plane takes on 100 gallons and airstrip has 1000 gallons week before, airstrip BETTER have 900 gallons the next time federales show up to check!!!

dura maxes are great engines for stateside towing, but when in baja it can really ruin your day trying to find diesel.
as far as buying anything new................sure if you want to pay killer insurance, killer taxes, killer reg. tags/plates etc. if you only use it a few times a year............i'll go with used anyday save the bucks and dump it into porsche!

I really like my armada - torque for days = I tow a boat and you hardly know it's there - towed the 911 with ease too. I didn;t like the width of the GMC/Caddy.

here is a currebt thread in the AX/track section with some good commentary >>>>http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-autocross-track-racing/288238-when-trailer.html

have done both. drive to track/races and trailered. trailer is my cup of tea. dont have storage or security issues. have 1 1/2 acres of rattlesnake dezert. if snakes dont git 'em...........my HK will! there is the PITA aspect of trailer...........lights-brakes-electrics-wheel bearings-spare tires(2 in baja)-wind etc. always bring spare bearings / races and grease/spare lug nuts/tie downs /bulbs etc. trailering isnt for the light hearted it is a GIANT PITA always. you just have to stay ahead of it and be prepared!

having had bearing failure on trailer at 2AM outside of kingman,AZ on way to gold coast 350 HDRA race in vegas and following morning was tech and race ........................SURE WASNT FUN W/OUT spare bearings! we did get it fixed, made tech, and actually finished 8th in class..............but man that was one long night changing out bearings on side of I-40!

I vote for the Touareg, but then I am biased. Stay away from the '04 Touaregs - too many first year glitches.

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1150474663.jpg

Ben,

Think long wheelbase for your tow vehicle, it will be steadier and more capable of controlling your load. Make sure your vehicle is FACTORY equipped with the towing package. This will include sturdier springs, factory tow bar, electrical wiring, transmission intercooler (VERY necessary for distances more than a few miles). I suggest electric brakes instead of a load activated trailer brake (one that is attached to the hitch and brakes when the trailer gets closer to your vehicle, this is not the break away brake which is for a runaway trailer), these types of brakes are required by law in most states for loads over 3,000 pounds.

Just because it is an SUV does not mean it is capable of towing. Go to the manufacturer's web sites and check on the maximum towing capacities in several different situations. I know the Nissan claims to be able to tow 9,000 pounds, but that is on a straight road with all proper equipment installed at the factory. Get on a hilly road and the load capacity goes way down.

I use a Ford F250 Diesel with a 3.73 rear end and factory towing package but I tow loads approaching 11,000 pounds. For our smaller loads we used to use a Chevy 1/2 tonne, 5.7 liter with a 3.73 rear end. The 4.10 is a great rear end, but gets lousy fuel economy so there is always a trade off.

I think the Nissan and Toyota have a maximum towing capacity of 5,000 pounds when properly equipped and on "average" terrain (not flat). Don't know about the others.

I have a 18ft aluminum trailer for the '89 911 or the '76 Bastard 911. I pull it with a Jeep Cherokee (4.0 inline 6). Works well. I'd go with something bigger but I like the compactness of my Cherokee. And it's got torque and HP...enough anyhow to tow my cars to the tracks in the midwest w/o issues.

If I were to get anything bigger, it'd be because I need interior space for my tools (I take a lot of crap to the track) and for sleeping in when the track event is overnight.


...all that said and of your four listed vehicles, the TOyota will likely hold it's value better than the others.

this will HAUL ALOT OF TOOLS AND BEER! the trailer you see in corner was 36ft toyhauler w/buggy in it and quads and a ton of crap plus crap stuffed into duallie(doolie). 75mph down highway all day long..............but i am telling you IT WAS A HANDFULL! and we have the TOW PKG and sway mts! we did stay down that time 2 weeks so it was worth it, but that is alot of crap to haul! my buddy has 3/4 ton diesel ford and is now either going for a ford or chev 1-ton. but he hauls that damn thing all over SW.

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1150504572.jpg

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1150504615.jpg

I have driven a Denali, and am going to "borrow" an Armada for the weekend tomorrow. My gut tells me the Armada is gonna be the one. Also, with all of these SUVs being of substantial weight, they make for a great tax deduction. :p

The Armada is bound to be a good value used since they sell so poorly new (esp the Infinity Q56 twin). The 5.6L feels very healthy and the 5 speed automatic helps.

The Denali is tried and true, but is still a half ton. Consider a 2500 Suburban or Yukon XL (same 6.0L V8) that has the heavier duty chassis.

The Toureg is small, expensive, and unibody. While it will pull just fine, it is not up to the same tow cycles as a framed truck.

The Sequoia is small, expensive, and underpowered. Toyota deserves its great reputation but you pay for it up front. They haven't made a great full sized truck - YET.

Both the Denali XL AWD and Armada LE/SE 4x4 with 30-35K miles should be readily available for under $30K. The Denali will have more equipment if you care about bells and whistles. New GM parts are cheaper than Nissan, and since literally millions were built used parts availability and price helps the GMs.

A similar Sub 2500 LT 6.0L 4x4 will save you a couple grand, get the same fuel economy, and have a MUCH higher capacity, even if it is *reserve*.

Better safe than sorry when towing.

E

Don’t get the Yukon or Tahoe with the smaller engine. They have around 275hp if you wan to rev them to 5K, and no bottom end torque. I got rid of the Yukon for a Tundra, and am very happy with it. The Denali and Yukon XL have the larger engine and also toe well.

Ira

Ben,
I have a 04 Sequoia. Tow with it at least once a week-usually a trailex with a variety of 911s but occasionally a 20' Haulmark. Just turned 50k and has not had one thing wrong. Nada,zero,zip not a freaking squeek. Plus it's worth considerably more than the remaing payments. Try that with a Chevy,Cad,Ford,Nissan,Vw etc. I think Toyota has a rebate or special financing on them currently. Bear in mind this comment comes from a 25 year Porsche Mechanic who grew up with Chevy trucks.
Dan J

i liked that last statement " a 25 yr porsche mechanic, who likes chevy trucks"! when going down to baja you either drive a chevy/ford/vw and all you will never have a problem getting parts. drive anything else and plan on "parts hell" when something breaks!

over the years of towing and going to races we have adopted the "NAPA MOBILE" mentality. basically when prepping for going down for a race, every component that is needed for a spare or a wear part(belt/hose) is purchased from napa, we then take part # and write # on hood of vehicle w/a sharpie pen. that way if we cannot get part in ensenada or san felipe we can always hitch ride to border get EXACT PART and come back with exact part! generally carry a hell of a lot of spares but we have been stuck for days and had to do the exact drill above w/water pump one year.

Charles,
I totally agree If you drive a Chevy/Ford/vw you will indeed need NAPA
I grew up with Chevies and still like them however when I towed with my 454 equipped K3500 dually ( just like yours) I too could be found in the parking lot of Napa. And you've gotta love that single digit MPG
Regards,
Dan J.

when confronted with the gas pump, i just peek into the bed and count how many ice chests full of ice cold CORONAS! plus the fact of just getting the hell out of town softens the impact on my wallet. there is nothing better than a roadtrip anywhere anytime! since we dont use it very often it really is cheap to own. tags are cheap,plates cheap, insurance cheap. like i mentioned having a mongo tow anything tow rig you only use to tow is a luxury. it just sits and has cash thrown at it. after a couple of years of that drill, we are at the point where we cant buy anymore FOO FOO parts for it! all in all having a 1-ton is the only way to tow. reason i bought it 2 yrs ago was to tow a big ass boat that is in my future some day...............38ft formula w/twin 525 injected MERCS and air conditioning! lake powell here i come again!

Update: So I have had the Armada all weekend, and can say it is a nice truck - lots of power . There are a lot of well thought out features (US carmakers - are you listening?) like power folding side mirrors, third seats that fold into the floor, and a power rear tailgate. The interior ergonomics are a bit strange, which is unusual for a Japanese manufacturer. I much prefer the interior layout of my father's 4 year old Suburban. Anyway, I really appreciate the input from everyone, and will probably end up with the Armada or a Denali.

'03-up GM's have power folding side mirrors

Power liftgates came out in 2000 for the '01 Chrysler minivans and you can get them in Navigators since 2004 and the new 2007 GM's.

Good luck

E

Recently bought a Yukon XL as a hauler. It has the "smaller" motor but has plenty of power. I had no problems passing cars or entering the interstate at all. I cruised for 650 miles with the cruise set at 72 mph. Couldn't even tell the car was on back until I looked in the mirror. I kept forgetting and I would look up and get startled that someone would be following so closely!:rolleyes:

That said, I've been VERY happy with the Yukon. Very plush and built to tow. Good deals can be had too.

http://img101.imageshack.us/img101/1...uler9112iz.jpg

When reviewing the towing data for vehicles please keep in mind that the companies list the Maximum Towing Capacity for flat surfaces when the vehicle is properly equipped. Some companies list numbers to include when you use overload springs. Just because a vehicle is an suv or a truck does not mean it will automatically be able to tow your trailer.

Also, keep in mind the trailer you tow has an effect on your tow vehicle. I can easily tow three horses, tons of tack, and four people in my three horse trailer. That will be about 9 to 10,000 pounds. The truck does not balk and I have plenty of power. The trailer is a gooseneck and is aerodynamic. I just pulled my father in laws car trailer last night. It has a flat front nose, especially designed to catch all the wind possible and slow you down. Imagine a large rectangular box with wheels and 90 degree corners, nothing round. It weighed in at about 9,000 pounds. Man, what a drag on the back of the truck. I'll always prefer to tow a trailer load of round bales or a trailer load of horses to that schtinkin box!!!!!

So.. I ended up with a Yukon XL. I am in the automotive finance industry, so I have access to auctions. I just bought an '05 Yukon XL for really cheap - really nice truck. So far, so good. Anyone have ideas as to what hitch receiver to use, if I intend to rent a trailer from U Haul?

I tow my 89 with an aluminum trailer. The biggest question should be " How often are you actually going to be using it to tow"? I usually attend 3-4 DE's a summer, possible 2000 miles of towing at the most. Beyond that, I don't want to be using a heavy duty towing car for my everday needs, since that is what I'm using it for 90% of the time. Find a car you like and that fits your requirements, which isn't much for your car and trailer of that weight. When you join the PCA clubracing circuit and fully enclosed trailer, then get the mega tower.

on chevys usually the frame is drilled for a receiver. if not you are in for some fun if you choose to DIY yourself. first you will be on your back looking up and getting a facefull of chips(metal) in your face and eyes. second the pressure needed is ALOT to drill holes in any frame. so hit penske or u-haul they will either put their drill jig underneath and in no time the holes will be drilled. or they will put on lift and wearing full safety mask use an air drill with lots of psi and your holes will be drilled. class III and class IV receivers are all the same w/exception of dimensions for your particular vehicle. if you have a junkyard around you may find a yukon with one from factory and scarf that up cheap. after they bolt to frame with grade 8's its not a bad idea to ask them to place 2-3 tack welds on both sides also.

Chulo-Good for you! You won't be dissapointed. I still have nothing but praise for my Yukon XL. I took it on a trip a few weeks ago and managed 18-19 hwy mpg. Not bad for a big truck.

On hitches-I'm mostly an oem guy so I would go to a GMC dealership first. I know Reese also makes good hitches-maybe even the oem. I would not let U-haul install it. They are far from expert auto mechanics. I've seen some of them have a hard time attaching a trailer to a hitch, let alone a hitch to a truck.