for pilots and others, Safe for Work opening

[billyboy]

>> -Subject: Mohammad Atta Was In My Cockpit Jump Seat
>>
>>
>> This is the response from a retired Delta pilot to
>> questions about
>> whether he was going to see UAL 93. It is spooky!
>>
>>
>> I haven't seen the movie, yet, but I intend to when
>> I get the chance.
>> Retirement has made me busier than ever, and I
>> haven't had the chance to
>> see many movies lately.
>> As a Delta B-767 captain myself at the time of the
>> attacks on 9/11 I
>> was in crew rest in Orlando that morning. I had just
>> turned on the TV in
>> my hotel room only to see the WTC tower on fire,
>> then saw the
>> second airplane hit the other tower. My immediate
>> reaction was
>> "Terrorists...we're at war", followed by the
>> realization that we airline
>> crewmembers had all dodged a bullet; it could have
>> been any one of us
>> flying those planes. As soon as the news stations
>> flashed the first
>> pictures of the terrorists I knew just how close and
>> personal the bullet
>> I dodged was.
>>
>> There, on the screen for all to see, was a man who
>> had sat in my
>> jumpseat the previous July.
>> His name was Mohammad Atta, the leader of the
>> terrorist hijackers.
>> Atta had boarded my flight from Baltimore to Atlanta
>> on July 26, 2001
>> wearing an American Airlines first officer uniform.
>> He had the
>> corresponding AA company ID identifying him as a
>> pilot, not to mention
>> the required FAA pilot license and medical
>> certificate that he was
>> required to show me as proof of his aircrew status
>> for access to my
>> jumpseat. An airline pilot riding a cockpit jumpseat
>> is a long
>> established protocol among the airlines of the
>> world, a courtesy
>> extended by the management and captains of one
>> airline to pilots and
>> flight attendants of other air- lines in recognition
>> of their aircrew
>> status. My admission of Mohammad Atta to my cockpit
>> jumpseat that day was
>> merely a routine exercise of this protocol.
>> Something seemed a bit different about this jumpseat
>> rider, though,
>> because in my usual course of conversation with him
>> as we reached cruise
>> altitude he avoided all my questions about his
>> personal life and focused
>> very intently upon the cockpit instruments and our
>> operation of the aircraft. I asked him what he flew
>> at American and he
>> said, "These", but he asked incessant questions
>> about how we did this or
>> why we did that.
>> I said, "This is a 767. They all operate the same
>> way." But he said,
>> "No, we operate them differently at American." That
>> seemed very
>> strange, because I knew better. I asked him about
>> his background, and he
>> admitted he was from Saudi Arabia. I asked him when
>> he came over to this
>> country and he said "A couple of years ago.", to
>> which I
>> asked, "Are you a US citizen?" He said no. I also
>> found that very
>> strange because I know that in order to have an
>> Airline Transport
>> Pilot rating, the rating required to be an airline
>> captain, one has to
>> be a US citizen, and knowing the US air- lines and
>> their hiring processes
>> as I do, I found it hard to believe that American
>> Airliens would hire a
>> non-US citizen who couldn't upgrade to captain when
>> the
>> time came. He said, "The rules have changed.", which
>> I also knew to be
>> untrue. Besides, he was just, shall I say, "Creepy"?
>>
>>
>> My copilot and I were both glad to get rid of this
>> guy when we got to
>> Atlanta.
>>
>> There was nothing to indicate, though, that he was
>> anything other
>> than who or what he said he was, because he had the
>> documentation to
>> prove who he was. In retrospect, we now know his
>> uniform was stolen
>> and his documents were forged. Information later
>> came to light as to how
>> this was done.
>>
>> It seems that Mohammad Atta and his cronies had
>> possibly stolen
>> pilot uniforms and credentials from hotel rooms
>> during the previous
>> year. We had many security alerts at the airline to
>> watch out for our
>> personal items in hotel rooms becuase these were
>> mysteriously
>> disappearing, but nobody knew why. Atta and his men
>> used these to
>> make dry runs prior to their actual hijackings on
>> 9/11. How do I
>> know? I called the FBI as soon as I saw his face on
>> the TV that day,
>> and the agent on the other end of the line took my
>> information and
>> told me I'd hear back from them when all the dust
>> settled. A few
>> weeks later I got a letter from the Bureau saying
>> that my call was one
>> of at least half a dozen calls that day from other
>> pilots who had had
>> the same experience. Flights were being selected at
>> random to make test
>> runs for accessing the cockpit. It seems we had all
>> dodged bullets.
>> Over the years my attitude towards the War Against
>> Terrorism and the
>> wars in Afghanistan and Iraq have been known to be
>> on the red neck,
>> warmongering, rah-rah-shoot-em-up side of things.
>> I've been known to
>> lose my patience with those who say the war in Iraq
>> or anywhere else
>> in the Muslim world is wrong, or who say we
>> shouldn't become involved in
>> that area of the world for political correctness
>> reasons. Maybe
>> it's because I dodged the bullet so closely back in
>> 2001 that I feel this
>> way.
>>
>> I have very little patience for political rhetoric
>> or debate against this
>> war because for a couple of hours back in July 2001,
>> when I was engaged
>> in conversation with a major perpetrator in this
>> war, I came so close to
>> being one of its victims that I can think in no
>> other terms.
>>
>> I don't mind admitting that one of the reasons I
>> retired early from
>> Delta last May, other than to protect my
>> disappearing company
>> retirement, was because it became harder and harder
>> for me to go to
>> work every day knowing that the war wasn't being
>> taken seriously by
>> the general public.
>>
>> The worst offenders were the Liberal detractors to
>> the present adminis-
>> tration, and right or wrong, this administration is
>> at least taking
>> the bull by the horns and fighting our enemies,
>> which is something
>> concrete that I can appreciate. Nobody was taking
>> this war seriously, and
>> it seems everyone found fault with the US government
>> rather than with
>> those who attacked us.
>>
>> I found that incomprehensible.
>> I also found myself being scrutinized by TSA
>> screeners more and more
>> every day when I went to work, and suffered the
>> humiliating indignity
>> of being identified about half the time for body
>> searches in front of
>> the general flying public who looked at the entire
>> process as being
>> ludi- crous. "They don't even trust their own
>> pilots!" accompanied by
>> an unbelieving snicker was the usual response. Here
>> I was, a retired USAF
>> officer who had been entrusted to fly nuclear
>> weapons around the world,
>> who had been granted a Top Secret clearance and had
>> been on missions over
>> the course of 21 years in the military that I still
>> can't can't talk
>> about without fear of prosecution by the DoD, who
>> was being scanned by a
>> flunkie TSA screener looking for any sign of a pen
>> knife or nail file on
>> my person.
>>
>> It wasn't until six months after my retirement when
>> my wife and I
>> flew to Key West, FL last November that I was
>> finally able to rid
>> myself of the visage of Mohammad Atta sitting behind
>> me on my
>> jumpseat, watching my every action in the cockpit
>> and willing to slit
>> my throat at the slightest provocation. I missed
>> being a headline by a
>> mere 47 days, and could very well have been among
>> the aircrew casualties
>> on 9/11 had one of my flights on my monthly schedule
>> been a
>> transcontinental flight from Boston or New York to
>> the west coast on the
>> 11th of September.
>>
>> Very few people know that, while only four airliners
>> crashed that day,
>> four more were targeted, and two of them were Delta
>> flights. The only
>> reason these four weren't involved is because they
>> either had minor
>> maintenance problems which delayed them at the gate
>> or they were
>> scheduled to depart after the FAA decided to ground
>> all flights.
>> Theirs are the pilots and flight attendants who
>> REALLY dodged the
>> bullet that day, and my faith in a higher power is
>> restored as a result.
>>
>> I will see United 93 when I get the chance, and I
>> will probably
>> enjoy the movie for its realness and historical
>> significance, but
>> forgive me if I do not embrace the Muslim world for
>> the rest of my
>> life. The Islamic world is no friend of the West,
>> and although we may
>> be able to get along with their governments in the
>> future, the stated
>> goal of Islam is world conquest through Jihad and it
>> is the extremist
>> Jihadists, backed and funded by "friendly" Moslem
>> governments, whom we
>> have to fear the most.
>>
>> We must have a presence in the Middle East, and we
>> must have friends in
>> the Middle East, even if we have to fight wars to
>> get them.
>>
>> Only someone who has dodged a bullet can fully
>> appreciate that fact.
>>
>>
>> Best to all,
>> Pat Gilmore
>

[singpilot]

Good one. There are so many people in my industry that dodged a bullet that day, myself included.

But we didn't, really. Things are no better than they were then, except that all of the procedures have been changed, and the LCD TSA employee now has veto autority over the pilots that are still flying. It's why you always see pilots being strip searched at the check-in. These Leemos are convinced they are gonna get one of us trying to hijack a plane. Yep. Any day now.

[schamp]

Wow, well written. Having lost a relative at the Pentagon I tend to agree with you. Spencer Champion

[Joeaksa]

The poster is incorrect in one area. You DO NOT have to be a US Citizen to have a FAA ATP. I know of thousands of foreigners who hold them and 99.999% of them are our friends and allies.

Second, most of what he says is correct. Like Michael (Singpilot) I am a captain of a commercial jet aircraft and have seen more than my share of flight crew being hassled. Why? Who knows but we will not put up with their crap like some of the others and they know it. Major airlines now advise their crews to go through security "as a crew" and not one by one to stop this harassment by TSA. It helps...

Was sitting on the ground in NYC on 9/11 when they hit. My copilot ran back down to the plane and told me to shut everything down and come watch... Within minutes most of us knew it was Bin Laden as he was the only one crazy enough to try something like this.

Do not believe it will happen that way again unless they hijack one plane just to show that they can do it. Feel it will be ground or sea based next time and hope that we catch the bastards in time...

[Tobra]

Riveting



Sea based is my guess. You can float a lot of stuff and the ocean is a big place. They could fill a oil tanker with diesel and fertilizer and cruise it right into San Fran, or any big ocean front city for that matter; I suppose a tanker truck is plenty big too, and a bit more maneuverable.

[dad911]

As much as I would like to believe it, my initial reaction is that this email is a fake. A compilation of UAL93 and Catch me if you can.

If it was that easy to get rides on the jump seat, why didn't the terrorists do that on 9/11 for easier cockpit access?

[charleskieffner]

what drives me nuts is the FBI agent here in phx made mention of these guys training here and no action being taken after they left flight schools! hell of a story!

[Jims5543]

Originally posted by Joeaksa

Was sitting on the ground in NYC on 9/11 when they hit. My copilot ran back down to the plane and told me to shut everything down and come watch... Within minutes most of us knew it was Bin Laden as he was the only one crazy enough to try something like this.

Do not believe it will happen that way again unless they hijack one plane just to show that they can do it. Feel it will be ground or sea based next time and hope that we catch the bastards in time...

My cousin worked in the WTC in 1993 when the truck bomb went off. He went back to work the next day, quit and moved to Florida. His boss laughed at him for quitting, my cousin told his boss that they would not stop until they took those buildings out, this statement was responded to with laughter.

He immediatly came to my mind as I watched the attacks on TV.

Joe - I hope you are right I hope those bastards are caught.

He dodged a bullet and so did my family if 35+ day out is close. I was standing in the WTC as a tourist in July 2001 and promised my son we would go on the roof next year when we returned, I did not realize you could go up to the roof and noticed the access as we were leaving.

[Jims5543]

Originally posted by dad911
As much as I would like to believe it, my initial reaction is that this email is a fake. A compilation of UAL93 and Catch me if you can.

If it was that easy to get rides on the jump seat, why didn't the terrorists do that on 9/11 for easier cockpit access?

My thoughts were if Atta was such a newb in the cockpit and was potraying himself as a legit pilot I have t wonder why none of this was reported to anyone? I know on 9/10/01 this was a different world but man, if this is true it sounds to me like a scene from a Leonardo and Tom movie.

[Moses]

During the flight with Atta it became clear that he did not really know how to fly a 767, he was NOT a US citizen and was NOT really an American Airlines pilot. Yet the pilot did not even report the incident because the paperwork "appeared to be in order"?

I'm sorry, but either the story is false or the guy is an idiot.

[Rick Lee]

Atta was not a Saudi. He was Egyptian.

[Tobra]

Originally posted by Rick Lee
Atta was not a Saudi. He was Egyptian.

and if this were true and it was Atta, I am sure he would have been truthful

[Rick Lee]

If I were Atta I would have said plenty of other countries besides Saudi Arabia. Besides, I think he was here on his real passport, wasn't he?

[RPKESQ]

Amazing leap of faith here. How almost any connection at all is used to show divine intervention and amazing luck.
I fly on airlines all the time, I am in NY or Washington quite often, hell, and I even have been in PA diving through where Flt. 93 went down. Boy, have I "dodged the bullet"! Reminds me of a neighbor younger than I who claimed to be a victim of the Holocaust. When I pointed out that even if she was a newborn, she could not have been in the camps, she replied her parents were, so that means she could claim that. I promptly replied that I was a victim of the Irish Potato Famine, the Scottish "Clearings", the sinking of the Lusitania, along with various other events, because my parents or grand parents or great grandparents suffered through these.

[Joeaksa]

Originally posted by dad911
As much as I would like to believe it, my initial reaction is that this email is a fake. A compilation of UAL93 and Catch me if you can.

If it was that easy to get rides on the jump seat, why didn't the terrorists do that on 9/11 for easier cockpit access?

It used to be very easy to jumpseat on an airliner if you had the right documents, qualified and one of the two seats up front were empty.

Now its gone away and not everyone is happy about it. Eventually we all hope that it will return but who knows.

It is possible that this email above is valid but who knows...

Joe A

[cashflyer]

At the flight school where I earned my instructors certificate, I was amazed at how many foreigners there were. There were Philippinos, Central Americans, and Africans scattered throughout the housing building - along with us regular Americans. But what surprised me was how many middle-easterners there were - so many that they basically filled a whole wing of the building. This was in 1998.

Who would have known that just a few years later, Zacarias Moussaoui would receive flight training there. And although they received their training in Florida, both Mohammed Atta and Marwan al-Shehhi had tried to enroll at the school around the same time I was there.

The school closed in September of 2005, as tightened visa restrictions made it difficult to get the high numbers of foreign students that they relied on. (So "foreigner oriented" was the school that Suriname had the school do all of their initial pilot training for their Air Force pilots).