Is my radar detector useless now? Another speed thread.
 

This is another speed question but this morning on my way into work my radar detector which picks up laser started blinking laser by the time I glanced at it, I already saw the bike cop and had I been speeding, I would have been hit with a ticket. Apparently from this site, laser guns are quite accurate and you really have no advanced notice, what options do you have as a driver besides slow down. I usually know the places where they sit but all it takes is a split second for them to get an accurate reading.

Speed traps are prohibited in CA law so isn't an officer waiting with a laser gun targeting cars in a particular zone and his partner awaits his call and tickets the driver, a speed trap? According to my traffic school leader, a year ago this isn't a speed trap so what gives. They are hiding and awaiting speeding drivers. The only difference is that they move to different zone every day but all along the same route. Common sense tells me this is a trap but apparently not according to the law. I'll have to look up the code.

I used to work one town over from me and on the way up the local Police set up a speed trap on a Boulevard with a low speed limit. Basically a speed trap street.

My observations -

Never lead the pack ALWAYS have a car in front of you. If that means you cannot go as fast as you want to so be it.

If the cop singles you out your screwed. But, if he shoots the car in fron tof you, you should pick up some of the scatter from it. It might only be a split second of a blip but enough to get on the brakes.

I always tell my friends my Laser detection is mearly telling me to pull over for the ticket before the cop does.

Never lead, always follow. I changed my driving habits to do this and it has worked well for me.

A speed trap is where you have a rapid reduction in speed limit with little notice with a cop waiting to give tickets. This was a favorite tactic of every small town on old style highways where the highway runs right through the town. If you drive up the 395 there are signs warning you way in advance when the speed limit is going to decrease. This makes the speed limit decrease from 65 down to 35 or 25 in town not a speed trap, and a cop can be waiting there to give you a ticket.

Get a laser jammer. I'd say that more than 95% of the time if you get a laser hit on a detector, you're had.

Laser jammers, unlike radar jammers, are legal. My Valentine 1 has warned me once or twice of laser, but once or twice it has told me that I was hit (fortunately wasn't speeding by enough at the time)

Not in all states.

Since when is a speed trap illegal? I see them all the time.

AFAIK, states don't have the authority to regulate lasers. Of course, they can't constitutionally limit one's ability to listen to the radio spectrum either, yet VA and DC do that anyway.

Speed traps are illegal in some places, doesn't necessarily mean they don't happen.

Here is the CA vehicle code:

http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/vc/tocd17c3a1.htm

Speed Trap Prohibition

40801. No peace officer or other person shall use a speed trap in arresting, or participating or assisting in the arrest of, any person for any alleged violation of this code nor shall any speed trap be used in securing evidence as to the speed of any vehicle for the purpose of an arrest or prosecution under this code.

Re: Is my radar detector useless now? Another speed thread.
 

I got ticketed this way one time, with laser. I used the words “speed trap” to the officer, and he said no, they call it “saturated enforcement.” I said that sounds like different words for the same thing. I wonder what a judge would have said. Perhaps we have traffic lawyer on board that can tell us what the legal definitions are.

This ticket was before I got my V1, so I don’t know if it would have given me any warning. There were two motorcycle cops in a pullout, shooting up the road. I might have gotten lucky when they targeted another car, by picking up some scatter, but I doubt it.

The cop was friendly. He actually let me try the laser gun! When you look through its view finder, you see a small target in the center. When I used it on a car that was maybe 100 feet away, the target was about two feet in diameter, maybe even less. Unless your V1 gets some reflection off your hood or something, which is unlikely, you won’t even know you’ve been hit until you see the red lights in your mirror. And even if your V1 signals you, it’s too late. To use the gun, you look through the view finder until you have the target placed over the car you want to check. Then you pull the trigger. The speed is shown in the view finder immediately. If they are targeting you, there is no possible way you can slow down. Your only hope is that you can get a reflection off a car being targeted ahead of you and slow down before it’s your turn. Of course, this is the case with radar as well, but radar beams are much larger than laser beams, and they reflect around quite a bit more as well, so you have a fighting chance.

I have yet to have a confirmed positive laser warning from my V1, and I know they use it in my area. I've seen cops with guns and never got either a laser or radar warning. I get confirmed positives with radar all the time. It goes off and I can spot the cop and radar gun. I’ve had numerous false signals from laser, mostly from brake lights ahead of me. I’d like to know if anyone thinks they got a laser reflection off another car. If you are being targeted, it’s too late. I have never heard of a case where someone got a laser warning off another car and had time to slow down before it was their turn to get targeted.

LOL! Who knew!

There goes the traffic ticket I just received a few weeks ago. . . I'm off to call a lawyer.

I have the V1 and have been hit with the laser it is so fast you have no time to react. The favorite trick out here are the roads with wide shoulders then they hit you the other direction flip a U and stop you.
Then repeat the other direction.

The advice to follow, never lead, is the soundest here. I love it when some Rice boy wants to "race" me. He "wins", then I use him as the pigeon, following 1/2 mile or so behind. My V-1 will sound off, but it's the pigeon in the sights of the laser or radar gun. I don't screw around in towns...you never gain enough time to make it worth the risk, and there's no fun in it anyway.

Re: Re: Is my radar detector useless now? Another speed thread.
 

I have confirmed laser warnings with my V-1 and you are right. If you are the front car your busted.

I knew about this one speed trap that was set up every week. One motorcycle cop would stand in the middle of the divided boulevard with the laser gun while his gang waited down the side road. He would aim the laser gun like a real gun at the car coming towards him. He could even spin around and get the cars in both directions.

I got nailed as the front car one time and he got me from pretty far away. The way my V-1 behaved taught me something.

(Side note: I am a lad surveyor and we use lasers to shoot distances now. We used to use infared with a reflector and still do, its very fast to use, but if we want to we can turn on a laser and shoot to an object and bounce back for a measurement. You have to get a clean shot and some objects will not bounce back the beam it will absorb it)

My V-1 would go to full warning to no warning to full warning, like a laser was being waved at it. This was the cop trying to find a good reflection to bounce the neam off of you. On a Porsche the headlight is perfect. On a car like a 944 it becomes more difficult and a black 944 makes it almost impossible to bounce a beam off of. (No front license plate helps a lot) My RX-7 is black and a dream come true. Althoug I have not tested this yet it is documented to be almost impossible to bounce a beam off these cars.

So a week later I am driving the same road, same speed trap, this time I am like 3 cars back in a pack coming down the road towards the cops. I start getting intermittent warnings , again, like a laser being waved ay my car except shorter bursts. I slowed down and there he was in the middle of the road.

I hope this info helps.

I think a black miata is pretty good too except for the front license plate.

Sounds like a good excuse to keep the front plate off the car.

It's a lot easier to say "it fell off" or whatever and risk a "fix-it" ticket than risk getting busted by a speed trap.

I suck at this stuff I have so much in my head and do not get it all out.

I can confirm the black not reflacting issue because we have a problem bouncing our laser off a black object. The lighter the objec t the easier to get a lock.

I it is really hard to get a good shot in with a hand held laser gun, if you notice a lot of the time they are leaning on something and bracing their arms or hands so they can get the gun really steady.

The farther away you are the hard it is to get a lock but, they must start from pretty far because they need to get a good shot at you. My advice? If you are in front and a warning sounds change lanes quickly and safely. Do not wreck!!

After I got zapped I did a ton of research on this subject, it was really pissing me off.

Good read:

http://www.radartest.com/article.asp?articleID=100541

BTW - I have never felt so singled out by police radar and laser until I purchased my Porsche. When driving through Georgian in it I swear they are causing me to grow a brain tumor from all the shots they take at me.

A laser detector basically only gives you a warning in advance that you are already busted. The only way to beat laser is with a jammer. Well worth the investment and it's saved my bacon several times.

http://www.blinder.dk/

I also have the V-1 for radar. I'd turn off the laser detection if I could, it;s worthless...

I think this should help
http://www.valentine1.com/lab/MikesLabRpt3.asp

Know your road...
http://speedtrap.org

I found a place that has the blinder M20 for $312, that's a pretty good deal if you ask me. That's a ticket or almost a ticket. Would pay for itself almost right away.

I hadn't realized that they often have to hit you a couple of times to get a good shot. That must be why I got hit three times the other day leaving school. I pulled out of the school, got hit, drove another 25 yards, got hit again, stopped at a light, started driving and then got hit again. About 1/8 mile down the road I saw a sheriff in an SUV on the side of the road firing out of his side window.

Interesting discussion and I must agree I like the follow idea which I will try to do more of. My last ticket was coming down a hill about 15 months ago so I am trying to play it more safe for the next 5 or 6 months.
With more daylight, these guys are everywhere which takes the fun out of driving. The majority of people commuting the back roads to work are going at a speed safe for road conditions but it is above the speed limit and they know this and are targeting everyone. The only place I can open it up anymore is the toll-road and that is barely above 80. The track bug will probably hit me in the next couple of years.

I have no front plate and I still got hit. I think that is an urban legend.

Likewise for the color. My car is a very dark blue, often mistaken for black. Again, probably an urban myth.

And it is easy to target a vehicle and get a lock. When I tried it, I held up the gun, looked at a car and pulled the trigger. I got a valid speed reading in a second or two. No bracing my arms, no training, nothing. It was point and shoot, even simpler than a camera.

Kang what kind of car?

An Blinder M-20 is in my near future.

The laser beam is extremely narrow and usually aimed at your license plate or headlights, so your detector may not even see it, and if it does, you've probably been painted. The only way to defeat it is with a jammer, or "shifter" as Escort calls it. They have sensor/transmitters that you place next to your license plates that instantly jam the radar as soon as it's detected. Since this is illegal in many states, you should slow down, then turn off the jammer so the LEO can read your speed without suspecting he was jammed.

It's a B.S. game that's all about money. That little excerpt from the C.V.C. about speed traps is quite interesting. I'm pretty certain I'm going to win my ticket defense based on that or a number of other reasons (waiting for lawyer to call back to discuss).

Funny thing is I actually wouldn't have minded paying the fine so much since I got bagged obviously exceeding the speed limit. I'd have been perfectly content to pay up, do the traffic school and go on with my life. . . But oh-no. Mr. Hardass CHP guy has to write it up for 77 in a 45 which makes you ineligible for traffic school and facing the prospect of a point on the license and heightened insurance rates. Eff that. I'd rather pay a lawyer (who's actually going to work for the money) than a do-nothing insurance company that's charging criminal rates to begin with (insert comment about illegal aliens here).

I can't wait to beat this. I won't give the friggin' insurance companies the satisfaction of it - even if it does cost a little bit more. . .

And I'm buying a V1 first chance I can once this is all over.

I know the V1 is preferred by most, and rightly so as it provides directional as well as multiple source information. But Escort offers some integrated alternatives that include laser shifting. The ZR3 can be added to an existing Passport 8500, for example.

http://www.passportsr1.com/

What proof do you have that he targeted your car, the word of the officer? My nature is to be extremely skeptical. Do they have to show you the laser gun and your speed on it? If they refuse because one officer targeted you and the other is ticketing you, again the intent to trap a driver was there. This is a speed trap plain and simple, forget the definition in the vehicle code. What if they clear the gun to go after someone else before you see it.

In CA there is a legal definition of a speed trap. Its not what you may think and does not prevent cops from laying in wait for all the speeders that they can ticket. It has to do with the posted speed and if the road was surveyed or not. A survey is used to set speed limits. A road with a speed limit that has not been surveyed is considered a speed trap. Exact details of this law is somewhere in the CA ve code. Some limits, like the 65mph are never speed traps. Bigger problem. Even if you are correct, the ticket is a result of a speed trap, the local judge is "in on the take" so good luck.

Yea I read that. . . I'm still going to forward all this crap. I seriously doubt this road has a traffic survey done on it, particularly within the last 5 years. . .

snowman's a bit right, but not entirely. A speedtrap is defined as when the progress of a vehicle (your car) is timed (by a stopwatch) between two points of known distance. Think of the timing traps at Bonneville. Then your speed is calculated from the distance/time relationship. Speed trap (in the public vernacular) is a totally different concept (i.e. bunch of cops frequently laying in hiding in the same spot, waiting for speeders).

Here's another thing I came across on a moto list I frequent:
http://www.radarbusters.com/support/speedlabs-2006/default.asp

edit: So in Cali, speedtraps (of the Bonneville style) are indeed illegal. Hence, the practice of CHP flying overhead on I-5 and timing your progress based on the large white milemarkers painted on the side of the road is illegal.

Noah, thanks for the link. I'd never seen this site before. Though I takes some findings with a grain of salt since "radar roy" sells Bell, I found a lot of intersting info.