The Inmates are Running the Asylum
 

Try not to "push any buttons" on students by - gasp - asking them for their homework. Learn to tolerate "fuch you" as a normal response from your students. I guess this is all well and good; cow-towing to these undisciplined hoods in school means they will never get anywhere in life. Less of them for my kids to compete with, I guess. Does anyone seriously think these policies can help these kids in the long run?


By HILLARY BORRUD / Staff Writer

VICTORVILLE —Victor Valley Union High School District teachers have been coached on a new approach to disciplining students that has some teachers shaking their heads in disbelief.

Students prepare to leave for the day from Silverado High School in Victorville. An issue has risen whether teachers need to adjust how they interact with and discipline students, particularly those from difficult backgrounds.

One teacher has stepped forward to air her concerns publicly, although she said she is concerned about how doing so could affect her job security.

“There is a cultural war going on and evidently it is going on right at this school site,” said Julie Behrse, an art teacher at Maverick High School. “It really is a movement, and now it has a name,” she added, referring to what Speaker Ray Culberson called the “new professionalism.”

At issue is whether teachers need to adjust how they interact with and discipline students who misbehave, particularly students from difficult backgrounds.

Culberson, director of youth services for the San Bernardino City Unified School District, said at a back-to-school inservice meeting that students today have less respect for authority than they did when many teachers were in school and consequently, some teachers have unrealistic expectations of their students.

According to Culberson, many teenagers come to school with baggage from problems at home or other areas of their lives. Culberson described these students, who are prone to disruptive behavior, as “kids in chaos.”

The district superintendent, Julian Weaver, said Culberson’s message does not represent a change in district disciplinary policy, but Victor Valley has many students from chaotic backgrounds such as Culberson described, and teachers need to learn to interpret their students’ body language. When a student is visibly agitated, the teacher might not want to push any buttons by asking if he or she brought in homework that day.

“We need to see ourselves as teachers and adults in the classroom,” Weaver said, “but we shouldn’t see ourselves as dictators, where students see themselves as far less than the teacher.”

A teacher at Silverado High School, who asked to remain anonymous to protect her job, said she understood Culberson’s message to be that teachers need to do everything possible to reach students and keep them in school.

When Culberson asked the audience how many times they could tolerate hearing “f-— you” from a student and said he could personally handle more than 100 instances a day, the teacher said she felt the presentation became a bit “off the wall.” A teacher next to her told her that she would not tolerate one case of swearing.

Teachers should never take anything a student says personally, Culberson said. He referred to a teacher’s personal “f-— you” meter, meaning the number of times a teenager swears at them before they would discipline the student. If teachers have a low tolerance for bad behavior and frequently send a student out of the classroom, the students will drive them crazy whereas teachers with a high tolerance will be able to calmly follow school procedure and still discipline the student, Culberson said in an interview. Maverick High School principal Beth Crane declined to comment on Culberson’s speech, but principal Tracy Marsh of Silverado High School said state law prohibits vulgarity and swearing in the classroom and allows discipline ranging from suspension to being expelled, no matter what background a student comes from.

“Nothing a person from San Bernardino says can change state law,” Marsh said. “We do want to make sure that the example is set and the tone it set,” he said, referring to student behavior.

He added that although he did not attend the inservice, he spoke to four teachers at Silverado High School who heard the presentation and described it as a positive experience.

According to Weaver, Culberson received a standing ovation.

“Everything that I do is designed for the mental health of the teacher,” Culberson said, and added that he gives presentations free of charge.

A nation of pu$$ies.
Sorry if I offended dog-lovers.

Remember being in school and I looked at her with a 'who do you think you are look' for a old broad she was very fast..my head was ringing.
Had my work done, and learned to say thank you Ms. Mary.
With this type of teaching..why bother ..just give them enough crack for themselves and the family..and let that gene pool drain
Rika

Wow, when I was in school, I wouldn't have made it to the second syllable of a 'fuck you' before a can of whoop-ass was rendered upon me.

And that was at school...if my parents found out? :eek:

Please.

You guys are incredibly insensitive to the plight of “kids in chaos.”
:rolleyes:

I always found that a strong consistent approach to bad behavior served me quite well and my students appreciated it in the end.

Remember when we couldn't even chew gum in class?

Smoking was allowed on high school campus.

A pocket knive was never thought of as a weapon.

A fight was fight and you got your a$$ spanked by the principal and dad!!

The NEA "politically correct" psychobabble strikes again...

I'm so happy to know our tax dollars are being used in the furtherance of such enlightened educational policy. :rolleyes:

'kids in chaos" she's 14 and pregnant,he is 17 and has his dads rap sheet beat by 2 pages,
yup..good plan
Rika

You're all missing the point. This isn't about education at all. The industry doesn't want these kids to develop any "real world" skills. Hell no! They just want them to attend. That's the end game, attendance. The school gets funded, the administration is happy. Educate them? Teach them discipline and responsibility? Why? In the words of Judge Smails, "The world needs ditch diggers, too."

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1156954312.jpg

This is the direct result of "no child left behind". Pretty poor, in my opinion.

No child will be left behind, but as adults they certainly will be. And then we'll be supporting their dead asses.

Another example of the dumbing down of America.

Nah. Some will go to jail, some will go on welfare. Most of them will just hold bad jobs and continue to struggle. Status quo. No one is really concerned about their future, certainly not the CTA.

teachers need to carry a large stick to beat the kids about the head and shoulders. If they can't shape up, then they should be shipped to an island to live like lord of the flies or we could just put them down and save society the trouble. I guess we could make those two options their choice.

I remember a comedian saying once that abortion should be a valid option until the kid is 6 years old. His reasoning is that you don't know if you like the kid until it's been around a while. And besides that, imagine how much easier that would make discipline? If you could just say, "young man, if you keep that up we'll go to the clinic this weekend!"

Maybe he was wrong, maybe the age needs to be 16 or 18.

Maybe anyone that's a little bastard should be put into the military. I suppose that's another option.

pulling ANY stunt verbal or physical while going to brophy college prep was the wrong thing to do..........period! 2 of my jesuit priest teachers were world war II/korean marine chaplains iwo-jima/tarawa/saipan/luzon/inchon veterans. they landed in the landing craft 1st wave in, got shot at , blown up/last rites etc. and everything the same as the GI'S and took NOBODYS CRAP big or small child teenager or adult parent. NO ONES CRAP! my football coach was ex canadian football league coach and took NO ONES CRAP!

for one theology class we had one of the marine vets as a teacher. one day he came in w/another priest who was a scholared theology professor. i mean like a vatican type guy! he was blind! our standard priest introduced him and told us we would be getting todays lesson while he attended to other biz. told us no screwing around. well since he was blind some of the brighter students decided to pull some crap. ie. paper airplanes/spitballs and on and on. well father carrol was one smart man................he had heard all the commotion via intercom in principals office. went over to adjoining building and observed shennagins going on in classroom.

well to make long story short.............father carrol came thru that classroom door like a freaking freight train! he literally YANKED BY THEIR HAIR the 2 main clowns who had been pulling crap out of their chairs and dragged them out of classroom! they were sentenced to cleaning ALL CAMPUS TOILETS FOR THE ENTIRE REST OF THE SEMESTER! i was surprised he didnt beat the crap out of them. and he would have given his druthers.

YOU WERE THERE TO LEARN.........PERIOD! no grades.........no sports. continued bad grades.......afterschool and saturday tutoring. continued bad grades/deportment.............you were kicked out and your folks were out A LOT OF MONEY AND PISSED! hated it when i was going...................respect it now as an adult!

Enlighten me. How does "No Child Left Behind" cause a whole school district to wuss out in the discipline of its students?

Sometimes the "wussing out" is the direct result of threatened or actual legal action and the attendant bad publicity brought about by today's overindulgent parents who believe their offspring can do no wrong.

When I was in junior high, I had quite the disciplinary problems. An endless source of frustration to the school staff and my parents alike. I carried a straight 4.0, even taking the "accelerated" classes, but I was an incurable smart-ass and prankster (you are all surprised, no doubt). On a first-name basis with the vice-principal, the head of school discipline.

So one afternoon, finding myself in his office once again (waiting for my dad...), he grabs his "spat" board. Think cricket bat with holes in it. I knew the drill, so I bent over and grabbed my ankles. When he hit me, I started to giggle (he was a very small Japanese guy). Bad idea. So he calls one of the P.E. teachers, the football coach, and retired NFL player. He shows up about the same time my dad does, so the three of them huddle. Mr. Brown, or Coach Brown, emerges from the huddle with the spat board. He is going to demonstrate proper technique to Mr. Takiiuchi, to ensure no more students giggle when he "spats" them. He damn near drove my head into the ground. By the time I recovered, my dad was holding the spat board and getting tips on his grip from Mr. Brown. So dad damn near drives my head into the ground (a scratch golfer, he knew how to swing things...). Finally, Mr. Takiiuchi has the spat board. "Like this?" I didn't giggle that time. It may not of cured me of being a smart-ass, but I certainly learned where and when it might be appropriate.

Cheating to get the nasty words posted?

From an article concerning Latino immigration in Delaware. This is a small section of the article, but it is instructive concerning this thread.

Not left behind

Given their vulnerability, their high levels of illiteracy, and the language barrier, one naturally expects the children of these immigrants to be struggling a bit. They are not. They are doing extremely--almost shockingly--well. Latinos make up 40 percent of the student population at Georgetown North elementary school, and that percentage is steadily rising. They will make up 55 percent of the first graders who arrive on the first day of school next month. Thanks to No Child Left Behind laws, there is a bevy of data broken down all sorts of ways on school progress. Hispanics in the third grade at Georgetown North are outscoring both whites and blacks in reading comprehension.

This should not surprise us as much as it probably does. Obsessed as we are with upward social mobility, Americans harbor a sneaking assumption that only educated parents can have educated children. Learning, the thinking goes, is a matter of playing Mozart in pregnancy and keeping the Classic Children's Books strewn tastefully about the bedroom. This is quite wrong. You don't learn by aping the learned classes--you learn by taking the work of learning seriously. Latino children come to school as ready to work as their parents do at the plant. Asked if Latino parents did anything differently, James Hudson, the principal at North Georgetown, says, "The first question parents ask at parent-teacher conferences is not 'How are my child's grades?' but 'How is my child's behavior?'" "

There may also be a political factor behind young Latino students' success. In the early decades of mass immigration--say from the seventies through the nineties--a lot of the ideas about what makes a new community successful were simply borrowed from the utopian left of the civil rights movement. One great advantage of the Delaware immigration, it turns out, is that it happened after a lot of baseless nostrums of the caring professions were discredited. Institutions were built up in the more pragmatic spirit of Gingrich Republicanism, without any immigrants'-rights establishment protecting its entrenched programs and its turf.

Asked about bilingual education, Hudson gives a look as if he's never heard the term before. "The key is that all kids have access to the regular curriculum," he says. "You don't want to isolate them from what the other kids are learning." North Georgetown has three English-Language Learner teachers. One of them, Meg Lawson, says that her immigrant students are possessed of a great curiosity. "They like the nonfiction more than the fiction. That surprised me." Her second-graders last year particularly liked learning about hibernation and migration. What about teaching them about their culture? "I try to do different books that aren't about their own culture," she says. "They know their own culture. Some tests try to use more names like José or Juan. I don't think that makes a difference."

In rural areas, school systems are doubly important, because some of the work of assimilation that cities do automatically doesn't get done there. An urban immigrant has to know enough English to buy a subway token. A rural immigrant can disappear into a subculture as iso lated as that of the Amish. Such subcultures can be picturesque and upstanding, but it is probably a mistake to encourage them when the influx of immigrants is as large as it is today.

I got smacked in the face once by the principal in junior high - I will never forget it. And I never repeated what earned me that action.

That isn't about teachers or the NEA - it's lazy parents and parents who are just praying for a chance to make a quick buck in a lawsuit. I'm sure there are a lot of teachers who would love the chance to straighten out a few "kids in chaos." But then they'd never be teachers again.

Great article, Seahawk.

Now throw in the "No kid left behind" policy and you have a school full of kids not going anywhere because the "kid in Chaos" is not interested in learning anything.

We made sure to buy a house in a school district that has a zero tolerance to misbehavior. They do not make excuses for the "kid in chaos" they prefer to look at school as a safe haven where this kid can go and have structure.