Where are all the Schumi lovers now ??

[StevoRocket]

Shame we didnt get Jensen Button in the Ferarri next year - last race - 14th to third - not the first time hes raced from the back to be on the podium.....
A very similar performance to the Schumacher or Alonso performance.

Watch this space if Honda ever get their act together....

[Jims5543]

Originally posted by JSDSKI
Alonso is the youngest first time WDC (both times!) and the youngest to win back-to-back. Next year he's still one of the youngest drivers yet he will have the most wins of anyone on the grid (15). All this in just five seasons - one of which was with Minardi !!

Not to take anything away from MS, his talent, or unbelievable drive yesterday in an obviously superior car - but FA is no slouch. It will be very interesting to see if he can do for McLaren what MS did for Ferrari. Both Stewart and Lauda think he can.

How long do you think Ferrari can hold together without MS, Brawn, and Stepney (all from Benentton - which also fathered Renault) ?

FA won his last Championship. That is clear, he screwed the pooch leaving Renault, he panicked last year when Kimi was so fast and knew McLaren cannot be unreliable for too long. Unfortunatly they are no longer very fast.

Renault will be fast next year, Honda will be too. I think Ferrari will be good for a year or two more maybe enough to see Kimi take a championship. It will take a bit to undo all MS has done there the cars will still be good.

You have to remember, lots of these teams have to switch to Bridgestone next year, this will affect greatly guys like FA.

There is a rumor on the streets that MS might form his own team? I do not believe it but the mechanics at the local Mercedes dealership are positive he will have his own team.

[JSDSKI]

Originally posted by Jim Cesiro
FA won his last Championship. That is clear, he screwed the pooch leaving Renault, he panicked last year when Kimi was so fast and knew McLaren cannot be unreliable for too long.

Come on Jim. He's what, 25? If motivated, he has another ten years at the top at least. With a bit of luck - he could win one or two more - although he says his goal is three. I think he left Renault because corporate could not decide whether or not to support F1 over the next few years while they restructured (and thought about the GM deal). FA didn't want to be without a top ride with Ferrari (where KR was already signed) or Mac. So he signed with Mac. Ironically, he may have been better off with Red Bull - he would have had an unleashed Newey, a Renault engine, and a team on the way up !

Anyway, now that the master (MS) retired - the next few years will be more interesting and competitive.

I'm guessing that KR and Massa will split Ferrari wins and let FA sneak through to the WDC with Fisi, Weber, Button, and Robert Kubica each winning a GP next year. Anybody else have some predictions?

[Dottore]

Originally posted by JSDSKI

I'm guessing that KR and Massa will split Ferrari wins and let FA sneak through to the WDC with Fisi, Weber, Button, and Robert Kubica each winning a GP next year. Anybody else have some predictions?

I think the Kimi/Massa rivalry will be very interesting.

It is really a stretch to picture FA getting the WDC with his new ride. Can't see it somehow.

There are far too many unknowns next season for meaninful predictions - except for one: it will be very interesting.

[Jims5543]

Scott - I think his 2005 win was a fluke and a "right place at the right time in the right car" thing. Renault was able to capitalize on Ferrari and Bridgestones failure to adapt to the new rules.

The F2005 was probably the worst car Ferrari built in years, they scrapped the car over the winter and developed off the F2004 chasis and then dumped the F-2000 name for good riddence.

FA was in the most consistantly fast car in the field in 2005 and the 1st 1/2 of 2006. The last half of 2006 the rest of the field cought up to Renault.

I was suprised to read that Jensen scored the most points in the last 7 races of the season. I would have thought it was MS and that in itself shows you how much better all the teams are getting.

The last 7 races were coming down to reliability and driver.

Agree with you 100%, I think next season will be really fun. I am imagining 5+ drivers all in reach of the championship by the time we get to China again.

Or my other thought is Kimi and Massa run away with the points like MS and Rubins did in 2004.

[Rodeo]

You guys that are writing off FA next year are forgetting that McLaren had the fastest car in the field two years ago, but a combination of lousy luck and reliability problems killed them. This past year they were both slow and unreliable.

But McLaren is a good team. They will be back. And no matter how you feel about FA, the only driver that can rival him in skill and composure is Kimi.

Having said that, tires are going to be a massive factor next year, and the edge has to go to the Bridgestone teams that have lots of testing and racing on them. They'll have the data, they'll have the experience, and they will have the personal relationships that can make all the difference.

[Lothar]

Watch for the mass exodus from Ferrari: Rory Byrne, Ross Braun, Nigel Stepney and maybe even Jean Todt. If the brain trust disappears, Kimi will be screwed. It won't all happen next year but it will over the next few. With MS gone, Ferrari will sink into another long slump.

Watch for Red Bull with Adrian Newey designs and a strong engine package next year. Renault will be fast again, but they flat out got screwed this year over the mass-damper system. Ferrari can have those funky things on the rear wheels but Renault has their cool trick banned. F1 looks like a joke with inconsistent rulings like that.

McLaren needs to take a page out of Ross Braun's book. They need to make the car reliable, then make it faster. Both Ferrari and Renault had reliability in spades over McLaren.

Toyota must make it happen next year or I predict the parent company will pull the plug. Japanese companies maintain a holding company mentality. No success leads to dumping the asset.

[Deschodt]

>I think his 2005 win was a fluke and a "right place at the right time in the right car" thing. Renault was able to capitalize on Ferrari and Bridgestones failure to adapt to the new rules.

Jim, I think you just described 99% of the world champions of the modern era, and possibly of the old days as well.

Chris Amon for instance was probably one of the most talented drivers to never win much in F1. He picked the worst damn car /team every time. Sir Stirling Moss too, should ring a bell ? Never was a World champ !

In modern era F1, if you do not have the best car you do not have a chance. Right place right time right car is the ONLY way to win a championship these days. The car is 70% in my opinion, if not more. All of those guys, even Sato (Ok, not yamomoto or whatever) are super talented and would do very well in the WC car. Maybe 4 or 5 of them are another step above and would become world champion.

I think reducing Alonso's feat to right place right time show your Ferrari bias... The guy performed very impressively under massive pressure, and did it 2 years running.

Who was to say Renault was going to kick Ferrari's butt 2 years running back in 2004? Not me ! Kudos to Alonso for being in the right place.

Kudos to Schumi for being in the right place for the past 7 years too, and at Benetton before that - even more astute he picked a time where Senna was dead and Prost retired, how smart of him. (end sarcasm) Y

Not being a smart ass here you know what I am saying. It's mostly the car. A top notch driver might get the most of a level 2 car, but it will take a top notch car to be WC.... I think Alonso is top notch, Raikonnen is as well, Schumi definitely, Hakkinen was... Raikonnen might be!

Right place at the right time with so-so talent ? That's Damon Hill, in my book.... If McLaren produces a decent car, FA has a decent chance to repeat in the next 3 years... Remember Ferrari is losing its best people next year ! They'll be OK in 07, but 08 is another ball'oWax !

[imcarthur]

Any way you slice it, MS departing & all of the other things happening will make it a great racing year or two.

Here's a clip to remember the 'good ole days":

1979 - Gilles vs Rene

Supposedly sped up a bit . . .

Ian

[Jims5543]

This is why I love F1.

I guess we will see next year. I stand behind my prediction, I have made before. FA will win 2-3 races I will be suprised if he wins more than that, and I do not expect to see him on the podium much.

The Mclaren is fragile and a guy that fractured his knee crashing over curbs in his Renault is about to get in one. He will break a lot next year. Crap!! The damn cars loose mirrors during practice!!

Now, I think Renault will be a fst car next year but, they have never raced on Bridgestones crappy tires so I might take that back.

I am counting the days until next season starts and all these questions and predictions will be answered.

[Deschodt]

Actually I think you are generous... While I think FA has a shot at another championship generally speaking, I don't mean next year necessarily. I'd be surprised if he won 3 races in the mcLaren ;-) I agree it will break some more... Maybe 08 when Ferrari declines...
But McLaren is too astute a team to stay mediocre long !

Renault will not be a contender next year because they kept Fisichella, he's a great 6th place finisher.... Maybe Kovalainen will shine, I hope so !

I'm hoping from great stuff from Weber in the Redbull designed by Newey - but I think newey is overrated.... And hopefully Kubica too !!! But overall I expect a walkover from Raikonnen, like 10 victories !

[Jims5543]

But you forgot another huge factor. in '08 traction control is gone and FA relies on TC heavily. He will have to relearn how to drive.

You can argue that so will many others but many others do not lean on it like he does.

When they showed him and MS side by side MS's TC light would ever so flicker and FA's would be stuck on.

A lot of Renaults success has been due to their superior TC and launch control.

[Doug E]

Yup, next season should be a good one for sure.

Just for kicks wouldn't it be great if by the middle of the season MS is soooooooooo bored not racing that he volunteers to drive the Spyker MF1 for a race or two

[JSDSKI]

Stole this from an AtlasF1 thread. Alonso talking about his turn in style. It is HIS reaction and adjustment to a fundamentally understeering car - which the Renault is. He's probably more adaptible than most give him credit. Remember he won championships in every series before F1 with no TC and less aero.


Q:One of the things that emerges from those debriefings is that you have a unique style – an aggressive approach with the car’s steering. Is that deliberate?

Alonso: It is not something I realize I am doing – but it is what the telemetry shows. I think it may be a way of adapting to the car, because when I was at Minardi and when I tested for Jaguar, I didn’t drive like this. The technique allows me to control the understeer easily – I turn in later than many drivers, and do it aggressively. Once I have done that, I can just make small adjustments to the steering from the apex and find the right balance to be quick on the exit. Everybody has their style, and that is mine at the moment. But it is always changing – the car is never the same from one lap to the next, the reactions and conditions evolve all the time. Ultimately, I don’t think the style is the important thing; it is about how well you can adapt to the way the car changes all the way through the race.

[Owain]

Originally posted by Jim Cesiro
But you forgot another huge factor. in '08 traction control is gone and FA relies on TC heavily. He will have to relearn how to drive.

I don't think we can say this about FA just yet. It's the sign of a good driver who takes advantage of what he has. The fact that he's making use of his traction control is not a sign that he can't drive without it. It's already been pointed out in this thread that he's been successful in cars that don't have it. He just has a different driving style than MS. You could probably compare any 2 F1 drivers and they would all have slightly different styles.

You can hate FA all you like, but at some point you have to admit that he has a lot of talent. He's faster and more consistant than his teammates and has now won back-to-back driver's titles. On the latter point, in the 50 odd years of the Championship there are only a handfull of drivers who've done that: Ascari, Fangio, Brabham, Prost, Senna, Schumacher and Häkkinen (isn't wikipedia great?). That's a pretty rarefied group to be in.

I also don't think we can discount McLaren. Not that I think they're going to win the championship next year, but that's a team that won't stay down for long. They've been very successful under Ron Dennis and I don't see that era ending without a fight, especially if Mercedes stays with the team. Historically speaking all teams have had good years followed by bad. It's a testament to how quickly things change in F1, and is a good thing IMO. It keeps things fresh and interesting