China Cracks Down On Labor Abuse?

[M.D. Holloway]

China Cracks Down On Labor Abuse
By Christopher Bodeen, Associated Press Writer


ZHENGZHOU, China (AP) - China's trade union federation has ordered a nationwide crackdown on labor abuses following gruesome revelations of workers being beaten, starved and forced to slave away in brick yards for no pay.

Grass roots trade unions have been ordered to ''immediately carry out a thorough examination to stop the violation of migrant workers' rights,'' the All-China Federation of Trade Unions said in a statement published Tuesday in state media.

Federation official Zhang Mingqi was quoted as saying the group was ''extremely shocked and indignant'' on hearing of the slavery cases.

At least 568 workers have been freed, including dozens of boys, and 168 people detained following media revelations that prompted a series of police raids in recent weeks in the north-central provinces of Henan and Shanxi.

Few details were given in the federation's statement and similar crackdowns have been ordered in past to little effect. However, the statement adds to signs of high-level concern over the issue, which last week prompted President Hu Jintao and other top leaders to order a thorough cleanup of such abuses.

China's 200 million migrant workers have long been victimized through poor or withheld pay, summary termination and discrimination in housing, health and education for their children.

Typically, slaves were sold to kilns for $66 by people traffickers who abducted the young and weak from train and bus stations or off the street, and lured the stronger with false promises of good paying jobs.

The use of slave workers came under the spotlight in part because of an open letter posted online signed by a group of 400 fathers appealing for help in tracking missing sons they believed were sold to kiln bosses.

The fathers accused Henan and Shanxi authorities of ignoring them or even protecting the kilns. At least one village-level Communist Party chief has been investigated after his son was found to be running a kiln that used slaves.

The fathers' letter said about 1,000 children were being forced to work at kilns under conditions of extreme cruelty, but that number has been impossible to verify.

Authorities have appeared to muzzle further reporting on the scandal after a a flurry of television and newspaper reports last week, including lurid pictures of slave workers with bloody patches of skin burned or rubbed raw.

Tuesday's newspapers in Henan's provincial capital Zhengzhou, where the story first broke, contained no items on the slavery and the local television station did not return calls seeking comment.

Zhang's statement said the crackdown would target industries that typically employ migrants, including manufacturing, construction, mining and restaurants. Unions must unearth abuses and cooperate with local police in rectifying problems, the statement said.

Unions have ''failed to play a significant enough role in rural areas,'' Zhang said.

[MRM]

China is slowly getting better. The central government does want to join the world and is realizing slave labor is bad for business. The countryside conditions are poor, even by Chinese standards because the areas are so remote there's little oversight from anyone other than the local warlord, I mean party chieftan. Part of what is going on is a struggle between the central government and the local provinces over control.

[Superman]

The article is a pack of lies and you guys are misinformed. Obviously. Based on information I have gathered from several posters here, on Pelican OT, these abuses are impossible. First, business leaders have scruples. And second, all-powerful "market forces" prevent these kinds of abuses. No need for regulations or investigations. "The Market" has its own checks and balances which prevent this sort of thing.

[legion]

Supe, you've obviously ignored the bit about "the U.S. already has laws to prevent this kind of abuse". Clearly, China does not.

I actually hope China does get powerful unions. It will drive the cost to produce there up and lead to laws that make safety and wages competitive with the rest of the world. However, once that purpose is accomplished, there is little need to keep the unions around.

[Superman]

Just like the ol' trick where you tell someone you placed the item "under there." That's one way of getting someone to say "underwear."

Today, Legion said labor regulations are a needed and labor unions will be good for China.

[legion]

Supe, you seem to read a lot more into my musings than is actually there.

You also seem to think that you have somehow outsmarted me.

It's simple really. Unions serve a valuable purpose when an economy is developing. Once developed, they should be disgarded. They are like scaffolding or temporary bracing.

Where is China, developmentally speaking?

Where is the U.S.?

[Superman]

I didn't mean to imply that I outsmarted you. Nope.

Yes, I understand your conclusions. No, I don't completely agree but again, I'm not behind you in terms of labor awareness and trying to catch up. I learned fifteen years ago that many Labor leaders would like nothing more than to see labor laws repealed. They do take the place of labor unions in some ways.

But again, I don't entirely agree with you. To me, labor unions are citizen groups. Citizen involvement and decision-making is not just necessary in an evolving country. They are still important when that country matures.

No, I was not making fun of you. I do enjoy hearing gubmit bashers admit that government regulation is necessary, but that was no trick. Just a brute reality that folks often enjoy denying.

I've had my fun. You guys can go back to pretending that gubmit is useless.

[Moneyguy1]

I, too, believe that labor unions are citizen organizations. Such organizations can be used for good or not, depending on the amount of power given to the leadership. No system works without opposing forces to provide balance.

[M.D. Holloway]

Originally posted by legion
Supe, you seem to read a lot more into my musings than is actually there.

You also seem to think that you have somehow outsmarted me.

It's simple really. Unions serve a valuable purpose when an economy is developing. Once developed, they should be disgarded. They are like scaffolding or temporary bracing.

Where is China, developmentally speaking?

Where is the U.S.?

I understand and agree - and really one can say the same for governments and religions. In certain instances, a dictatorship is needed. When a civilization and culture begins to evolve, fire worship, paganism and wika all would make sense.

It is not until a culture evolves that a different government, religion and business do the same. Natural progression. Call it evolution.

[legion]

Originally posted by Superman
To me, labor unions are citizen groups. Citizen involvement and decision-making is not just necessary in an evolving country. They are still important when that country matures.

Supe, I think this quote beautifully illustrates where our viewpoints diverge.

If unions were truly citizen groups, I would be behind you 100%

Where I come from (Chicago, Peoria), unions have these things called "bosses". In fact, the term "Union Boss" is the epitome of entrenched, nepotistic power. Ever heard of Jimmy Hoffa? Who is the head of the teamsters now?

No, I submit that unions are dictatorships, not citizen groups. In their present form, they should be discarded. If you could transform them into true citizen groups, I feel most of their negatives would vanish. For example, the Union Bosses would no longer put their personal enrichment above that of their members. They would not push an "us versus them" mentality on the rank and file to fool them into working against their own self interest--from destroying the very companies that provide their livelihood to forcing companies to find creative ways to avoid union jobs (outsourcing, closing factories).

[MRM]

I have a degree in HR. My dad was an HR director in a mixed union/non-union environment. When I went to law school I wanted to be a union buster. Anyway, much of what you say about unions and union bosses and that unions in the US are archaic has to do with the US law regulating unions. They're stuck in the 19th century. Unions and management are barred by law from cooperating too closely because in the old days management would co-opt the union and the workers would be no better of than before.

That being said, what China needs now is a union movement circa 1920. Read a little history on working conditions and life expectancies in US mines and factories from 1890-1939 and the strike busting methods used on the workers and you'll have a new appreciation for unions.

Little known fact, there have only been two times in US history where height and life expectancies decreased for the new generation. The first time was the gilded age, roughly 1890 to 1919, due to polution and working conditions. The second time? Now. The obesity epidemic has actually reduced expected height and life expectancies. Height is an important indicator of the wellbeing of the species. Right now the Europeans are doing better than us. I'm sure it has nothing to do with their unions but I'm sure they'd be happy to claim credit.

[Hawktel]

I did read a article on how the price of pork in china is recently rising quickly, and getting pigs is very difficult, and that the Government is considering releasing a pork "strategic reserve" they have.

Its interesting because it highlights that the Chinese are eventually going to price themselves out of them being our cheap labor manufacturing go to. The simple fact is they now have a rising standard of living. And it seems that rising standard is for one of the first time is moving quicker up the scale than the industrial growth can sustain long term.

I'm not sure how that will work. They haven't invested the profits they earned from us into building something thats viable after they are no longer the cheapest labor we can find, that I have seen.

[M.D. Holloway]

Its not easy keeping 1+ billion people happy. Normally, China would keep them dumb, hungry and poor and get away with it. Not so much the case anymore. More and more of the population are getting wise to the comfy ways albeit minimal.

I don't think you will see a revolution. I do think you will see a much more active capitalistic activity followed by increased tarifs over the next few years. Don't be so surprised if they become strange bedfellows with African nations. Stranger things have happened...

[M.D. Holloway]

'A social revolution will soon transform China, and multinationals that do business there can’t afford to ignore it. So far, they have mostly focused on the country’s tiny minority of urban-affluent consumers. But as more Chinese migrate to the cities for higher-paying work, they are steadily climbing the income ladder. By 2011, McKinsey research suggests, China should have a lower middle class of 290 million people; by 2025, the upper middle class will be 520 million strong, with staggering disposable wealth. For many multinationals, this is the market of the future.



'Multinational companies should remember that as incomes rise, spending patterns change: food and other necessities account for a smaller proportion of household budgets, discretionary expenses such as recreation for a larger one. Meanwhile, however, tomorrow’s middle-class consumers are today’s relatively poor urban workers. By serving them now, a company can gain the experience needed to stay in the game as their incomes and tastes evolve.

As global companies have entered China, many of them focused mainly on serving its urban-affluent consumers. However, if these companies continue to use this strategy they risk missing the real opportunity—the emerging middle class.

During the next 20 years we expect a huge middle class, with enormous spending power, to emerge in China's cities, following two distinctive waves of growth.

As incomes increase, the spending patterns of this consumer group will evolve, fueling various levels of growth across consumption categories.

Although it will be difficult, companies should broaden their focus to include this swiftly evolving middle class. Since this segment is a hard one to serve, companies must think creatively to succeed.'

[Shaun @ Tru6]

China will undergo a revolution. Iraq will see peace.

[Superman]

Originally posted by legion
Supe, I think this quote beautifully illustrates where our viewpoints diverge.

If unions were truly citizen groups, I would be behind you 100%

Where I come from (Chicago, Peoria), unions have these things called "bosses". In fact, the term "Union Boss" is the epitome of entrenched, nepotistic power. Ever heard of Jimmy Hoffa? Who is the head of the teamsters now?

No, I submit that unions are dictatorships, not citizen groups. In their present form, they should be discarded. If you could transform them into true citizen groups, I feel most of their negatives would vanish. For example, the Union Bosses would no longer put their personal enrichment above that of their members. They would not push an "us versus them" mentality on the rank and file to fool them into working against their own self interest--from destroying the very companies that provide their livelihood to forcing companies to find creative ways to avoid union jobs (outsourcing, closing factories).

I understand your viewpoint, Legion and will agree with your conclusion that it diverges from mine. And like you, I'll explain why. Yes, organizations like labor unions are often corrupt. That's why you guys hate gubmit so much. Just because an organization is directed by its "rank and file" (unions) or "citizens/voters" (America) does not ensure the absence of greed and corruption. I would think you would agree to this point.

Where we diverge is this: Hating organizations like America and labor unions, which are run by elected representatives......is not the same as wishing them to disappear. I HAVE to trust organizations that are citizen groups run by elected representatives. The alternative is unacceptable. When you come up with a better way for citizens/voters to get unselfish, high-integrity representatives in Washington DC, then we'll change to that system. In the meantime, America and its citizens groups such as labor unions.....will continue to struggle with leaders who are a bit too "human."

I deal with the Teamster International Representative for our area. I see the decisions he makes, and I see why. He works directly for Mr. Hoffa. My boss deals with Hoffa. Sure, there is game-playing at the tops of union organizations. But not like before. The movie-tale corruption assumption that is at the base of your decisions.......is not the same as it was. That was then, and this is now. That's not to say there isn't selfish behavior at the tops of labor unions. There is. But the old way of doing business doesn't work now.

[Superman]

Originally posted by legion
Supe, I think this quote beautifully illustrates where our viewpoints diverge.

If unions were truly citizen groups, I would be behind you 100%

Where I come from (Chicago, Peoria), unions have these things called "bosses". In fact, the term "Union Boss" is the epitome of entrenched, nepotistic power. Ever heard of Jimmy Hoffa? Who is the head of the teamsters now?

No, I submit that unions are dictatorships, not citizen groups. In their present form, they should be discarded. If you could transform them into true citizen groups, I feel most of their negatives would vanish. For example, the Union Bosses would no longer put their personal enrichment above that of their members. They would not push an "us versus them" mentality on the rank and file to fool them into working against their own self interest--from destroying the very companies that provide their livelihood to forcing companies to find creative ways to avoid union jobs (outsourcing, closing factories).

[MRM]

China has already gone through a revolution since the mid 1990s. And it's 1.5 billion, not one billion. The fabric of their society is being stretched with forces beyond comprehension and is holding up better than probably should be expected. But for anyone who thinks the Chinese consumer market is as simple as counting the number of armpits and dividing the market share, you're in for a surprise. China will experience political freedom and workplace reforms as the economy expands because it will be good business to do so and the masses will someday be empowered enough to demand political reforms, albeit through the Communist party.

If you want to understand the current political system in China, just think of the Communist party as the mafia and the leaders as the bosses, all paying homage to the Godfather in Beijing. The commies figured out in the 1990s that they could be rich and still stay in power if they just let go a little bit. They'll keep tolerating reforms as long as they stay in power and keep getting rich.

market for cIt will be several generations

[Superman]

I'm not so sure the Communist Party will be able to squelch the peoples' interests in the future. Once capitalism takes hold, I suspect the Party will be more of a passenger than a driver.

[legion]

Originally posted by Superman
I'm not so sure the Communist Party will be able to squelch the peoples' interests in the future. Once capitalism takes hold, I suspect the Party will be more of a passenger than a driver.

I agree with this. Birthrates will also plummet as people become more interested in buying toys for themselves over procreating.