F1 French GP - Ferrari pace?

Jims5543 · 07-02-2007, 05:12 AM

I am suprised no one else has noted this yet.

-Ferrari struggles through the last 3 races leading to France

- After the USGP news breaks over possible sabatoge by a disgruntled employee. Story never really grows legs.

- French GP comes along an Ferrari not only catches up to McLaren but seems to be dominating them much the same way they did in Australia.

You have to wonder if they really were being sabatoged. I was waiting for the Speed announcers to discuss this new found pace but they never mentioned the sabatoge accusations at all.

MFAFF · 07-02-2007, 05:27 AM

C'mom Jim.. do you really think Nigel Stepney would do that? A bit like Wayne defrauding his own web site ordering system.

Nigel might be really pissed that he was passed over for promotion but to go from there to actively sabotaging cars..and his own reputation within the very small world of F1..a tad far fetched, but its not impossible, merely improbable.

The real answer possibly lies in the differences inherent in the circuits and the amount of testing and data they have.

Ferrari have changed the wheelbase of their cars this season, much to every one's surprise, and have not had real data from Canada and Indy on this longer chassis (as in Monaco, they were trashed there)...now on a circuit which is far more familiar (in testing terms at least) they have a better result...

McLaren have changed tyres but the data for them is far more 'transferable' onto the 'model' car and the circuit data from last year far more applicable to the sumulations.

Hence the step change in Ferrari performance... its more like ragaining the level prior to Canada and the US and restoring the overall pattern for the season.

911teo · 07-02-2007, 05:33 AM

Jean Todd confirmed they had a catastrophic accident in their wind tunnel after the Spanish Gran Prix.

This means that their aerodynamic development was halted before going to America.

The performance at the Canadian and US GPs is very dependant in getting the aero done right. They have a mix of long straights and long turns and are classified as low downforce tracks.

Magny-Cours on the other side is a high downforce track, like Barcelona, and as if by magic Ferrari is back.

The commentator did say on Saturday that Jean Todd asked everybody to keep quiet abt the wind tunnel accident. I think the sabotage story was to cover up the real accident.

Silverstone next week will be a medium downforce track... I think the performance will be more even.

And I don't think Ferrari dominated... It was a good start by Kimi that kept Hamilton at bay...

Again the race was won at the first corner... Had Lewis jumped on Massa I think we'd be here celebrating his 3rd win in a row...

Jims5543 · 07-02-2007, 07:41 AM

To go from being 30 seconds behind to 30 seconds ahead from one race to the next is an amazing recovery would you agree?

I know nothing about Stepney, I do know human nature though and have seen disgruntled eployees do some crazy stuff in an affort to make themselves feel better in their minds. While I cannot comprehend this sort of behavior it does happen. I have seen it in the Land Surveying business, a employee "ajusted" a piece of GPS equipment so it would give readings 2 feet off. This was on a huge project and it costs everyone involved big money to fix. The employee was mad because he did not get to go to Jamaice on a big project and had to stay behind and do this project. So he sabatoged it. He did not quit after it either, he was fired but for another reason, after he was gone we discovered this sabatoge.

So in my mind its not totally out of the question.

javadog · 07-02-2007, 07:50 AM

I think it has more to do with the nature of the tracks. Sometimes a particular car is better on a high downforce track than a low downforce one, or vice versa. It seems Ferrari does worse at tracks that have a lot of low speed corners (like Monaco) or where they have to run low downforce. In Canada, they ran a different brand of brakes for that one race, which probably didn't help the drivers, as they didn't have much time to get used to them. Also, they have changed some hardware in the clutch, which helped Kimi.

The wind tunnel problem probably hurt them, although I doubt it had much to do with Canada and Indy. Likewise, whatever Stpeney did likely didn't cause them any problems, as it was discovered well before the race. It will be interesting to see how that one plays out.

Good result, although I would have been happier to see Massa win, or for Hamilton to have gotten stuck down in fourth or fifth.

JR

911teo · 07-02-2007, 08:00 AM

These days if one of the top 4 drivers sees they have no chance at victory they coast to the finish to preserve the car.

Races are won/lost at the 1st turn. Hamilton tried to put pressure on Kimi for the 1st 2 laps and then backed off.

So Ferrari was not that bad in Canada and is not that far ahead now.

nostatic · nostatic's Garage

I agree that it is the circuits.

I think I saw Hamilton playing with Alonso's transmission right before Q3 though

JSDSKI · 07-02-2007, 09:22 AM

Ferrari pace: Improved because damaged wind tunnel back on line and calibrated. Its breakdown coincided with the "flexible floor" regulation enforcement. Ferrari was really caught out with no way to make accurate changes to the car that were needed to the FIA change notice.

Stepney: This is really about keeping a VERY knowledgeable technical resource off market from Honda this year. He has a couple of other equally unhappy resources ready to jump ship with him. Stepney is a guy who has integrated Brawn's (and other designers / engineers) ideas, strategy, and changes directly and seamlessly into the pits and on track for a decade in F1 - an exceptionally valuable skill.
The "criminal charges" relate to contractual obligations about meetings with rival teams, inducing other Ferrari contracted employees, and the standard 6-12 month "gardening leave" in F1. The sabotage story is hyperventilating Italian press (with some help from Ferrari insiders) that also redirected interest in the wind-tunnel problem.

Kimi: just now getting comfortable with Bridgestones and the car is moving towards a setup sweetspot for his technique.

Context: We are in the prime European season - the middle third - everyone has updates and changes that are now arriving as a result of actual race data from the first two or three races.

This will be remembered as a golden or legendary season. Now we just need a couple of rain races and Hamilton dnf's to tighten things up and we could end up with 3 or 4 drivers fighting for the WDC in the last three races!!

Deschodt · 07-02-2007, 12:03 PM

Agreed on most comments...

McLaren ran real well on low downforce tracks, Ok, and at Monte Carlo but we know Ferrari never runs well there... We don't know what Alonso might have done without technical problems.. Let's see what happens at silverstone, I bet McLaren resurfaces...

Hamilton confirmed that he let the Ferraris go in the end since he was not close enough and figured the engine could use a break in RPMs... So a 6s gap became 30s....

As for Stepney, ditto, it's not so much himself but he was going to take off with about 10 engineers that work with him, to Honda I think... This lawsuit is a way for Ferrari to make that harder...

All in all, I'm happy Raikonnen won, it's now a 4 horse race again... I just can't get excited by Massa and I'm a little tired of the Hamilton (well deserved) hoopla.. I want to see Alonso and Raikonnen rejoin the leading 2, I hope BMW wins one on merit, I'd like to see Kovalainen on a podium, I hope Hamilton and Alonso take each other out once (should be fun to hear the press relase afterwards), and that the battle lasts till the last GP ! ;-)

911pcars · 07-02-2007, 08:51 PM

Greg,
I mirror your sentiments. It should be quite a season.

Sherwood

Deschodt · 07-03-2007, 01:24 PM

The plot thickens... Stepney was fired today, and now this :

Mike Coughlan, McLaren's chief designer, is the senior engineer suspected of espionage against Ferrari, autosport.com has learned.

The 48-year-old Briton is suspected of unlawfully obtaining technical material belonging to Ferrari in collaboration with Ferrari's Nigel Stepney.

In a search conducted by the police at Coughlan's house today, documents allegedly belonging to Ferrari were found, leading McLaren to suspend him while Ferrari said they reserve the right to pursue further legal action.

Jims5543 · 07-03-2007, 05:56 PM

I knew there was more to this.

Ferrari was looking pretty bad at tracks it normally does very well on. Say what you want about wheelbase, windtunnels, and downforce, Ferrari grew legs last year once it got to Montreal and Indy and continued from there on.

This year they fell on their face when they came to the same tracks and I could not help but wonder if Stepney had a hand in it.

This has turned out to be a fascinating season so far.

Deschodt · 07-03-2007, 06:08 PM

>I knew there was more to this.

I don't think that is related to Ferrari's 2 races slump... Seems more like stepney disclosed some internal secrets to Coughlan... Ugly business !!

JSDSKI · 07:03 PM

Is it possible doc's were removed from Stepney's flat and placed in Coughlan's?
Did someone from Ferrari give Stepney bad info to plant with Mac?
Were the doc's all about the flexi-floor !?!

Who really put the talcum powder on the fuel filler?!?

Or is it really all about damaging Honda before Brawn and Stepney sign on?

Is Ferrari going to protest season results at the last GP if Mac wins?

It's more and more like a Cold War Soap Opera!