Grand daughter caught a duece ...

[Jeff Alton]

I am not disagreeing, but what should they then do with a DUI?

Cheers

[Joeaksa]

And did she learn from this experience? Hope so and hope that she takes it to heart and moves on...

[Rick Lee]

What to do with DUI is a tough one. Obviously, increasing fines and penalties exponentially has not really made a dent in the problem. It just throws a bone to MADD while they dream up their next campaign. The cops can pick up DUI's as often as they feel like it, especially with the limit being .08. When I was in my class there was more than one guy in there for his third one. Suspending licenses does nothing, since most people ignore the suspension and drive anyway. In VA that carries mandatory jail and people still do it. I took a gf to court once for her DUI and the cops liked her so much, that after she skated with a 6 mos. restricted license, they even told her how to drive whenever she wanted to without getting caught - by registering her car to a relative, so the plate number wouldn't come up as hers if a cop ran it while sitting behind her in traffic.

People with serious drinking problems are not going to be cured or deterred by fines. The classes are such a JOKE. Re-education camp in a Communist country would be more enlightening. If they really want to stop people, they need to decide on a better criteria for what constitutes DUI while not trampling on our 4th or 5th Amendment right. I can drive better at .08 or even .10 than the vast majority of sober people I see on the road every day. I'd say if a DUI suspect causes damage or is caught before he can do so because his driving sucked, his car should be seized and there should be mandatory jail time. The fines mean nothing. I was poor when it happened to me and I got through it. Losing a car and then a lot more because of bills and missed work while in jail might have a deterrent effect on those who can be deterred. MADD should be completely ignored. They are every bit as much a "special interest" as is AARP, API, ACLU, etc.

[Por_sha911]

Sounds like we have a number of members of DAMM: Drunks against mad mothers.

How is we can be so upset about the "senseless loss of life" fighting a war but its OK to drive in a condition that is scientifically proven to make you more likely to kill someone? Is the legal limit arbitrary? Probably, but it has to be set somewhere and I would rather error on the side of caution. If a reckless driver just scratches our precious Porsche we want to shoot them (I've heard some rather violent wishes to those that have done damage to metal and glass). Well, if you lost a loved one to a drunk driver you might be a little more militant about it. I have never read anything from MADD that states they are against drinking, only drinking and driving. You want to get blitzed? No problem, just don't do it and then drive past my daughter or wife.

Do good people make mistakes? Of course. I made my share when I was young. The bottom line is if you do, you run the risk of getting caught and that sucks for you but I bet it will deter the good kids from doing it again.

[Rick Lee]

But really IS ok to drive in a condition that makes you more likely to kill someone and you can do 100% sober. The stuff I see on the road every day that's deadly and legal is way, way more common than drunk driving, which itself is too common. Go after someone who's texting on their Blackberry behind the wheel. I saw a guy eating a bowl of cereal while driving. I had a neighbor who got a ticket for playing his trumpet while driving to work. This stuff, at worst gets tiny fines, but almost always goes unpunished.

[Scooter]

An attorney might have gotten a plea deal, but you will never know. Your granddaughter sounds like a good kid that just made a mistake. Acknowledge and move on I say. Never make the same mistake twice. Hopefully she realizes the significance of her actions and has learned her lesson.

[Shaun @ Tru6]

If you get pulled over for DUI, first time, you should get a very stiff penalty and loss of license and mandatory participation in an education program. Half of the program would be education on the effects of alcohol. 25% would be watching films of crashes and dead, bloody bodies in drunk driving accidents. and the final 25% would be local residents who have lost loved ones to drunk drivers beating you about the head and neck for a minimum of one hour while shouting at you. baseball bats would be optional.

If you get caught a second time for DUI, loss of license for 10 years.

Get caught driving during that period, you get moved to a kibutz-style farm (prison) in Nebraska working the land of organic vegetables for 3 years.

Every kid in this country is already fully educated about driving drunk in HS. But I understand how you can make a mistake once. Twice, you have no right to drive.

I have driven drunk once, about a mile. I had had way too much to drink at a bachelor party, but after a long night, was "starting to come out of it" and thought I could get home. the timing, and I think a love for driving, is what saved me. While driving, I was clearly too drunk to drive, but was coming out of it enough to realize I was too drunk to drive and one side of my brain beat up the other enough to pull over and sleep it off.

Cop woke me up the next morning and gave me a ticket for illegal parking. I told him why, he commended me for 1 second and then said I shouldn't have even gotten in the car and scolded me for the next 5 minutes. by scolding I mean yelling at me.

he was right.

My dad's brother was killed by a drunk driver, the town drunk, a few years before I was born. Never effected me since I didn't know my uncle, but from talking with my grandmother, my dad was never the same, and looking back, I can see that. They were the kind of brothers you see in movies that hunted, fished, restored 55 Chevy's, and started a boatyard together. Frank was apparently a great man, not that I will ever know.

So all you drunk driving apologists should just STFU until you have been hit by a drunk driver, or had a close family member/friend killed by a drunk driver. I know it's particularly difficult for you Republicans weighing Personal Responsibility against the Freedom to drive drunk, but I think PR wins on this one.

Driving any car is a privilege and a responsibility, and when done recklessly, can kill someone. Penalties should be commensurate with outcome.

[Porsche-O-Phile]

Originally Posted by Shaun 84 Targa

Get caught driving [drunk] during that period, you get moved to a kibutz-style farm (prison) in Nebraska working the land of organic vegetables for 3 years.

I don't think you realize the brilliance you've just stumbled on. We can solve two major societal problems at once this way - (1) we alleviate overcrowding in prisons by moving prisoners to work/labor camps picking vegetables and (2) we get rid of all the illegals at the same time. BRILLIANT!!!

Hell, having to go to Nebraska is worse than going to prison anyway, IMO. I bet after a few months out there in the featureless, boring, hotter-than-hades plains spreading manure by hand they wouldn't be so eager to repeat their crimes. Better than simply putting them in an institution where gangs are in charge anyway.

[Joeaksa]

Originally Posted by Porsche-O-Phile

Hell, having to go to Nebraska is worse than going to prison anyway, IMO. I bet after a few months out there in the featureless, boring, hotter-than-hades plains spreading manure by hand they wouldn't be so eager to repeat their crimes. Better than simply putting them in an institution where gangs are in charge anyway.

Sorry to bring this up but have you really spent very much time in Nebraska?

In spring, summer and early fall its a really nice place but winter aint fun at all. Wind drops down off of the Rocky Mountains and simply rolls across the whole area, bringing bad weather and snow with it.

Or is it a case of "anywhere other than SoCal is hades" to you guys?

[Rick Lee]

Shaun, the classes already cover much of what you suggested. They are USELESS. I saw the same stuff in driver's ed. in high school. Actually, I guess the films in the classes are the least useless part of the classes. The rest of the class I was in (12 hrs.) tried to get me to admit to being an alcoholic. You what they say when you deny it. It really was right out of a re-education camp. I had a friend who had been through it in NJ and told me how to answer everything so they didn't refer me to more classes.

[stomachmonkey]

Originally Posted by Porsche-O-Phile

I don't think you realize the brilliance you've just stumbled on. We can solve two major societal problems at once this way - (1) we alleviate overcrowding in prisons by moving prisoners to work/labor camps picking vegetables and (2) we get rid of all the illegals at the same time. BRILLIANT!!!

In NY much of the parks and highway maintenance is supplemented by people with DUI's. They actually refer to it as a Union.

[scottmandue]

Originally Posted by 59GS

Thanks to all who offered advice and counsel and a pox on those who could or would only pass judgment.
Down the road, gentlemen

I had a DUI twenty three years ago and haven't visited the gray bar hotel since. In class they said two thirds of us would be back.
Drinking and driving is a stupid thing to do.

However to those who throw stones... statistically your just as likely to get in an accident after drinking as, when driving and taking non alcoholic over the counter cold medicine, eating and driving, or driving after fighting with you significant other.

[Noah930]

Here's my take on driving, in general. You're piloting a vehicle that weighs somewhere between 3000 and 5000 lbs. And you're doing it in close proximity to others. You can actually kill or maim someone through your actions. So, out of respect for your fellow citizens (and non-citizens), I think it's only right to treat driving keeping in mind the dangers involved. If I were to operate (you know, on people, since I'm a surgeon) as cavalierly as a lot of people drive, you and the medical board would call me an imminent danger to society and pull my license in short order. Why do we treat driving with such little regard, in comparison?

[DARISC]

Any arguments that people don't drink alcohol for the buzz, relaxing effect or whatever?

Know anybody who drinks it only because they like the taste of alcohol?

Any argument that alcohol is deleterious to good judgement and reaction times, increasing, of course, with the ammount in the blood and the variation from person to person?

What's the allowable breathalizer reading for pilots?

I like my wine. Got busted years ago when I used poor judgement and left home to get gas and was flagged over because I'd downshifted at a stop sign and drew the attention of a CHP across the road. Guess what happened. I don't drink at all then drive anymore.

My younger alcoholic brother rolled his car, was thrown from the vehicle which ended up pinning him in a ditch with the exhaust pipe across his forehead and right eye.

He lost that eye and died five days later, leaving a wife and two very young kids.

So, gee! You're pissed about what % of alcohol you can have in your blood and still drive legally?

Tell someone who cares.

Oh - and I feel the same way about cell phone usage and text messaging.

[CurtEgerer]

>>>>I should add that I see downright deadly driving on a daily basis that has nothing to do with DUI and is almost always legal - cell phone chatting, putting on make-up, eating a bowl of cereal, texting, etc.<<<<

May I add: reading a book propped on the steering wheel, brushing one's teeth, shaving in the mirror, watching DVD's on the dashboard, driving with a foot (or both) on the dash or out the window. I'm in no way defending drunk driving but there is a reason why DUI and speeding are the 2 most common citations - they can be measured with a number. Makes it easy to write the ticket and easy to prosecute the crime.

[Tobra]

I genuinely like the taste of beer and wine(well some beer and wine). The wife makes a margarita that is pretty awesome too.

Sounds like she may come out of this okay.

Oh and BTW, I would live anywhere in Nebraska long before I would consider moving South of Fresno

[Shaun @ Tru6]

Other than Cheney, is there anyone here who would use a gun with even just 1 beer in them in the previous hour?

[Joeaksa]

Originally Posted by Shaun 84 Targa

Other than Cheney, is there anyone here who would use a gun with even just 1 beer in them in the previous hour?

Shaun,

Come-on, lets keep the politics out of this.

Now, let me tell you guys what is legal and was done in Europe when I lived there 10-15 years ago.

In Denmark if you have had a drink and put your key in the car door to get something out of the car, not drive it, just touch the door, you get arrested. You actually drive the car while under the influence it gets worse... a lot worse. If memory serves me right the second offense gets you a year in jail. Lots of people take taxi's or the public transport as you just do not drive under the influence in most parts of Europe.

Now that I have said this 15 years ago I was living and flying in Germany. Using an American pilots license at first I followed the usual rules, 8 hours between bottle and throttle. Got my German pilots license and we went out to lunch to celebrate with the local pilots. Schnitzel and a beer, we were all having a good time. To my amazement one of the other pilots got a beep then called ops and went on to tell us that he had an ambulance mission and ran off to fly. I commented about this to the other pilots, that he would fly after having a beer and was told that it was legal to have one beer, but not more and then fly. No, I did not ever do this...

[Shaun @ Tru6]

Sorry Joe, it was the beer talking.

Good info.

[Porsche-O-Phile]

Hey, it's only one beer, right?