America the Ignorant

[tabs]

I was watching a bit of a discussion about Blackwater Security forces in Iraq on PBSs Washington Week. One of the commentators queried about the Iraqie government proscuting Blackwater security agents for murder.

My God is that the level of understanding Americans have about the social and poitical dynamic in Iraq let alone the rest of the world? One would think that the commentator thought downtown Bagdad had the same political dynamic as NYC. Does he also think that all peoples can be reasoned with, that malevolence doesn't exist in the world.

For starters Iraqie society isn't based upon the rule of law and certainily not secular rule of law. It is based upon clan, tribe, ethnic and sectarian values. For the ME secular rule has meant despotism and corruption, that is why the fundlementalists want a return to Islamic law. To rid themselves of those twin devils.

Malevolence to a degree is in the eye of the beholder. To a faith based fundlementalist his adamancy for his principles is a measure of his faith. So to behead a infidel hostage is a virtious act and not an act of evil.

Americans have gone along blithly for too long believing that inside of every Iraqie or foreigner is an American waiting to get out. That everybody in the world holds the same values as American do. Nothing could be further from the truth.

[scottbombedout]

Amen to that Bro.

Democracy in the middle east doesn't work. The people don't have the mindset for it. Can we please learn the lesson and come home?

[azasadny]

I get angry whenever I hear someone say that "we broke Iraq" as if the shi_hole was actually a civilized place before we got there!

[Dan in Pasadena]

Originally Posted by scottbombedout

Democracy in the middle east doesn't work. The people don't have the mindset for it. Can we please learn the lesson and come home?

Which for me begs the question, What exactly did we EVER think we were going to accomplish there anyway? Did we think we'd roll through in a few weeks and the people would be lining the streets cheering our G.I's, smiling for the cameras and then calmly go about the process of establishing a Democratically elected government? Was that this Presdient's wet dream?

When did something like that EVER happen in the Middle East?, yet we arrogantly assume we can and must make the whole world over in our image. Incredible.

P.S. Guess what?, his wet dream has caused what?...approaching about 4,000 additional American death, right? And we are how much "safer" than we were BEFORE this policy created likely an entire generation of young Middle Eastern boys willing to become vengeance-seeking future terrorists?

[Dottore]

Originally Posted by tabs

For starters Iraqie society isn't based upon the rule of law and certainily not secular rule of law. It is based upon clan, tribe, ethnic and sectarian values.

Gee whiz! And I thought you guys introduced a Jeffersonian democracy there. I mean you had a clean slate. What have you been doing there all this time?

[Dottore]

Originally Posted by tabs

Americans have gone along blithly for too long believing that inside of every Iraqie or foreigner is an American waiting to get out.

And another thing tabs... I believe it was you that stated here years ago that "inside every towelhead is an American trying to get out".

You appear to have had an epiphany of sorts in recent months. Like St. Paul on the road to Damascus. Or maybe its diet related. Whatever. I applaud you for it.

But I do wish you would stop recycling old posts!

[hardflex]

I do believe the commentator was referring to the fact that Blackwater actions are not governed by Military Code, Nor US Civil Code, and we have immunized them from prosecution by the Iraqi government. They have the 00-- license to kill.

That said, continue on with the mudslinging.

[Joeaksa]

Has anyone else watched the Tonight show when Jay Leno does his streetwalking bit? I love the times where he starts asking people where various places in the world are located.

Am really sorry to say that about 70% of the people have absolutely no idea where other countries in our world are located, not to mention that most of the do not even know squat about our own country.

In many ways, especially when compared to the rest of the world, it really is "America the ignorant." So sad to see...

[DARISC]

Whair is Iraqie? Near Spelchek?

[GO DAWG GO]

Tabs, I agree



I don't think it was a good idea either BUT, What really bothers me, are these democrats who with out a doubt would like to see America get its a-s kicked so they can blame in on the Republicans.. Forkin traitors. To most democrats, this war would be justified if Hilary or Bill had started it.. Most of the left are bomb throwing, hypocritical, myopic, little cheese dicks who voted for it in the first place.

Whether its right or wrong we cant afford to pull out yet. Afterward, we can get to the real issues about American sovereignty and being invaded by Mexico..

[dad911]

[scottbombedout]

Can we make a list of countries in the middle east where democracy is working.

I'll start with Egypt and then there is.......emm emm

[svandamme]

Originally Posted by azasadny

I get angry whenever I hear someone say that "we broke Iraq" as if the shi_hole was actually a civilized place before we got there!

well, it was a contained ****hole
Shadam ruled the ground, but if he farted a bit to loud he got a J'DAM on his head

it worked, kinda

[DARISC]

Originally Posted by svandamme

well, it was a contained ****hole
Shadam ruled the ground, but if he farted a bit to loud he got a J'DAM on his head

it worked, kinda

Nailed it.

[svandamme]

i'll say even more
Afhanistan was not a contained ****hole, it was just a ****hole
because the Taliban was operating on some form of fanatical idealism instead of pure greed
greed is 100 times more predictable then idealism, anyone driven by greed, has things to loose and will have to work with that... fanatics have nothing to loose, at least not in their perspective

if said it before on this board, probably 2 years ago by now

should have left Iraq alone, and focussed all the energy that has been spent so far on just Afghanistan, would have been more effective, would have left the US on the moral high ground, without loosing so much sympathy in the world

now, y'all are stuck with it


and i've said this before too:
net result, sooner or later will be the same
you'll have to do a coitus interruptus
and then the Herpes is going to flair up in that region, till either a new Shadam takes over, or the neighbours go in with antibiotics

the oil will still be there when all things settle down
and whoever is sitting on it, can't do anything besides selling the stuff
no amount of science will let them cook gourmet meals with oil & sand.


the only thing the US can control, is it's own money & body count.

[74-911]

Originally Posted by azasadny

I get angry whenever I hear someone say that "we broke Iraq" as if the shi_hole was actually a civilized place before we got there!

If Saddam had not invaded Kuwait, threatening our "friends" in Saudi Arabia and thus our access to oil, he would most likely still be in power and still considered our ally just as he was during the Iran - Iraq war in the 80's..

[450knotOffice]

However...

A little bit of balance is in order here. It's true that Americans tend to be ignorant of the world outside their borders, however, let's not fool ourselves into thinking that the rest of the world knows much more about the other societies on this planet outside of their general area. Some people in every society are, in fact very knowledgeable of the outside world, however, most are not, beyond a general sense.

Don't believe me? Go to Europe. Ask those who've never been outside of their region (Europe) a few questions about the US, or about the nations of Africa, or South America, Central America, etc. Ask them the same types of questions that we ask our own people and you'll get the same kinds of answers.

It's so easy assume we are stupid, ignorant Americans who know nothing of the world while everyone else on this planet knows all. This is simply not true. Yes, there are some very knowledgeable people in this world who are very aware of the rest of the world in a very real sense, but just as in the US, these people are really the exception , rather than the norm.

Lest you think I'm making assumptions here with no basis, I have spent many, many years living all over Europe (as a kid) and traveling over most of this planet (as an adult). My mother's side of the family is still in Europe. I've lived among and mingled with people from around the world and can honestly tell you that most people have no real idea about what is going on in the world outside of what they see and hear on their local news networks. Most people I have met abroad who have never left their area have a very unrealistic idea of the US and Americans, for example - very different from reality.

[Tobra]

Originally Posted by scottbombedout

Can we make a list of countries in the middle east where democracy is working.

I'll start with Egypt and then there is.......emm emm

Israel is in the middle east

Stijn, antibiotics don't work on the herpes, it is a virus

The average person is just that, average. Does not matter what street you are strolling, average person you would stop to speak to is kinda klueless. I would hazard a guess that the least informed person frequenting this forum is more up to speed than the average joe, and their are several countries represented.

[DARISC]

Originally Posted by Tobra

I would hazard a guess that the least informed person frequenting this forum is more up to speed than the average joe.

Well, I dunno about that - I'm still tryin' ta find Iraqie .

[tabs]

Originally Posted by DARISC

Whair is Iraqie? Near Spelchek?

Are you Making fun of a disabled person. I have a disability where I can't remember how to spel nor use grammer properly. I resent your snide remarks about my disability. U would think I'm a retard next, and try to push me down the stairs.