Who will pay for the sin of murdering the unborn?

[peppy]

Mule what is the point of the video? I am not some religious nut, I can just read.

[fast911ray]

Mule, based on the radio programming I heard in and around Choo-Choo town, that COULD be a real ad spot.

In mid 1977 my brother moved from Chicago to Chattanooga as a Catholic. Sometime between then and now, he became a radical 'Born again' Jezzus freak ..and multi millionaire. Hmmm. Could there be a connection ? Just kidding. It was luck...but I have to tell you, he annoys everyone in the family with the constant insane creationist, universe is 5,000 years old, nonsense. His response to any kind of rational, scientific challenge is " Thats the Devil's influence". Whenever carbon dating is mentionedthe reply is " that is a tool of the Devil'.

But he is indecently wealthy...

[Mule]

If you don't get the point I'm not sure I can explain it.

[Mule]

Originally Posted by fast911ray

Mule, based on the radio programming I heard in and around Choo-Choo town, that COULD be a real ad spot.

In mid 1977 my brother moved from Chicago to Chattanooga as a Catholic. Sometime between then and now, he became a radical 'Born again' Jezzus freak ..and multi millionaire. Hmmm. Could there be a connection ? Just kidding. It was luck...but I have to tell you, he annoys everyone in the family with the constant insane creationist, universe is 5,000 years old, nonsense. His response to any kind of rational, scientific challenge is " Thats the Devil's influence". Whenever carbon dating is mentionedthe reply is " that is a tool of the Devil'.

But he is indecently wealthy...

He's probably hammering Betty Bowers and JC is looking out for him.

[jluetjen]

Mule;
You do understand that there is no such thing as the "Landover Baptist Church". It's an over-the-top parody which doesn't even have the honesty to identify itself as such. It certainly doesn't represent any legitimate Christians or Christian views.

So by posting those videos in response to peppy's comments, you are specifically advocating what???

[kach22i]

The title of this thread is offensive.

[Mule]

Originally Posted by jluetjen

Mule;
You do understand that there is no such thing as the "Landover Baptist Church". It's an over-the-top parody which doesn't even have the honesty to identify itself as such. It certainly doesn't represent any legitimate Christians or Christian views.

So by posting those videos in response to peppy's comments, you are specifically advocating what???

Is it much more "over the top" than the real church in "nice churches?" The sad part is that this is a joke. They are serious. Get it now?

I'm "specifically advocating" common sense, something which seems to be in short supply when religion is introduced to the conversation.

[Flatbutt1]

howvdo we explain this

http://www.pitch.com/2006-11-02/news/the-new-fred/full

perhaps the Westboro Kansas Baptist church has the answer

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b3PyoUPcobA&NR=1,

[Normy]

Originally Posted by fast911ray

That is an interesting question Norm. I would think that since the founding fathers were more than likely Christians, it would have to have been some protestant denomination. Church of England perhaps? New Amsterdam and Pennslyvania, largely populated by germanics, would surley have been either Catholic and Lutheran. Were Jews even on this continent in any numbers at that time? Muslims? Atheists?

"Since the founding fathers were more likely christians"

I think that some of those founding fathers may have been Jewish. And I think you need to be more specific: What's more, certain states were founded by certain religions. And the original constitutional congress was composed of members from different states. So tell me...which of these "christian" religions is the one that the founding fathers followed? It occurs to me that roman catholic is different from baptist?

So is it going to be Roman catholic or baptist? Or maybe Zoroastrian?

-Again, you will now try to talk around my massive obstacle in your reasoning.

Then again, there is no reasoning with a fundamentalist. Whether it is a muslim fundamentalist or a christian fundamentalist or a zoroastrian fundamentalist...you're all the same: Stupid and dogmatic. And you don't deal in logic at all.

I ought to go to some of the atheist sites, collect a few links, and shake your faith. I bet I could make you think twice as to whether there really is a guy who lives in the clouds, or that there was some person who parted the Red Sea with his hands, or who walked on water, or who came back to life after dieing...

I don't believe in the tooth fairy, and neither should you!

N

[Mule]

[DanielDudley]

Originally Posted by kach22i

The title of this thread is offensive.

Ditto.

But it must be thrilling to post somehow.

Lucky will be those that God choses not to test in their beliefs, much as they might learn from the experience.

LOL

[DanielDudley]

Originally Posted by Normy

"Since the founding fathers were more likely christians"


N

Thomas Jefferson was a Unitarian.

[Mule]

From the planet Unitaria.

[nostatic]

I'm a Movementarian

[nostatic]

although Mr. Burns might wield more power

[Moneyguy1]

John Adams: Unitarian: "Jesus is benevolence personified, an example for all men. The Christian religion, in its primitive purity and simplicity, I have enertained for more than sixty years. It is the religion of reason, equity and love; it is the religion of the head and of the heart" (letter to F.A. VenDerKemp, 12/27/1816)

Samual Adams: Christian

Ben Franklin: Deist

Alexander Hamilton: Christian

Patrick Henry: In a letter to his daughter dated 8/20/1796 he affirms his christainity

John Jay: Christian

Thomas Jefferson: Deist

George Washington: questionable Christian since he espoused his religious beliefs as a young man but in public preferred to speak of simply "The Almighty"

[dipso]

An abortion sure could of come in handy for this woman.
Expect more of this behavior if the anti-choicers have their way.


As Placer jail keeps close watch on woman suspected of drowning baby, records detail financial woes.
By Terri Hardy - thardy@sacbee.com
Last Updated 12:09 am PST Tuesday, January 22, 2008
Story appeared in METRO section, Page B5

Print | E-Mail | Comments (57) | Digg it | del.icio.us

As the woman suspected of inexplicably drowning her baby this weekend at her Granite Bay home was under close observation at the Placer County jail Monday, records show that she and her husband have been under significant financial strain.

Placer County sheriff's officials said they believe Kristina Fuelling, 27, intentionally drowned her 8-day-old baby, Faith Evelyn, in the bathroom sink Sunday morning. She faces her first court appearance Wednesday at an arraignment hearing.

Tom Johnson, a Sacramento defense attorney representing the first-time mother, said Monday that he would not comment on the investigation or charges.


Investigators said that her husband, Nicholas Fuelling, is not a suspect – that the father "was alerted to the child's death by the mother" at 6 a.m, and that he called 911.

When fire personnel arrived at their Stillwater Court home, they were unable to revive the baby. Faith was taken to Sutter Roseville Medical Center and pronounced dead at 7:20 a.m. Authorities said Monday that an autopsy is planned this week.

Kristina Fuelling's family, the Luchays, and her husband's family issued a joint statement Monday in an e-mail to The Bee.

"Our hearts are aching," the statement read. "We find it unbelievable that this loving mother has been accused of such a horrible act. The charges against Kristina do not reflect the good person whom she is known to be."

The families said Fuelling "has been completely dedicated to caring for her child."

According to the statement, Fuelling stopped work "months ago to take care of her pregnancy and baby."

"She has called the doctor numerous times for every little concern since the baby was born. Her life has been completely dedicated to caring for her child. It seems illogical that such a loving mother would harm her baby and we hope officials will find the same to be true," it said.

Dena Erwin, a sheriff's spokeswoman, said Fuelling had been booked without bail on suspicion of homicide.

Erwin said Fuelling "is being held in our booking room so we can keep a close eye on her."

Lt. Jeffrey Ausnow said investigators are still no closer to determining a motive. Fuelling was tested for drug and alcohol use but investigators haven't gotten the results, he said.

Public records document the Fuellings' financial struggles.

Kristina and Nicholas Fuelling have suffered two home foreclosures – and at least one of those houses had a subprime mortgage, court records show. Various creditors took Nicholas Fuelling to court in 2006-07, and the state issued a tax lien against him for nearly $54,000.

Johnson, Kristina Fuelling's defense attorney, said Monday that he wouldn't "address any financial issues at this time."

According to court records, Nicholas Fuelling purchased a home on Pampas Way in Fair Oaks for $255,000 in 2003. In October 2004, he refinanced the home with a subprime lender for $349,411, as well as taking out a loan for $35,000.

In May 2005, during the real estate boom, Fuelling borrowed an additional $115,000 against the Pampas Way home. That same month, he purchased a second home – a condominium in Roseville for $390,000.

A bank foreclosed on the Cortina Circle condo in October 2006. Another bank foreclosed on the Pampas Way house the next month, court records show.

Records also show that Fuelling's company, which tests for mold and other hazards in homes and businesses, has been the subject of dozens of complaints to the Better Business Bureau in the past three years. He is listed as president of Res-Com Environmental Inc., which also operates under other names: RC Services, RC Inc. and Rescom Environmental.

The Fuellings moved to a rental home on Stillwater Court some months ago, neighbors said. The home is on a small cul-de-sac of upscale homes, in a walled community.

On Monday, no one answered at the home. A bouquet of roses had been placed on the doorstep.

[70SATMan]

Originally Posted by fast911ray

Really 70SAtMan, is it any more rational believing that some bored old guy existed in an empty void for all eternity before 'creating' the universe, then selected a tiny insignificant sphere..just 25,000km in diameter mind you.. in a minor galaxy, to place his/her 'science project? Of the trillions of stars, in trillions of galaxies, this sphere alone was selected for the uniqueness of having 'life'? To cap it off this 'being' formulated a list of rules that would condemm a violator to eternal torment..before he/she actually 'created' our species. Throw in his/her knowing who would violate thse commandmants even before they were concieved really strains one's imagination.

To tell the truth, conventinal religion paints the picture of their 'loving' God as being cruel,sadistic and ungrateful. Think about it...whose God is right? Theirs, yours, Mine? In war, God is on every side of the conflict..

God. A bogeyman fabricated by ancient powers to frighten the simpleminded and supersticious into obeying and accepting edicts and directives. What better way to control the masses than by having some 'all seeing' spectre looming unseen, ready to cruely 'punish' those who might transgress. Simple people required simple explanations for natural occuring events..hence God, Satan, Heaven,Hell.. and scriptures.

More abortions please...

OK, WTF are you on??? I have absolutely NO idea what you are raving about.

[RWebb]

I say that Jesus should pay -- after all, he saves... green stamps. Maybe he can cash them in.

[Jeff Higgins]

Ironicly, it appears as though the pro choice atheists are having a harder time keeping God out of this than the pro life advocates. Try as you might, this is still not a religious debate. One need not believe in anything or anyone at all to understand that there are those who feel they have the right to end another's life. At its very simplest level, the fact remains that abortion ends a life that has started. There is no other reason, no other motivation behind abortion - the stated intent is to end a life that, if not tampered with, would see itself through to fruition. Nobody has any right whatsoever to decide another human has no right to their life; not at that stage of the game.