Anyone know anything about large format cameras?
 

And now for something completely different!

Yes, I have been watching too many late night documentaries on the art channel about famous photographers.

I have always love photography... I have a couple of Cannon 35mm bodies... a bag full of lens... an old Fugica 120... and a Nikon digital pocket camera...

So what I need is...

A LARGE FORMAT CAMERA of course!

Anyone play with these things? What should I look for? What should I avoid?

Where do I buy film? Where do you get it developed? Develop it yourself?
(Kicked around the idea of setting up a darkroom for years)

I am thinking of buying used and would like to keep it down to $1000 or less.
I presume at that price I am limited to 4 X 5 (would like to go 8 X10 but also presume that is out of my price range).

I know there are some pro and semi pro photographer hanging out here so please help me out!

Thanks in advance,
Scott

never got to large, why not start with medium

http://www.kenrockwell.com/tech/intro2mf.htm

I just passed on a link to a guy who may be in contact with you...a very skilled photog who mentioned in an email that he was thinking of putting some of his large format stuff on ebay...(edit) A brief cut & paste from his email: "two old Rolleis, a Speed Graphic outfit, "...

Hmmm, that would be me, I guess. The best way to get your feet wet in 4x5 is with an old Crown or Speed Graphic. Not expensive, so not nearly the $$ commitment that a newer camera requires. Yes, you can still get film; depending on where you live, you may have to develop it yourself, but that's fun.

Yes, I just happen to have a Speed Graphic outfit for sale, well within your budget; if you're interested, give me a call at 303/235-0116 (days, Mountain Time) or e-mail me at fbarrett@aol.com.

Just screw'n around at my desk..

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1208481278.jpg

The image plane w/ a not so steady hand... (yeah, that's your post)
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1208481293.jpg

The Horseman LX http://www.horsemanusa.com/pd_vc.html is really nice to use, IMO.

it is all about the lens..

fun stuff. first time i got in there, i got really disoriented with the view.

Scott, I have a ton of Deardorff 8x10 cameras and lenses--I run a commercial photo studio which is all digital now--pm me with any requests.
christian.

I've got a 4x5 Omega D view camera, with std. and wide angle bag bellows, Symmar 180mm and 65mm WA lense mounted on lens boards, extra film holders, dark cloth, in a hard shell fiber case. Also, misc. film development racks. All in excellent condition.

Let me know if you or anyone is interested.

Sherwood

I'd like one of these:

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1208490280.jpg
Tachihara 4x5 Cherrywood Field Camera

http://www.adorama.com/VW45FC.html

Best,

Kurt

Kurt, what makes that camera a good choice in your opinion? (a straight Q ...no inference implied or intended ;) ...just want to know what features drive your choice.)

Scott, there's a Horseman LX on ebay at $500 Item number: 250237052117

I am a medium/large format neophyte, but have read that many great photographers, including Ansel Adams, used this extremely reasonably priced camera! These two facts, famous photographer users and low price, are attractive to me. Beyond that, I am uneducated . . . oh, and I like the wood and brass. :D

Here is a good write-up: http://www.largeformatphotography.info/tachihara.html

That short article sells me on the Tachihara as a great camera I can use to learn and grow into.

edit/addition: One thing I did already now is that this type of camera is excellent at great depth of field shots - landscapes and cityscapes and such. I also have always wanted to build a pinhole camera for the same purpose.

FWIW.

Best,

Kurt

The heart of a view camera is its lens. Good ones exceed the cost of the view camera which is basically adjustable frames to hold film and lens. The very best made view cameras (Sinar) are machined works of art, but you don't need one to take a great photo; just like most cameras.

A big factor is the photographer; the subject he chooses, how it's composed and exposed on film. If black and white, there are several books describing the process (Zone system) developed by Ansel Adams and practiced by many others.

Point and shoot it's not.

There are some diehard photographers using view cameras but with hi-res digital backs. Look on the web.

Sherwood

Most of what you need can be bought dirt cheap as people have put aside their film cameras for digital. There are tons of terrific used B and W books out there as well.
Very little is actualy needed to develop the film, the developer, stop and the fix. Once the film is developed you can switch to the digital world and use a film scanner. I have spooled 120 film onto 620 reels and had great success, check out this website www.inficad.com
Here is a web site for the crown graphic camera www.graflex.org
The film is still available and as long as it's frozen it will last forever.
Steve

Try this one for the respool, it actually works great. www.inficad.com/~gstewart/respool.htm

Geeze I never even thought of that. I have a Minolta 635 (120 film) that I completely stopped using because the the developping was so expensive. Processing the film only and then moving to digital is a great idea. Have you done that with color, or just B&W?

I do it all the time, either with a flat bed scanner or a Nikon scanner which will also scanslides. Most of my photography is work related and we stopped using B and W film only about a year ago when Kodak tecpan went out of production. I haven't developed any B and W film in about a year. I have not done it with color as most photo labs still do one hour color film development and also give you a DVD with it.

Whoo hoo!

I posted this as I was leaving work last night and wondered if it would fall off the map overnight.

Thanks for all the great links!

I'm off to check my aol email to see if anyone made me some offers.

And yes I looked at ebay but though I better check around before I buy myself a piece of junk and drive myself crazy trying to get it to work.

Is there an online store that sells the large format (4 X 5 or 8 X 10) film?

Kurt, there is one of those on ebay but it has some issues.

fbarrett, Sherwood, Christian,I will email or PM you with questions what you have for sale.

hey! i have a hasselblad, i mothballed for the same reason. the convience factor went out the window. i still have all the canisters, and stuff to develope the film. so if i want to stay with B/W..the scanner will still work?

BTW I have been a big fan of Ansel Adams since high school.

Yeah, definitely NOT point and shoot... kind of the polar opposite of digital.

I like both ideas, digital=take a bazillion pictures, Large format=spend a lot of time setting up one perfect picture.

Not that one is better than the other just two different styles.

I saw the digital backs on ebay but they were $$$$, if I had that kind of money I would buy a nice old 911 (or at least fix up my 944;))

I mothballed my 35 mm darkroom when everything went digital. I may start using it again.

good hunting, scott.

There is also a Speed Graphic 4x5 on ebay.

Is that a decent camera or should I stay away?

Also what is the typical cost of 4X5 film? Developing?

Edit: Did a little searching and apparently B&H is the place to go online to buy 4x5 film.

Thanks again,
Scott

Heart is the lens, eh? ....If your camera has a limited lens-board, then you have limits on lens choices. ...then there is the amount of extension, the amount of rise/fall, shift tilt & twist of the front and rear standards. Beyond that there is control of those functions. ..are they fussy or fast? --IMO, Scott, you are smart to find a good camera, then start playing with lenses.

Also, from what I've seen, the diehard photographers are using view cameras digitally, but with scanners, rather than hi-res digital backs. ---Yes, some are using the digital backs, but that is not what I would call "high res."


Kurt- Thanks. And if you want Bling, check out "Carbon Infinity." (is that Titanium and CF? ...I think it is.;)



http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1208535790.jpg

That "Carbon Infinity" is nuts, but probably wouldn't pass the the "reasonably priced" requirement for my intro into the medium format world. :)

I've also read that Rollei is a good place to start with medium/large format. eBay turned up what looked like decent deals and Rollei are German made!

I am going to try the pinhole camera "hack" for my DSLR though - I posted it in a new thread last night. I also recall reading something a few years back about a guy who turned his entire garage into a giant pinhole camera - that was cool. I'll have to dig it up.

Best,

Kurt

Yes the scanner will work great, a lot of scanners have a 35mm neg adaptor, I have also used a small light table for larger negatives. I place the negative on the scanner and then the light table (turned on) on the negative an then scan. I then use photoshop to crop and adjust the image. I am certain you could buy a scanner with an adaptor for the format size you need.
Steve

Steve, what scanner are you using for that?

So I am thinking, get a used 4x5, get set up to develop the film myself (I have done 35mm before... many moons ago) and get a scanner to do prints.

Would that be the most economic way to get started in medium format?

I looked into this after getting wowed by Burtynsky's work. Then I realized the reality of shooting MF. I'm way too ADD and impatient to do it.

Update - I have emailed fbarrett,
Sherwood and Christian, you have PM's - if you want to email direct try scottinla57-at-aol.com.

You know I wasn't sure I would get any response to this thread (in this digital age why would anyone want to go to a single exposure large or medium format camera?) and now I have three leads on camera!

Gotta love PPOT!

Scott, welcome to the LF bug. You're already addicted to Porsches, though, so this may be too much. ;)

Like you, I started into the LF world many moons ago on a whim. I stumbled across an old Crown Graphic (much like the Speed Graphic you're looking at on ebay) that got me started. The Wollensak normal lens that came with it is a perfectly tolerably lens for starter work, despite visible bubbling in the lens. Remarkable. Anyhow, I shot with that camera for a long time, and took some great work.

Eventually, the limits of that camera forced me into an upgrade. See, the greatest thing about LF is the camera adjustment -- you can move the lens (and the back, if you're into that) wherever you want them. It seems silly, but it's really neat when you get it right. The Graphics are wooden-box cameras that fold out and have limited and ancient adjustments. Because of the inherent inaccuracies there, I found I was spending a lot of time setting up shots that were slightly out of focus. Very frustrating. So I hunted for a long time and found a "broken" Horseman rail camera that was being sold by a studio because it "didn't work anymore." Turns out one of the knobs had broken and needed to be glued back together -- aside from that, it's perfect.

So you can do LF without breaking the bank -- the cameras are starting to get very affordable as the digital age dawns in full. The Graflex series is a great way to get started. But MAKE SURE THE AUTOFOCUS WORKS! If you get a Graflex without the "autofocus," you'll never have that feature. There used to be one guy in this country who could fix it, but I think he ran out of spare parts and died years ago. Oh, when I say "autofocus," don't think that I mean anything really automatic -- it's really just a range-finder, like you'd get on an early split-focus camera. Still, it allows hand held LF work, which is really handy in action situations. Don't laugh, you'd be surprised. Some of my best LF work has been hand held. :)

Film comes from B&H, and for starters, go with cheap B&W. If you're completely insane, you may eventually decide to do your own 4x5 slides, but that's crazy. If that bug ever bites you, drop me a PM, I'll let you know what I learned from that process.

You will find that developing your own 4x5 is the only way to go. Get a good developing tank (the round ones are the way to go -- the boxy ones develop a little unevenly) and pick a room to make dark. B&H probably still sells chemicals, as well as a few places in the midwest, iirc.

For printing, your best bet is NOT to buy a scanner. To get a scanner that will do justice to LF, you'll need to spend a very shiny coin. For that kind of coin, you're far better off leaving your negs with a good local shop that has their own drum scanner. They'll do better work than you could ever afford to do, and it'll be quicker and cheaper than you'll ever do. The other alternative -- are you sitting down? -- is to get a large format photo-enlarger and set up a dark room. Mine was only a few hundred dollars, and it's a high end Beseler unit complete with voltage regulation and a stack of lenses. Printing is not that hard, and is quite rewarding once you get used to it. OTOH, I've nearly given up on it because I just don't have that kind of time any more.

So ... yes, the Graphic is a great starter camera. For a few hundred dollars you can figure out whether or not you like 4x5. If you get into it, there are a host of higher quality options for the appropriate levels of cash.

Cheers,
Dan

[QUOTE=scottmandue;3893958]Steve, what scanner are you using for that?

I use a Nikon 35mm scanner and also a flat bed cannon, I have only used my little lite table trick for the large format ( which worked surprisingly well). Do a search for large or medium format scanners on goggle and there is a pile of information. I had a dark room for black and white and it was a lot of fun but is time consuming to make the prints. If the negatives are scanned you can look at the final product on your computer and then decide which ones you may want to print.
Steve