Originally Posted by nostatic (Post 4013438)

Flat tax or *massive* tax reform. Taxes shouldn't be about redistributing wealth, but making the country run and providing essential services.

Originally Posted by pwd72s (Post 4014319)

I'm with you on this one....but we'd disagree on what is essential.

Originally Posted by Jeff Higgins (Post 4014401)

I'll go one step further, Supe. Only contributing citizens get a vote. In the past, in Great Britain and other places, property owners were the only ones allowed to vote. That's kind of harsh, but we do need similar qualifications. If you don't work, you don't vote. That's pretty high level, and there would have to be a great deal of discussion over the general boundaries of that, but that's the gist of it. If you are putting into the public larder, you have a say in how it is managed. If you are taking from it, you do not.

Originally Posted by nostatic (Post 4014452)

well, let's see. I can guess a couple we might disagree on, but we might agree on a fair amount as well.

To me "essential" are those things that are critical for the sovereignty of the nation, and also things that a "civilized" society should promote and maintain.

Transportation. Someone has to plan and maintain the infrastructure. There has to be some national cohesion so that the infrastructures can coexist. ie, we can't have 50 different railroad gauges.

Education. There needs to be some accountability and minimum set of standards. I do not believe that a fully privatized/capitalist education system can work. If you want "the poor" to get ahead, education is the path. Society should have some set of mechanisms in place to enable that.

Minimum standards at the federal level, all based on the three R's. We don't need the incredible mess that is the education bureaucracy to tell us what needs to be done. Politics invade at both the state and federal level, but the mistakes are magnified when the Dept of Ed goons it. Let state and school districts experiment if they want. Pay good teachers what they are really worth and change will follow.

Health Care. I do not favor national healthcare only, but instead a mix of public and private. Let's call a spade a spade - we essentially have a bastard form of national health care now but don't call it that, and don't run it in any efficient way. Establish a minimum level of care for everyone through a network of facilities. Then allow private as "value added." Yes, you get better health care if you have more money. That's the way life works. But you shouldn't be denied basic care just because you're poor.

Not sure. Health care is the 800lbs booger. HC needs revamping but it must include real reform in tort, pharm, etc.

Welfare. Abolish the current system and move to a work/mentor/public service model. In order to receive assistance you have to do something. Pick up trash in parks, sweep the sidewalk in front of your apartment, etc. Ideally one would work for a local small business as their "service."

The Arts. I think there needs to be some money provided to support the arts. I'm not clear on how to best do this, but I was struck the other night when watching Frontline and they did a 25 year retrospective. They produced some amazing content that is still compelling. Commercial tv just doesn't do that. I know...I deal with the industry and they have no interest in quality, just what sells.

No funding for art at the federal level. None. State, sure.

Energy. Fund the "Manhattan Project" for energy independence. Support decentralized production (co-ops) and conservation along with alternatives. But don't become the teat for large industries to suck on. If there is money to be made in oil, coal gasification, nuclear then industry should go for it.

Agree but it would be a nightmare to manage...I have some ideas on incentives and think that the appropriations for the project must be clearly tied to metrics and benchmarks. Insane amounts of money could get wasted

Military. As long as we have humans, we will have wars. But the MIC is pretty broken and insane amounts of money get wasted. Time to revamp the system. That's a huge undertaking in itself, but we don't have a sustainable model. There is work towards the "future warfighter" and costs and human factors need to be a huge part of the equation. I'd streamline intelligence but at the same time increase their capabilities.

Roles and missions need to be constantly refined...Gates is actually doing a good job. We simply cannot afford the military in it's current livery...manpower is an overwhelming bill that will have to be paid in the coming years. We are at the point in the curve where we are gold plating weapons systems to the point of absurdity. Best is the enemy of good enough and we can't afford billion dollar aircraft. Unmanned vehicles will rule the next century.

that's a start...

Originally Posted by Seahawk (Post 4014592)

Some comment:

Minimum standards at the federal level, all based on the three R's. We don't need the incredible mess that is the education bureaucracy to tell us what needs to be done. Politics invade at both the state and federal level, but the mistakes are magnified when the Dept of Ed goons it. Let state and school districts experiment if they want. Pay good teachers what they are really worth and change will follow.

Originally Posted by Superman (Post 4014631)

Where did you cretins get such rational ideas?

Originally Posted by Jeff Higgins (Post 4014401)

I'll go one step further, Supe. Only contributing citizens get a vote. * * * If you don't work, you don't vote. That's pretty high level, and there would have to be a great deal of discussion over the general boundaries of that, but that's the gist of it. If you are putting into the public larder, you have a say in how it is managed. If you are taking from it, you do not.

Originally Posted by Superman (Post 4014337)

Prohibit participation in public policy formation by anyone other than citizens/voters, and their associations. Campaign contributions. Lobbying. All manner of participation in lawmaking or government administration is prohibited to legal entities that are not citizens/voters. In other words, no corporate involvement in politics or public policy-making. Citizens only. For each instance in which a corporation is found to be involved, a tax of 50% of its profits for a period of five years would be assessed. If you cannot vote, then you have no business is Washington.

Originally Posted by VaSteve (Post 4015087)

Turn off the ****ing internet and get back to work. Really. I started a new job this week, they have web filters. I have gotten more done this week then ever. If we could get people to stop IM, myspacing, youtubing, PPOTing, we could really get some **** done.

Originally Posted by Chuck Moreland (Post 4014165)

Flat tax - no deductions, exemptions, or credits.

Not only would it simplify the tax process and save a pile of time and money, it would eliminate political "vote buying". Candidates could no longer buy votes buy promising favored (or punitive) tax treatment for this-or-that group.

Originally Posted by VaSteve (Post 4015104)

No welfare. Can't work cause you got 6 kids? Fine. Drop them off at the babysitting co-op. Some other "can't work" baby mamma can watch them while you work and then vice versa.