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drag racing the short bus
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Location, Location...
Posts: 21,983
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If Europe is so environmentally conscious...
...what's with all the two stroke engines many of the commuters use? I'm talking about scooters and motorcycles. They're everywhere in the big cities, at least that I recently visited. But man, are they, in mass, the nastiest polluters I've experienced. I saw a Yamaha YZ spew out more smoke than I've seen coming from the stacks of a diesel semi. Almost as bad is the wreak off these bikes. Sure, I like engine smells, but in a hoard of twenty or so scooters/motorcycles, that same oil/gas scent is so overwhelming, it's almost nauseating .
So now I wonder: if certain European countries with large cities are so environmentally conscious, why haven't these countries dealt with the scooters and two-stroke bikes? I have to say, the immediate on-street air in downtown L.A. is a lot better than La Rambla in Barcelona, Spain.
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The Terror of Tiny Town |
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06-30-2008, 09:56 PM
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Gon fix it with me hammer
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they are banned btw... all scooters sold today are 4 stroke
EDIT, correction, the law is proposed EU wide, and needs to be ratified the 2006 law was emissions based, stronger regulation, difficult to meet with 2 stroke, to push manufacturers towards 4stroke, but no ban yet Ban should come into effect soonish
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Stijn Vandamme EX911STARGA73EX92477EX94484EX944S8890MPHPINBALLMACHINEAKAEX987C2007 BIMDIESELBMW116D2019 Last edited by svandamme; 07-01-2008 at 02:00 AM.. |
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07-01-2008, 01:54 AM
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durn for'ner
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: South of Sweden
Posts: 17,090
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I bloody hate scooters. Not that I have thought so much of the environment, but the noise! There is a gang of gangsters (youngsters) in my neighborhood with scooters. They spend the evenings racing around and around and around and ...I am fixing to buy a pellet gun!
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Markus Resident Fluffer Carrera '85 |
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07-01-2008, 03:09 AM
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07-01-2008, 03:21 AM
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Registered
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Cambridge, MA
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Tru6 Restoration & Design Last edited by Shaun 84 Targa; 07-01-2008 at 03:38 AM.. |
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07-01-2008, 03:25 AM
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durn for'ner
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: South of Sweden
Posts: 17,090
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You guys are an invaluable, never ending, source of good advice, cheering up and cunning plans! Thanks!
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Markus Resident Fluffer Carrera '85 |
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07-01-2008, 03:34 AM
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Join Date: Apr 2002
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BTW, Markus, do you really use the phrase "I am fixin' to... "? I thought that was strictly a "southern thang"
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07-01-2008, 03:41 AM
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durn for'ner
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: South of Sweden
Posts: 17,090
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Keith, I picked up most of my English phrases from American movies. I blame Hollywood.
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Markus Resident Fluffer Carrera '85 |
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07-01-2008, 03:55 AM
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Unfair and Unbalanced
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: From the misty mountains to the bayou country
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"SARAH'S INSIDE Obama's head!!!! He doesn't know whether to defacate or wind his watch!!!!" ~ Dennis Miller! |
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07-01-2008, 04:17 AM
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(the shotguns)
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Maryland
Posts: 21,582
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The pessimist in me says it has zero to do with being green and everything to do with necessity.
Old, crowded cities with small roads and maybe expensive gas just scream for scooters!
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***************************************** Well i had #6 adjusted perfectly but then just before i tightened it a butterfly in Zimbabwe farted and now i have to start all over again! I believe we all make mistakes but I will not validate your poor choices and/or perversions and subsidize the results your actions. |
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07-01-2008, 11:39 AM
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Banned
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: South of Heaven
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07-01-2008, 12:07 PM
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durn for'ner
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: South of Sweden
Posts: 17,090
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Markus Resident Fluffer Carrera '85 |
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07-01-2008, 12:17 PM
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: N. Phoenix AZ USA
Posts: 28,943
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DD,
Which cities other than Barcelona are you referring to? I have not seen a 2 stroke anything in Europe in years... Joe
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2013 Jag XF, 2002 Dodge Ram 2500 Cummins (the workhorse), 1992 Jaguar XJ S-3 V-12 VDP (one of only 100 examples made), 1969 Jaguar XJ (been in the family since new), 1985 911 Targa backdated to 1973 RS specs with a 3.6 shoehorned in the back, 1959 Austin Healey Sprite (former SCCA H-Prod), 1995 BMW R1100RSL, 1971 & '72 BMW R75/5 "Toaster," Ural Tourist w/sidecar, 1949 Aeronca Sedan / QB |
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07-01-2008, 12:21 PM
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GAFB
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: Raleigh, NC, USA
Posts: 7,842
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Starting to have scooters all over the place downtown here. That's great and all, but they are an absolute b!tch to clean out of the grille and wheel wells of my BMW. Especially if I let them dry up overnight or wait till the weekend. My strongest degreaser has a hard time with them.
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Several BMWs |
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07-01-2008, 12:34 PM
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N-Gruppe doesn't exist
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: *%@#ing GPS, where am I? Oh wait I see the Space Needle.
Posts: 4,394
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probably all of them. you can still get NEW ones in the states. maybe not in cali with all the bans they have in place there. one of my co-workers has one and i am thinking about picking one up myself. either an aprillia or Kimco. short non highway commute.
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Ted '70 911T 3.0L "SKIPPY" R-Gruppe #477 '73 914 2.0L SOLD bye bye "lil SMOKEY"  "Silence is Golden, but duct tape is SILVER.” other flat fours:'77 VWBus 2.0L & 2002 ImprezaTS 2.5L |
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07-01-2008, 12:46 PM
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drag racing the short bus
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Location, Location...
Posts: 21,983
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I side with Berettafan as to the necessity. I've seen some very small cars in Europe - some smaller than the original Mini - and believe it or not, those cars would not fit through some of the streets in the cities above. Plus, parking is a beyotch in these cities - most of it permit only. So while I see the idea of scooters as needed, they really take a lot out of you as a pedestrian in the way of noise and exhaust. Plus, the way some of the people drive their scooters is absolutely suicidal. No wonder I hardly saw in cyclists. As far as two-strokes go, yep, they're still offered on the market. Case in point is this Aprilia SR50, which looks like a rocket as far as scooters go.  Oddly enough, this scooter is listed on the Aprilia/USA website, though I would think there'd be no way you could get this thing new into the country.
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The Terror of Tiny Town |
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07-01-2008, 01:10 PM
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Registered
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I race off road enduro - riding a KTM 200.
Reckon in any event 75% of the field is riding 2-strokes. Couldn't afford to race if 4-strokes were the only option - rebuild costs are just too much. |
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07-01-2008, 01:15 PM
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Registered
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When I was in Japan earlier this year I didn't get the impression they were especially green. I just got the impression they recycle because they don't have much choice. There's just no room to dispose of trash. They are very clean so I guess that makes them seem green.
There were plenty of smoke stacks bellowing out more than just steam and plenty of two stroke motorcycles and old cars.
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2014 Cayman S (track rat w/GT4 suspension) 1979 930 (475 rwhp at 0.95 bar) |
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07-01-2008, 03:00 PM
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N-Gruppe doesn't exist
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: *%@#ing GPS, where am I? Oh wait I see the Space Needle.
Posts: 4,394
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Quote:
http://www.cycleworkswa.com/new_vehicle_detail.asp?sid=04427606X7K1K2008J6I08I 15JPMQ2731R0&veh=58643&CatDesc=Scooters&ModelYear=2008
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Ted '70 911T 3.0L "SKIPPY" R-Gruppe #477 '73 914 2.0L SOLD bye bye "lil SMOKEY" "Silence is Golden, but duct tape is SILVER.” other flat fours:'77 VWBus 2.0L & 2002 ImprezaTS 2.5L |
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07-01-2008, 03:09 PM
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drag racing the short bus
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Location, Location...
Posts: 21,983
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Ted - I saw a couple SR50 Rs in Europe. They seem a lot more peppy than the other scooters. The Aprilia graphics were hella cool looking. I'm curious though, do you live in The States? how will you register the SR50 R for road use? I think Cali has made all new 2-strokes pretty much illegal on the streets.
I found this forum that mentions the SR50 R, with a couple guys who have them in CT, but no mention if they've registered them. http://www.apriliaforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=151564&page=5
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The Terror of Tiny Town |
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07-01-2008, 03:28 PM
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BimForce the Third, Esquire
1985 Porsche 911 carrera Yes! 
1979 Porsche 930 3.4
