Faster hot water.

[Ned, NYNA11]

Guys and fellow amateur plumbers,

We have a hot water tank in the basement that provides heated water for the house. Heat source is an oil fired hot water "Hydronic" hot water radiator heating system.

There were complaints about the time it took to get hot water in the bathrooms.

The reason for the delay is that all the copper pipe from the tank to the faucet has to be heated by the hot water before it comes out hot.

So then how do I keep the hot water line hotter to get faster hot water?

The washing machine in the basement has a hot and cold water supply and I disconnected it from the hot and cold and then connected the hot line to the cold supply. I had speculated that the hot water rising to the top of the tank would circulate back to the tank if there was a return line.

Connecting to the cold water provided the return as is connects to the bottom of the tank.

Results? It worked. The hot line warmed up enough to give us the much desired faster hot water.

Nothing of course is free and doing this on a permanent basis would increase water heating costs. To make a permanent change, I would connect the washer lines thru an adjustable valve to minimise the circulating flow needed.

[Heel n Toe]

Originally Posted by Ned, NYNA11

There were complaints about the time it took to get hot water in the bathrooms.

The reason for the delay is that all the copper pipe from the tank to the faucet has to be heated by the hot water before it comes out hot.

So then how do I keep the hot water line hotter to get faster hot water?

If the line were insulated, that would help it heat up a bit quicker.

Just for curiosity's sake, sometime when you're sure there hasn't been any hot water through that line in a few hours, turn on the hot faucet in the furthest bathroom and time how long it takes it to get hot.

I bet it's not more than 20 seconds.

In which case, tell the complainers to stop their whining.

[daepp]

In Cal, where is doesn't get that cold, there are still complaints. Many add recirculating pumps on a timer that runs the pump around shower times and dinner time. Not that costly.

[oldE]

Why not just install a point-source heater?

Les

[Ned, NYNA11]

John,

The lines are insulated. The hot water line is a 50 ft run of 3/4 copper. Thats the real problem.

[TimT]

Install a circulating pump between the water heater and the farthest fixtures. These periodically circulate the water so your hot water pipe is always full... Also insulate all the pipe you have access too.

These circulation systems save water and energy

example:

http://www.armstrongpumps.com/astroexpress/Astro/Howtowork.htm

This system can be had for around $300 and is easily installed.

[JavaBrewer]

Originally Posted by daepp

In Cal, where is doesn't get that cold, there are still complaints. Many add recirculating pumps on a timer that runs the pump around shower times and dinner time. Not that costly.

Doesn't a home's plumbing need to be redone to support that? What about a traditional SoCal house with the water heater in the garage feeding applicances and showers upstairs? Hell our kitchen sink is on the lower level and in the morning it generally takes 20 seconds for the hot water to reach the faucet. Upstair shows are 30 seconds. That's a bit of water down the drain...so to speak...

EDIT - never mind. Tim posted a link. Thanks!

[Ned, NYNA11]

Tim,
There is no need for a pump if you do what I did. Convective circulation keeps the hot pipe warm. The shutoff between the lines stops circulation as needed. It also allows you to minimise the flow to ah, conserve energy.

[TimT]

Doesn't a home's plumbing need to be redone to support that?

Not usually. The recirc valve usually connects between the fixtures cut off valve and fixture.

I installed this system in my Vermont house since it took to long and wasted to much water waiting at the farthest shower for hot water. The well supplying my house is slow sometimes and and the extra load and waste of waiting for hot water sometimes put it over the tipping point i.e. running out of water...

Since installing this no problemo

[TimT]

Convective circulation keeps the hot pipe warm

Yes that will always work.

The systems with pumps and check bypass type valves can be set up many different ways.. some have motion sensors which energize the pump only when someone is in the room where the hw is needed. The Armstrong system is set on a timer where you energize the system only during periods when you expect use.


I like the emotion sensor idea, bit complex though, really though, how much will you save?