Hey look, a comedian!;) I only do well selling my cars because they're actually NICE. I wouldn't be able to push the trash that they sell at used car lots.

I know you have a lot of family in the mid west, but have you seriously considered moving? You can PM if you like...there are lots of engineering jobs in my area that could lead to other opportunities.

Seriously.

I know moving is a PITA and everything (I'm going through that now) but at the end of the day if it's going to put you in a better place/position, is it not worth a little short-term inconvenience?

Honestly it's not about short-term inconvenience, it's about family. My wife is the oldest of 10 kids, they're a very tight-knit family. We currently live about two hours away from them, close enough that we can still visit for the day. Honestly if I wanted to move much further away, I'd probably have to leave her behind. To her credit, she's always been honest in regards to her family, so I knew what to expect and have no animosity towards her. Unfortunately it does obviously limit my choices.

Paul, knowing your background I'm sure you are involved with some interesting things. It's a damn shame I don't live closer.

Jeff, by the way, what do you have planned?

I completely understand about the move. One last question: how far is too far? I get a lot of folks asking me if I know any good young engineers of various disciplines...some fairly close, Denver, Ohio, Huntsville, etc.

Shoot me a resume at pmorgan@unmannedsystemseng.com

Paul, in all honesty I'd like to stay in Wichita or the surrounding area. Again, I fully understand that this significantly limits my options. Obviously this would probably change were I unemployed, which is always a possibility considering the state of my industry.

Regardless, I'll send you a resume.

Matt, have you had a discussion with your wife about you not being happy with where you work / what you do?

On a side note, I respect you for not wanting to move her away from her family.

Bill

Paul, I sent you an email.

Bill, we've discussed it more times that I can count. My current position is such that I can afford to look for something here, I'm not being pressured by unemployment. Basically I want a new career/job, but I don't necessarily need a new career/job. I try to put my family ahead of my wants. Were I a single man I would have no qualms about moving to take on a new challenge, but I have to take into account my family as well.

I agree with you on the family. I could easily move within my company, and it would probably be a promotion. My wife really likes where we live in Colorado, and it took her some time to find a job she really likes, and that is close to home.

I enjoy what I do, but it requires a lot of travel. It gets old sometimes, but I deal.

I am about to do a bunch of international travel, so I am sure thats not going to add to my fun factor.

Good luck with whatever you decide.

I'm in final stage negotiations about an offer back east. I'm just waiting for the formal written offer letter (verbal agreement already met). Unless something goes sideways at the last minute (unlikely, but always a possibility) I'll be out of here in the next few weeks. Probability about 90-95%.

A lot of upsides, but naturally I have mixed feelings too - not the least of which is my wife having to probably give up her job (which she loves) and hope to find something in this crappy economy.

There's also a chance I might get hooked up with a gig overseas through a close friend of mine who's currently working in Qatar (energy business). Lower probability of success (maybe 25% that it'll actually come through) but if it does, I'm gone - even if it's after I've taken the other job. Living overseas, mostly tax-free in a wealthy country with no job security issues for the foreseeable future sounds just fine to me.

Not sure who you work for in Wichita but could make some educated guesses. You said you are not super interested in staying in the field, but if it were an option then one alternative would be to simply move somewhere else with more aerospace jobs -- like SoCal.

In terms of other options, I'm in the software business in a particular niche that has a significant engineer and engineering-management customer aspect to it; therefore, we have quite a few people with engineering backgrounds/degrees. There are lots of products and services where your background could be value-added without necessarily being the core day-to-day job duties.

Errr, are you sure they would let your wife be "western"? And is Qatar like Saudi - wealthy few, not so wealthy many, maybe high unemployment proletariat?

It'd be fine if it came through. All those details have already been discussed.

Qatar is quite a bit more western than Saudi Arabia. It's more like UAE or Kuwait.

It's quite interesting comparing/contrasting the difference between the Qatari mindset/political system and our own. For example, the Qatari government believes that the resources of the country (predominantly oil & natural gas) belong to ALL the people of the country. As such, the proceeds from the sale of those resources is distributed to the populace (after the ruling family and select individuals/institutions get their cut). This is similar to the Saudi system - or Alaska to an extent. It allows everyone in the country to be wealthy by their own standards and do pretty well even by western standards.

There is no tax on anything. There is no interest (Muslim country). Eight weeks vacation is standard, not to mention reduced work hours during Eid (regardless of whether you're Muslim or not). Obviously there are drawbacks (you need a special license to buy alcohol, and there are only a couple of places in Doha that sell it, and you can only have it in the privacy of your own home - sharing with locals is verboten). No burkas, no veils, etc. unless you're Muslim - western wear is openly tolerated. No pork or pig products (personally I don't care, as I don't eat meat anyway), etc. Lots of western franchises and presence there. A "free trade" zone in Doha allows a lot of trade if you're interested, etc.

It could be a really cool opportunity but like I said, I'm only casually pursuing it. It'd be a fascinating place to "sit out" the remainder of this recession - or place to be if this is indeed the "beginning of the end" for the U.S.A. (remains to be seen).

Getting the first $80k tax exempt is pretty damn nice too. Lots of upside to it.

Sorry for the hijack.

I'd think Seattle would be a good place, but it sounds like he's really sort of anchored down and limited with respect to what he can realistically do.

I can certainly respect his wanting to be fair to his wife, but it sounds like she's perhaps being a wee bit selfish/myopic in holding Matt back, if I dare say so. Probably not my place to say any more than that, but I do hope he finds something that keeps everyone reasonably happy.

Being "trapped" in any situation - be it by finances, family, jobs, situations or whatever - sucks.

I can understand how this is seen from the outside, and everyone is free to their own opinion. Honestly, I don't want to move either. The family issues are part of it, but I also really like Wichita. Before I even consider it as an option I want to exhaust all possibilities in this area.

Chris, the software angle is one I hadn't considered as I don't have any background in the area. There's a local company I need to look into, it's worth a try.

Jeff, where are you headed back east?

While I agree with Souk to look into the Pipeline industry, most Pipeline operators are not hiring right now especially in Houston, even though the existing management and staff is aging and retiring.

The price of oil and gas is very volatile right now and there is too much speculation in the Auto Industry, politics and national consumption not to mention the wild card: Alternative Energy.

I recently spoke with several "top shelf" recruiters in Houston and there are lots of Pipeline engineers looking for work locally there. It it an employer's dream as there is alot of talent walking the streets.

The Engineering Consulting arm of the oil and nautral gas industry is even worse. Several firms I know of have closed their doors, or have their staff working 30hour weeks...it is not a stable place to be right now. Working for an Operator would be the way to go (for example Chevron, Shell, Sunoco etc) - mor estability.

I believe things will turn around in Q4 of this year and next year in the oil and natural gas industry. Remember that the Energy Industry is the second largest industry in the U.S behind medical!

As an aside I work for an Engineering Consultant in oil and natural gas (EPC - Engineering, Procurement and Construction ) as a Civil \ Mechanical Engineer (15+ years experience).

Most employers in this industry are looking for people with experience based on ASME (B31.8, B31.3 etc), DOT, FERC as well as P&IDs, piping, field experience, simulation \ modelling unless you were OK starting as a junior engineer (around $50-$55K).

Good luck,
Yasin

Getting laid off may be the best thing that could happen to you.



When the former largest employer in Wichita decided to transfer all the engineers out because their association affiliated with the IAM my wife, native Witchitan, who also refused to leave realized that if she was going to live in the manor she had become accustomed we might have to make some changes. She gave a different location a try. She is also an employed engineer.

Cross train to a different field (liaison to manufacturing ???) not for me. In the "self made man" and "help wanted in Wichita" posts of a couple years ago you seem to be doing what you wanted when you set out.

Leaving that place was probably the best thing for OUR family. Here I am talking about the group that lives together day to day.
Note: I held back on all the adjectives that flashed to mind in describing that place.

No, it's not.

Hmmmm let me think. Aero engineer (lifelong dream blah blah blah) works for a company that won't do much aero design in the near future.

Layoff wold force him and wife to make a decision .

Hey, look, the therapy is paying off!!:D

Yep, a few years ago I was on my track and things were flying high. Since then there's been a lot of broken promises from my employer and revelations on my part.

Anyone associated with aircraft, especially commercial aircraft, knows that it's a highly cyclical industry. However, I think my issues go deeper than just a market downturn. Ignore the aircraft industry and the rest of Wichita seems to be doing fairly well, at least compared to many other cities. As I've said before, I really have no complaints in regards to the city.

As far as getting laid off, no thanks. I'm in enough of a squeeze as it is, I'd prefer to make this change on my own terms.

Why not get a job interview somewhere nice and have them bring wife along?

Think they'll bring her family too?;)

Seriously though, it really is something I have given a lot of thought. The longer I don't find what I'm looking for here, the more I will consider it. Ultimately, it's all about options.

Have you thought about working for the Government?
I have a similar background as you do. Construction experience, then went back to school for engineering. I worked for an aerospace company in the Chicago got fed up with that and found a job working for Gov. (Army aviation). I work for the Aviation Engineering Directorate (AED). While the work is not that rewarding, there are plenty of good benefits working for the gov. You get quite a bit of time off which lets you spend time with the family or with hobbies. Check out USA Jobs Huntsville Al area for a list of jobs. If you want shoot me a PM and I will go into more detail.

John, thanks for the suggestion. I've looked at the various govt job websites, and while there are opportunities they are all elsewhere. That seems to be a trend.

On a related note, more layoffs are planned at work this month. The rumor is about 1/3 of our engineering group is getting cut. That could very well force my hand.

Not to bring up an old thread but have you seen the latest edition of Aviation Week?

"Wichita the next Detroit"

Nice.:rolleyes: I will have to check that out.

You can't miss it, it is on the cover.