Odd vision problem related to pistol shooting
 

Any eye docs here?

I have shot rifles all my life and pistols occasionally for the last 10 years or so.

I am a bit nearsighted with a bit of astigmatism in my dominant right eye but typically do not need to use my prescription glasses in day to day activities. I have always shot guns right handed with both eyes open and typically see one fuzzy target and two sets of sights...never been a problem rapidly acquiring a decent sight picture.

I recently have been trying to hone my admitedly mediocre pistol skills to start competing in shooting contests. That said, I carefully sighted in my new pistol using a vice to zero the gun perfectly at 25 yards. I did this using only my left eye as it has the best vision. Well after wasting 500+ rnds, I have been have been continually hitting several inches left of center when slow firing. Because I am sure the sights are dead nuts due to my rigid "vice firing" sight in procedure, I assumed I was doing something wrong (yanking, improper finger location, milking, flinching etc).

In pure frustration, I decided to re-check my vice supported sight zero. It checked out perfect, but I bumped my set-up once and quickly looked back down my sights using my "normal" right eye dominant both eye open view and my sights looked off by quite a bit. I looked again with my left eye only and they were perfect again. :confused:

Turns out that when lining up my target with both eyes open, I am actually pointing the gun several inches left when cross checked with my good left eye only or with my glasses on with my right eye only. My brain is somehow shifting the image I see when shooting both eyes open with my poor right eye.

I do not have a cross dominance or target double vision issues as I can clearly get on target with both yes open just like I have all my life, yet something weird is happening now. Any one else ever hear of such an issue? I guess I need to see an eye doctor as I would hate to have to start shooting with one eye closed especially for the kind of fast action shooting competitions I want to compete in. :(

Left view below is what I see when looking at 8" target 15 yards away using normal both eye open shooting.

Right view is where the gun is actually hitting and is what I see if I close one eye without moving gun.
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1254407989.jpg

Tim it is not so much a vision problem as it is a "which eye is dominant" problem. I shoot a rifle like you do, with both eyes open, either left or right hand with no problem. However when shooting a pistol you absolutely have to aim with your dominant eye as the short distance between the sites accentuates any problems with your non-dominant eye, as you have discovered.

Zero the weapon with your dominant eye it should correct the problem.

Tim,
You can "train" your brain to use the eye you want. If you are right handed and use rifles and shotguns from your right side then train your brain to utilize your right eye.

This is not hard for most people (YMMV). Place a piece of tape (scotch tape) over the left lens of your glasses that you use to shoot with covering the area your left eye looks through. Because it is slightly frosted the brain will revert to using the right eye that has a clear (or clearer) view.

After several months your brain will be trained and you can dispense with the tape.

SmileWavy

at the zero-range at Ft. Dix
fire 3 rounds..bingo
DI don't touch anything ..your sighted,
just before 'record fire' they dispensed the birth-control glasses..
fire....DI WTF you shooting at..
go re-zero (took of glasses) your good..no problem
shooting..again the DI WTF..
I think it's the glasses..
he snaps them in 2
now shoot..
Expert.
39 out of 40

Rika

My right eye is and always has been dominant. My left eye has nearly perfect vision, but has not ever been the eye I shoot with. This is not the same sitiation as new shooters trying to learn to shoot with bothe eyes open or a traditional cross dominance issue. Like I said, my sights go instantly on target just like they always have using my dominant right eye with both eyes open. The problem is that the right eye and my brain are producing a proper image of the sights/target when it is actually not really lined up. It is weird. The first simple soulution I tried was using both eyes open while wearing my regular prescription glasses, but the problem is still there although not "quite" as pronounced. The only way it goes completely away is if I use either my left eye "only" with/without glasses or with my right eye "only" WITH my prescription glasses.

I qualified in the Army only as sharp shooter, but only because my color blindness prevented me from seeing a couple of the 300 distance pop up targets IIRC at Fort "Lost-in-the-woods" twenty some years ago.

Try the solution I posted. It is cheap and effective for most people with your situation.

My brain is already trained to utilize my right eye.... IOW, it is already my dominant eye as confirmed by looking at a spot on the wall thru a circle and closing my right then left eyes... the right eye is the one that maintains the sight picture I see with both eyes open.

i am right handed, left eye dominant...and my left eye is superior in every way...i feel your pain.

have you tried the sideways gansta grip? :D

sorry, i have nothing serious to add. i did go to my eye doc, and he gave me some glasses to assist. i have not tried to use them at the pistol range, but at the bow range, they are all but useless. bowstrings and glasses do not mix.

After thinking and sketching the problem, I think I may have this figured out. My right eye nearsightedness has gotten bad enough that while the rt eye sees the sights that are close, my left eye which can see far objects is generating the target image due to my right eye's poor vision. Up close 5-7 yard large targets I hit dead center as the right eye can revert back to how it has always seen targets over the years, but at longer distances, my brain is switching the target duty to my left eye. Basically my brain is using two seperate views that are generated from two different angles.

Maybe if I buy some prescription shooting glasses, RPKESQ's suggestion will indeed be useful to get my brain working again once it has a clear picture of the target being produced by my right eye again.

Alright.

You have wasted 500+ rounds trying to solve the problem. I have trained more people to shoot that you have fired rounds from your new gun. But you "know" just how your brain is mixing the occular images and "know" that my solution will not work. So you won't even try.

OK.

Carry on with your quest for enlightenment. I fear the quest might be very long for you.

SmileWavy

Close your non-dominant eye and wear your glasses. This problem is only as complex as you wish to make it.

I think Tim is probably correct- he is getting older and sounds like more nearsighted in the right eye (? early cataract), so his eyes are changing and throwing off what he is used to. Adjusting is like trying to hit a moving target.

Maybe time to see the Dr. Would be interesting to know the actual refraction of the two eyes.

Charles

On my way right now Charles.

RPQKNFYEW, I thought our signals were crossed based on my present knowledge of what a dominant eye meant to me.

I apologize Tim, my reply was written with an impatient attitude. I wish you luck with your vision issue. Remember vision can change rapidly as we age (and can be a sign of other health issues) and a solution for today may not work next month. I can be extremely frustrating to a person.

Let me know if I can help in any way.

The visit to the eye "doc" was pretty much worthless. My "prescription" changed minutely in the past 7 yrs since my last new pair of glasses. I guess he was able to tell me that my old Rx safety glasses I found at work along with my current glasses I occasionally wear are close enough in his opinion that they did not really need to be replaced. He did note some farsightedness creeping into the picture and suggested I may be looking at reading glasses or bifocals in my not too distant future.

This doc knew nothing about shooting or the issues I tried to explain to him in regard to my shooting. When I suggested that my brain might be using my right eye for the sights like normal and the left eye for target picture yet still maintaining a perceived down range non double vision image, he pretty much did not comprehend what I was talking about nor did he care. He simply said "wear you're glasses and close whatever eye you need to... have a nice day and please pay the receptionist on you're way out".

I wore my old safety glasses on the drive home and just shot some rounds with my left eye closed then intermittently closed and nearly every time the right eye did it's job. I think this problem might go away if I train myself to occasionally close/blink my left eye while wearing the glasses to check that my sighting picture is still correct.

It still blows my mind that this was happening and makes me wonder when it happened as I did not have these type issues early summer when I was on a rifle shooting kick.

I think I will be ordering some new Rx shooting glasses, but I will make every attempt to continue shooting with both eyes open as it is more natural to me when doing these rapid fire and running around IDPA type shooting events.

I can shoot rifles with both eyes open, but i have always gone to one eye with iron sighted pistols. I just close my slave eye at the moment right before i fire to finalize my sight picture. IMO it's just as fast as a 2 eye open approach.