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lawnmower.......

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Quote:

Originally Posted by sammyg2 (Post 5228504)

Hydrofluoric acid (HF) will reduce zombies to goo about a gazillion times faster than sufuric acid (don't ask me how I know). ;)

We had about 20,000 gallons of that stuff where I used to work, and 4 CCs untreated on bare skin was considered a lethal dose (on humans, zombies take a little more).
It eats through stainless steel and glass like a hot knife through butter.

Wow, interesting stuff.

Hydrofluoric acid - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Quote:

Hydrofluoric acid (HF) is a solution of hydrogen fluoride in water. While it is extremely corrosive and difficult to handle, it is technically a weak acid.[2] Hydrogen fluoride, often in the aqueous form as hydrofluoric acid, is a valued source of fluorine, being the precursor to numerous pharmaceuticals such as fluoxetine (Prozac), diverse polymers such as polytetrafluoroethylene (Teflon), and most other synthetic materials that contain fluorine.

Hydrofluoric acid is best known to the public for its ability to dissolve glass by reacting with SiO2 (silicon dioxide), the major component of most glass, to form silicon tetrafluoride gas and hexafluorosilicic acid. This property has been known since the 17th century, even before hydrofluoric acid had been prepared in large quantities by Scheele in 1771.[3] Because of its high reactivity toward glass, hydrofluoric acid must be stored (in small quantities) in polyethylene or Teflon containers. It is also unique in its ability to dissolve many metal and semimetal oxides.

Hydrofluoric acid is an extremely corrosive liquid and is a contact poison. It should be handled with extreme care, beyond that accorded to other mineral acids. Owing to its low dissociation constant, HF penetrates tissue more quickly than typical acids. Because of the ability of hydrofluoric acid to penetrate tissue, poisoning can occur readily through exposure of skin or eyes, or when inhaled or swallowed. Symptoms of exposure to hydrofluoric acid may not be immediately evident. HF interferes with nerve function, meaning that burns may not initially be painful. Accidental exposures can go unnoticed, delaying treatment and increasing the extent and seriousness of the injury.[7]

More seriously, once absorbed into blood through the skin, it reacts with blood calcium and may cause cardiac arrest. Burns with areas larger than 25 square inches (160 cm2) have the potential to cause serious systemic toxicity from interference with blood and tissue calcium levels.[8] In the body, hydrofluoric acid reacts with the ubiquitous biologically important ions Ca2+ and Mg2+. Formation of insoluble calcium fluoride is proposed as the etiology for both precipitous fall in serum calcium and the severe pain associated with tissue toxicity.[9] In some cases, exposures can lead to hypocalcemia. Thus, hydrofluoric acid exposure is often treated with calcium gluconate, a source of Ca2+ that sequesters the fluoride ions. HF chemical burns can be treated with a water wash and 2.5% calcium gluconate gel[10][11][12] or special rinsing solutions.[13][14] However, because it is absorbed, medical treatment is necessary;[8] rinsing off is not enough. In some cases, amputation may be required.

One of the local refineries use a lot of that stuff, very bad if it gets out of the box.

HF is way too squirrely to work with. Conc H2SO4 is a lot better behaved. Probably good to have some NHO3 and toluene around as well in case you need to make some TNT.

I've used most every organic and other nasty chemical. I stay far away from HF...

Quote:

Originally Posted by nostatic (Post 5229552)

I've used most every organic and other nasty chemical. I stay far away from HF...

LOL I try to stay away from it also. The refinery I work at now uses sulfuric acid instead of HF. I put that stuff on my cornflakes in the morning.

I had a very small delayed HF burn on my finger back in the late 80s.
It took about 10 hours to show up but it hurt like heck. Evidently HF will eventually work it's way through 1/8" thick PVC gloves if you give it enough time.

I had to get calcium glutanate shots into my knuckle.
They mix it with KY jelly and keep it in the freezer so it's really thick, you can imagine the size of the needle they have to use.
I passed out cold as a wedge during the third shot. Woke up on the floor with all kinds of doctors and nurses standing around. Felt like a girly-man that day.

BTW, you know how aluminum polish turns black when you polish rims? Chances are that's HF melting away the top layer of aluminium oxide.
HF in metal polish is really diluted (maybe a few PPM) but if it gets under your fingernails there's still a chance it can burn.
Gud idea to wear gloves when polishing rims and keep it out of your eyes.

I don't think polishing zombies would be a good idea unless you are into concourse zombies.
Most-dead-in-show prize?

Was told to use caution with Berrymans carb cleaner.
A guy I met said he nearly lost a liver/life after concentrated exposure.

The bodies I could put in the freezer. Dang teenage cat's peristalsis are jet engines.

Quote:

Originally Posted by James Brown (Post 5229472)

One of the local refineries use a lot of that stuff, very bad if it gets out of the box.

Is that the Shell refinery in Anacortes?
I didn't think the Tesoro refinery up there has HF.

HF has a boiling point somewhere around 58 degrees IIRC so unless it's really cold it turns into a cloud that hugs the ground and floats a long ways.
If conditions are right it can go miles which on a good/bad scale would be way down on the bottom, next to bad.

Hopefully you live upwind of that refinery.

Some good suggestions here. My hogs might be appreciative, but I think the heavy equipment is most practical. Hmmm, I could fill in that low area out by the gazebo. Now to figure out how to lure the zombies over there before they're dispatched, so I don't have to collect them all.

I hear they like brains, but what else are they generally attracted to? I could invite over a few derelicts from the local bar to sleep out in the yard, but not sure the grey matter content would be high enough to trigger the desired response from the undead intruders. Ideas?

They used to use HF at the Powerine and Mobil refineries in LA. Nasty stuff, had water deluge systems which I doubt would have worked because it would had destroyed the operators before the homeowners about 100 feet away. I did some Gaussian plume dispersion modeling on Powerine in the 80's and the catalysmic release spill scenario was a lethal dose area that was something scary like five miles across and 10 miles downwind. I mean everything dead, dead, dead.

Sammy it's the tesoro refinerey (now philips 66) close to Ferndale, I stay away! 95% bad juju. There trying to change there prosess after several had to have there fingers amputated following a small release several years ago.

Quote:

Originally Posted by berettafan (Post 5228988)

ya know, if zombies are already dead.....don't you need to practically blow them up to stop them and not just sever arteries/damage organs?

Come on man, every one knows you gotta blow their brains out. :D

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vern Lyle (Post 5229697)

Noise, movement and light, i'm guessing. Oh, and perhaps also scent.

Quote:

Originally Posted by m21sniper (Post 5228475)

LOL, didn't -everyone- die in that movie?

Ask Haitians or Chileans if they've seen any Zombies of late.

Nah, the two sisters lived, older one hooked up with the Mexican Redneck, younger one hooked up with some younger dude who almost ran over her when she crossed against the signal at the end of the flick after everyone else died.

That HF is nothing to f*ck with, no thanks.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hugh R (Post 5229776)

I worked at Powering for 9 years until they closed down. that's where I got the delayed burn. Their deluge system was basically non-functional. You know about props, right? They also had HF sniffers surrounding the unit that would sound alarms upon detection of a release and also notify AQMD and EPA but I heard rumors they were never functional either. Any wonder why that place is gone now?

the Mobil refinery still uses HF and their deluge system works. I worked there off and on as a contractor in the early 80's.
Valero Wilmington still uses HF (worked there for 9 years also) but they now use a modified HF that has a higher boiling point so it tends to stay in a liquid longer.
the reason deluge systems work on HF (if they are functional) is the HF disolves in the water fog really easy and as such turns from vapor back to liquid so it's more easily cotnailed. They also have containment dykes and other systems to prevent contaminated liquid from escaping the process unit.
Valero's deluge system was capable of something like 24,000 gpm or something huge like that. It was remote controlled and aimed and could throw out one heck of a lot of water. they have all kinds of safety systems in place there, that is a very safe refinery.