Sanding Wood Floors

[Buckterrier]

I have a friend that's contemplating refinishing her own wood floors. Has anyone tried this? I understand the sanding part is very difficult and the rental sanding machines aren't that good leaving chatter marks etc.
Not to worried about the urethane part just that sanding and prep before the coating is applied.
I appreciate any advice or hearing prior experiences.
Thanks in advance.

Mark

[peppy]

My mom and dad did a few of the rooms with hand held belt sanders. Sorry the pictures aren't great, but with the small sanders it is hard to screw them up. I hear the orbital sanders you rent are pretty easy compared to the drum sanders.

[djmcmath]

When we bought our house, we discovered that the original hardwood floors -- about 900 sqft of them -- had been carpeted over. Bottom line up front: long painful hassle.

So we pulled the carpet, which had been put down with a lot of staples and some nails, every single one of which had to come up before we could start in on the sanding.

Sanding was a huge hassle. The polyurethane kept gumming up the sanding pads, so we were swapping out super-coarse pads every half hour or so, or just wasting time. We ended up using 4" belt sanders to take out a lot of the worst problems. The floor's got a lot of "character."

Once we got through the old polyurethane, it wasn't so bad: a day or so of walking slowly through the spaces behind the big floor sander, just smoothing things down. We had to use hand sanders to get into the corners and around the edges, too. Big hassle, hard on the knees.

Now, two years later, we look back at 6 weeks of nights and weekends of pain and suffering, and we say "That sucked, but it was worth it." If we had to do it again, I'm not sure we'd do it that way. I'd probably be inclined to pay someone $2/sqft to just take care of the problem, if I suspected they'd do a decent job of it.

Dan

[LWJ]

I have some experience here as a remodel addict. I have installed and sanded two floors and refinished three others. It is as simple as sanding and finishing any wood. The difference is that you have a much larger surface area. There is a floor finishing class that is offered through a local community college that I took. Very helpful. One night of how to info. Two critical issues that I see - first - drum sanders are very aggressive and will put small divots in the floor if you are an amateur. I have some currently. Not particularly visible but still there. For that reason, I suggest that your friend uses an orbital floor sander. Not as aggressive but almost impossible to mess up. Home Depot and similar places rent orbitals. The other consideration is wood variety. I currently have oak. It is the standard. I have done maple, hickory, and fir as well. A big caution on fir as it is so much softer that you really need to go slow. I would recommend an orbital for fir as well.

As for finishes, I have overwhelmed with any of them. Kitchens and dogs really wear a floor finish off fast.

Good luck.

Larry

PM me if you want to discuss further

[flatbutt]

The big drum sander I used took a bit of getting used to. It WILL cut HUGE divots into the floor if you're not careful. But if you get it done right the floor will be gorgeous.

[pete3799]

We rented a commercial sander and redid our floors a year ago.
Turned out fine. Once you get the hang of the machine it's not difficult. Dusty but not difficult.
Face mask (several) is a must.

[Drdogface]

The drum sander will, as Flatbutt says, gouge out huge divots if you don't keep it moving. It's the edges and corners that are the real work. I did about 1600 sq ft in my first house in SF many years ago....lotta work but turned out great. Yes, dust masks or respirator are an absolute must.

[gr8fl4porsche]

I have refinished quite a few floors using Home Depots selection of floor sanders.

First you have to determine what level of refinishing you need.

If the coating is just wearing thin and scratched up - you do not need to completely refinish the floor. A light sanding and couple coats of finish will get the job done. You can rent a 20" square vibrating sander that does a great job without any damage. This is what you can do every 7-10 years to renew the finish before its too late. You can also spot finish floors where you experience high wear in a localized area.

If the floor is a mess with lots of deep scratches, covered with carpet, discoloration, stains, etc. then its time to break out the drum sander (fast and aggressive) or orbitals (slow and steady). The light drum that HD rents will destroy a floor in the wrong hands. Don't touch the floor without being 'on the move' - the same when you get to the other side. Pull up while moving. Start with the least aggressive grit that does the job. If the floor is really cupped and f'ed up - go straight to the 24 grit.

Once the finish is removed, increase your grit and take your time. Stop at 80-100.
Then I like to switch to the orbitals or vibrating sanders to fine finish and remove the washboard effect that you most likely just put into the floor.

Take your time - let the machine do the work. Stop at 150 grit paper then try the 150 grit sanding screens to remove light scratches.

After the first coat of poly dries, use the 150 grit screen to buff in between coats.

Pros use a round buffer with sanding screens but you can get by with the square sander.

Using the edge tool on the border is where lots of folks do damage. This tool cuts very quickly. I use it to remove the finish and then switch to a random orbital hand sander to smooth out the transition between the main sanding and the edging.

Good luck

[Chuck Moreland]

I've done 5 floors myself. Do a search online, you will find useful 'how to'.

I've used belt and drum sanders. The vibrating type I've used are a waist of time, not aggressive enough - perhaps useful only for removing finish on a really smooth floor.

Keeping the sander moving is key. You need to have the sander moving before it touches the floor, and keep it moving as you lift it off the floor. Never back-and-forth without lifting. You need to feather the cuts on/off the floor.

You also need to select the proper grit for the amount of material you are removing. Err on the side of finer grit to slow the removal till you get a feel for it.

Cutting cross grain is most aggressive, followed by diagonal, then finally with the grain.
Which direction(s) you cut depends how much material you need to remove.

With a typical floor that needs some smoothing you might start with diagonal passes (alternating direction each pass to cross-hatch), followed by final passes with the grain, progressing to finer grits as you go.

Rent an edge-sander for the walls. Also have a hand-held oscillating sander and maybe a detail sander for getting into tight areas.

You should be able to complete the sanding of a typical room in an afternoon.

It's important to have the right equipment, but the results depend on you and how careful/skilled you are. Having done 5, I still can't get the look the good pros achieve. But my results are plenty good and better than some pro jobs I've seen. Plus have actually done it, my eye is more critical than average.

[HardDrive]

I've done some floors. The drums sanders let you go pretty fast, but yeah, when you are using the rough grit they remove a lot of material fast.

As Randy said above, after using a drum sander, it is critical that you use a floor buffer with sanding screens. Otherwise you are left with small ridges in the surface.

Regardless of what sander you use (I would go with the orbital), it is critical that the floor is absolutely free of dust when you apply your top coat. Vacuum the floor, then tack cloth, then vacuum again. Have your work area setup so that your not tracking dust back onto the floor after cleaning.

My last bit of advice? Refinishing floors is a biatch! You can skip going to the gym that week, I promise you.

[Zeke]

This is one thing I'd hire out. Just the sanding, you can do the finish if you know how to do it with a lamb's wool pad on a pole.


Be sure to vacuum, vacuum, vacuum.

[azasadny]

We had our floors refinished last April as the guy who did it 4 years ago didn't put enough finish on the floor and spots were wearing through. The areas required 24 hours to dry and the odor from the fumes wasn't too bed. We stayed at a bed and breakfast while it was being done...It looks great and has held up fine so far...

[Hugh R]

I would not use the "Easy Water Clean-Up" that Art shows above. For the effort, I'd use the real stuff that you need paint thinner to clean-up. Whatever device you use, start by practicing in a closet for some other obscure area. As others said, go light and keep it moving. As Milt said, clean, clean, clean. Use a tacky cloth just before applying the finish.

If you have an older house with radiators, pull them out to get under them, well worth the effort.

[Evans, Marv]

Years ago a lady friend refinished her floor and sanded with a drum sander. She made an absolutely horrible mess out of it. It looked like the ocean with waves in it. That scared the crap out of me as far as refinishing or finishing a floor is concerned. When I had to install 2K s.f. of oak in my house, I considered doing it myself but ended up contracting it out at $2/s.f. to install and $2.75/s.f. to finish. In the end I was happy I went that route. If I ever have to refinish parts of it, I'll just pay the same company to do it and be done with it.

[DanielDudley]

Your lady friend should hire out at least the sanding. I have done lots of floors, and it is work.

[Buckterrier]

Guys, thanks to all of you. She has a beautiful old victorian type home and I know she wants the floors to be as nice as they can be. I sent her the link to this thread. It certainly will give her fuel for thought.

[john70t]

The water-based poly temporarly "fogs" with spilled water. Whatever brand you use, write it down for future refernce.

[RF5BPilot]

I used a rental, orbital sander to refinish about 1000 sq feet of oak flooring in my home. I thought the orbital, pad sander did a fine job (I think I used just two levels of grit). Good finish. I used a smaller electric sander to get edges & corners.

Since I'm a boater, used a good Dutch varnish that I'd used for years on my wooden boats. 15 years later and the floors still look great. While I respect the value of other finishes, I happen to like varnish as it's easy to fix small areas if you want.

There's nothing wrong with a less aggressive sander that assures a good surface and minimizes the amount of wood you remove (and the chance of gouging the wood floor).

[deathpunk dan]

I own a varathane random orbit floor sander with three 8" sanding pads. Got it for short money in nearly new condition...a craigslist find. So far I've only done one room with it but it came out great. I used minwax fast dry poly and scuff sanded with 220 in between coats...3 coats.

The machine is probably not as effective as a real drum sander but it's very user friendly. This is the same one you can rent from Lowe's. The biggest drawback is that it doesn't really do the corners all that well. So I used a half sheet sander and a palm sander for that. Also, the varathane brand abrasives are just okay. I am certain 3M and Norton offer something that lasts longer.

I am an idiot, more or less. If I can do a halfway decent job, anyone can.

One other thing...make sure you get wood filler for cracks and gaps.

[rnln]

year ago we rented the machine from Home Depot, very big and heavy. We sanded it all the way deep into the wood to have real smooth surface. What I am not sure is that if you have to sand away the finish or just roug it up is ok.