F1 Talk?
 

We havent talked about F1 lately. Which is odd because there have been some stonking good races - Canada for one. Just my opinion, but DRS, KERS and the frangible Pirelli are making thing interesting, and the first 4 rows are filled with some excellent drivers. Yes, Vettel is a bit dominant, but Jensen did beat him at last.

And what about the new reg developments? I'm disappointed the new engines are pushed to 2014, but glad they'll be turbo 1.6L V6 at 18K w/ 160HP KERS (2x current) with 10x the stored energy.

It's been a pretty boring season. Watching Vettle win only because his car is so much better than everyone else is pretty anti-climatic. It does seem that Webber has finally accepted his role as Vettle's development mule (in addition to Toro Rosso).

The only real hope for salvaging the season is if Red Bull gets caught with some very illegal technology that turns out to be the cause for their pace.

The migit tried to shut them down w/no engine mapping change between qual and race.

Didn't really workout so well. Like Vettel...Love Webber. I think RBR is Webber's worst enemy.

Not a boring season at all. I don't mind RBR dominating. It's no different than when Williams, McLaren or Ferrari did same.

Well, i just focus on the battles behind Vettel.

yeah I think its been a cracking season. Vettel is boring yes, but apart from that its been very good. I'm getting tired of hearing "YES - YES - THAT'S WHAT I'M TALKING ABOUT, THANK YOU BOYS" at the end of every race, to a point where I'm turning it off as he goes over the line. Especially in Valencia. Not sure how he could be so excited about it. He drove on his own for an hour and a half in perfect conditions! Couldn't have been a challenge for him at all.

Canada was ace. So was Monaco.

I find the modern tracks don't produce exciting races very often though. Some of them are as wide as runways and have acres of run off space. Usually results in zero retirements and predictable results.

Silverstone has potential though.

I'm also not sure what I think about 1.6ltr turbos. A little bit of be hankers for the old days of v10's and turbos! Truth is, technology moves on so much the new four cylinders will probably produce the same speed!

that has been revised to V6 turbo's with a 15k rev cap
and pushed back to 2014
mostly do to the red guys crying
so 4 bangers are dead for now

link
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/92664

Loved the ESPN headline.

Heavy Vettel.

Thank goodness. While I appreciate technology moves on, I just don't think the ultimate motorsport should be running 4 bangers. Even a V6 seems a little lame but hey what do I know.

Does it seem like there have been almost no retirements due to engines going ka-blamo? I'm impressed at the reliability of the lumps these days.

I have watched F1 since I was 16, lived through the killer years, cried when Gilles died for no apparent reason, watched with horror as Ecclestone and Mosely worked their magic and turned it into a circus, albeit a lucrative one.

This season feels contrived, the DRS makes me ill to watch even if it does add some passing. KERS is interesting but the limit on how much it can be used again feels contrived. F1 used to be about engineering, now it is starting to look more like spec car.

Latest is the shenanigans by Ecclestone and Mosely to oust Todt and regain control.

I have had enough....cancelled the PVR settings and will just curl up with a good book.....no desire to watch it anymore. I declined a freebie trip to watch the Singabore F1.....I guess my interest in the sport is truly dead....

D.

The bigger KERS is going to be interesting - figure the current 2.4L V8 make about 800HP (?), the current KERS can add 80HP (+10%) for 5 sec/lap, suppose the turbo 1.6L V6 makes the same 800HP but the new KERS adds 160HP (+20%) for 25 sec/lap (nearly 1/3 of a typical lap). Clearly to win you'll need your KERS working - it won't be optional any more.

I'd like to see the restrictions on KERS get unleashed, that is technology that we could really use in road cars. I'd like an extra 100HP on demand - call it electric NOX if you like.

The 2.4L V8s have been cool but have been "frozen" technology, I'm not sure what they have developed there that is useful for future road cars.

Can anyone from Texas, especially Austin chime in regarding the track? Last I heard, the Austin City Council was starting a game of hardball, and I also heard stories of nonexistent infrastructure vis a vis ingress/egress to the track, hotel amenities, etc etc.

Ferrari is definitely catching up with the Red Bulls, I doubt Massa will be back next year.

Bring back the 1.5 ltr BMW 4 cylinder turbos....in a new chassis they would be the fastest ever F1 cars.. c'mon 1500 bhp in quali trim...with exotic fuels...mmmm.

4 bangers are not a problem...

Guess you look at the past with rose tinted specs..
Contrived? What about the turbo charged equivalency formulae.....the total fuel quantity volume.. banning the Lotus 88? Brabham 'Fan Car'.. all engineering marvels or chaging the regs to outlaw the 6 wheel tyrell... or 4wd.

Lots of 'entertainment management' prior to Bernie and Max...

The reality is that unfettered the cars could now exceed the ability of a human driver to drive it...in terms of longitudinal and lateral g forces...Technology could be made to make the driver unnecessary.. unless it was ruled against.

We may dislike the current rules but its a matter of opinion as to which are good and bad.. not absolutes.

Austin City Commission APPROVED the F1 agreement today. I believe this means they can get State funding.


Formula One: Austin City Council votes in favor of U.S. Grand Prix

Promoters are building a track southeast of Austin Texas to host a planned Formula One race in 2012.

By ALAN PEASE on 6/29/2011
Related Articles


The Austin, Texas, City Council on Wednesday voted to endorse the proposed Formula One Grand Prix, opening the door for the promoters, Formula One United States and Circuit of the Americas, to access the $25 million in funds from the state of Texas’s Major Event Trust Fund (METF).

Following yet another contentious public meeting, the council voted 5-2 in favor of endorsing Formula One United States. Council members Sheryl Cole, Bill Spelman, Mike Martinez, Chris Riley and Mayor Lee Leffingwell voted in favor of the event, while council members Laura Morrison and Kathie Tovo voted against it.

Well into the late afternoon Wednesday, the council continued to capture worldwide attention from F1 and its fans, just as it has over the past several weeks.

Challenges on Wednesday were limited to the involved contracts--and whether or not they comply with applicable law.

The first speaker, James “Jolly” Clark of Austin, questioned the legality of Circuit Events Local Organizing Community (CELOC). Clark quoted chapter and verse of Texas laws that he believed would be violated by the City Council entering into any agreement with CELOC. Several speakers donated their time so Clark could complete his presentation.

Full AW story here.......

Formula One: Austin City Council votes in favor of U.S. Grand Prix - AutoWeek
Read more: Formula One: Austin City Council votes in favor of U.S. Grand Prix - AutoWeek

That has really surprised me for the last year. Imagine running a engine at 18,000 RPM for two hours, and not touching it for another two hours at the next race. They must really have their skills down to a T. I don't see where the 4 cyl. engines will make things better, and I would'nt doubt Ferrari say's goodby to F1 if it happens.

No 4 cyl. The teams incl Ferrari pushed V6 and got it.

Hamilton was very impressive in Spain. I don't think he ran into another car the entire weekend.

Its a splendid display of high tech orgy and superb reliability but in another sense I feel some degree of excitement has been lost. I also think it is kind of tedious trying to keep up with the constant change of rules. All in all a great spectacle to watch of course.

The main reason 4 cyl was discussed because Audi said they would join the grid if the new engine rules went to 4 cyl, now Audi have backed out the teams are now going back to their original engine proposal.

Rev limit will be 12,000 or 15,000, wish it was anything goes including qualifying only engines as that would be fun to watch.

Last year was Absolutely Fantastic™ as far as championships go. SOOO much fun to watch.

This year the racing is good, but too much domination by Heir Vettel. Not that he doesn't deserve it, he's a fast mofo. I think his domination is down to lightning quick qualifying made possible by an aerodynamic miracle machine in clean air. I'm curious to see his racecraft from somewhere besides pole.

I'd like to see some other changes.

1- Go back to ground effects and ditch the other aero. Aero that is inefficient when trailing closely will make for boring racing.

2- Ditch KERS and DRS. Contrived devices meant to overcome the problems inherent with aero racing.

3- Introduce a grudge match race. At the end of the season, the teams choose which race to re-run. Original points are discarded in favor of the grudge match points. If they can't make up their mind, Jack Olsen will decide for them.

Used to be a huge fan back in the days of Mansell and Senna. Now ive lost total interest in it. It has become too boring and predictable. Lap after lap of follow the leader

Ricciardo to race for HRT from Silverstone! Even though the car is a peice of $%*t, it will give him a great chance to prove himself, hopefully beat Luizzi in the same car and give the Virgin's and Lotus's a run for their money.
2 Aussie's on the grid! :D

I still watch every race and still find it fascinating - you just have to look harder for the interesting bits. As it has been for some time now, pit strategy is a big part of the equation, so if you like the chess aspect it keeps it from being boring.

Silverstone may be interesting. We'll see if the rule change takes another chink out of the RBR armor. The other way to look at it is to consider this a transitional year. Vettel may dominate, but there are some young guns who may develop some serious driving chops.

At any rate, the sound of the engines helps cure my insomnia so I'll tivo it forever :D

Some of you guys must think Vettel is cheating while driving the same car as Webber who isn't the development mule for the team. He's just plain not as good as the kid.

Why hate the guy for being good? Sure we'd like to see the winner change race to race, but hating the fastest guy because the races are less exciting?

Vettel proved he is a good driver in a BMW years ago. Remember?

I'm not going to re read the posts, but this thread has hardly been a hate Vettel soap box. Yeah, he is stinking up the championship, but this year there is great technology at play, in addition to his dominating qualifying and the races.

I wish they would go a little more in depth about that blown undertray; what exactly is the engine doing there? Is one cylinder firing at full throttle to keep the pistons pumping air through the exhaust?

Suppose that instead of closing the throttle butterflies on the intakes, you instead leave them open and cut the fuel and ignition. The result will be that the engine continues to pump air through itself, it just isn't mixed with fuel and burned.

Then, supppose that the exhaust is very hot and you take the further step of injecting a little fuel, in the hopes that it will burn in the exhaust system and increase the airflow.

JR

Pretty much it....except that F1 legistates engine torque output in relation to accel pedal angle...

So the 'little fuel burnt' has to be related to accel pedal angle ( i.e. driver input).
The legality is that in this instance the engine is being used solely as an aerodynamic aid and one that alters with time.. so its moving. We all know what the FIa say about arodynamic surfaces moving...not allowed (except for the ones we say can move to make it more of a show!)...

Sadly the real issue is money...the only way to define/refine this is by CFD and this favours big teams... as even windtunnels find it difficult to evalute this.

Okay, that makes sense. Thank you.