First handgun, Ruger P95 or Springfield XD?
 

Ok, so I went shooting with a friend on Saturday and I really enjoyed it. (Shot a 9mm Ruger P95) Today I went down to Turner's to look at a bunch of different 9mm's, just to get an idea of what is out there. The only two that felt totally comfortable in my hand were the 4" Springfield XD and the Ruger P95. The price of these two is certainly doable as well.

I know there's a large amount of gun guys here. What are the pros and cons of these two? Any other 9mm's you might recommend? What should be my next step? What safety courses should I take? etc..

Get the Springfield.

My first 9mm was a Ruger P95. It wasn't a bad gun. It also wasn't a good gun. The tolerances were a little loose, it could be fussy with ammunition, and it wasn't very accurate. On the plus side, it was inexpensive and durable. I traded it for a G17 the first chance I got. (I like the grip angle better on the Glocks than the Springfield, but it is highly personal). I would consider getting one for a back-up gun some day.

Glock 17 or 19:

Suggest you also consider which gun has more aftermarket parts and mods - part of the fun.

As a practical matter, almost any modern gun will outshoot you and, except in their first year after intro, will be quite reliable.

Think about used guns - they are about the most durable machines any of us will use, no particular need to buy new.

Finally, if you get into shooting, you'll likely get a quiver full of guns anyway.

Sig P239 is a very nice 9mm and you can get a nice, used one for less than $500

The smoking hot girl behind the counter at Turner's (no pics, Im not Lube) told me the same thing, Glock 17 or 19. It just doesnt fit right in my hands. I have the same problem with guitar necks, Ive always re-shaped them for my hands.

I have no objection to buying used, what do I need to look out for in a used gun? where do I buy one?

Sturm & Ruger firearms are cheap.

-When I was 17, I used to skateboard on a half-pipe in Michigan just north of Toledo, Ohio. My skateboard was this beat up old stick that I bought on the cheap; I didn't care.

I was there to skate. Not "hang" or be a "poser", I didn't care what I looked like; I wore old shorts and my running shoes. I arrived in my mom's pink '77 Cadillac DeVille, and when most of the skaters where spiking their hair, mine was heavy-metal long and I had a nervous tendency to chew on some strands from my forehead.

I sucked at skating, but everyone seemed to accept me because my local nickname was "No bu115h1t Normy". Boring, but accurate-

These handguns are average. But I've never had anyone tell me that they have any bad characteristics either.

N

Skip the 9mm .. . get a quality 22. 1911 w/ conversion, GSG1911, Ruger Mk II or III, Browning Buckmark. Get at least 5 mags.

You might also consider starting out with something other than a 9mm. .22LR is cheap, accurate, fun, punches paper just as well as 40c per round 9mm. Ruger Mk 3 is a classic, quality gun, you can buy one used and sell it for the same price years later. Revolvers are fun too, there are quality ones (Ruger, Smith & Wesson, etc) that you can also buy used and, essentially, own for free.

I assume this is a play gun, not a home defense / ninja warrior fantasy gun.

Anyway - next step is to go to the pistol range, try out (rent) different guns, see which you like, they feel different in action than just holding them in the store. If you have smaller hands, look at the single-stack semi autos or revolvers. Note some ranges won't rent you a gun if you come alone w/o bringing one (anti-suicide measure). Ask around about local safety courses, maybe a local Pelican can help you. Learn up on local (CA) laws - calguns.net is a good place to ask.

Safety first. We've had some threads on the topic, worth a good search.

For a first handgun, none of the above.
Jim

Get the XD. They're a lot of bang for the buck. Do not get a 1911 as your first gun. Glock was an acquired taste for me. Took a very long time for me to become a fan. My main carry gun is now an HK USP Compact. Stole it for $427. But you'll never find a deal like that.

Having shot both of the guns... Get the XD. I love my XD.
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1311571829.jpg

Take a bud with you and head to a range that rents out guns.

My Dad went to with what everyone told him to buy in his mind to be his first pistol a glock.

I had him try sigs, a .357 wheel gun, HK's, a CZ75 ( I REALLY wanted to try the CZ!) and a few other pistols. He ended up buying a 1911. It wasn't in his mind to buy it untill he tried the rest.

A 9mm is a bugger of a gun to shoot well. A .22 is probably the most accurate, by that I mean a good .22. Another accurate gun that you will get some satisfaction with how you are shooting is a .38 or .357 S&W revolver - something like a six inch 686. Or a 1911 in something other than 9mm. .38 Super is the same calibre as a 9mm (just a bit longer case I think and lower pressures or something) but shoots way better.

This is good advice.

Given your choices, I would get the XD.

I would recommend a Sig P228 or a P226. They are excellent weapons, widely used in law enforcement and military applications world wide. I have a P226R in .40.

Well, since you asked..........
 

The suggestion to start with a .22 pistol or revolver is very wise advice. You can/will develop much better shooting habits with a .22 than a centerfire. Once you have learned the basics of sight picture, body position, grip, trigger squeeze, breath control, etc., then you will be ready to move on to a centerfire weapon. I have been shooting on a regular basis for over 40 years and still take a .22 pistol (Colt Woodsman) along to the range to shoot before moving on to other larger caliber revolvers or pistols. Once you have developed your good shooting habits, then is the time to look for something bigger. Since you are in Kalifornia, the land of 10 round mags, why not go for a .40 S&W or .45 ACP handgun? You will have a much better/harder hitting round and will still be able to carry the legal number of rounds. The XD or XD-M, Sig 220, FNP and Glock are all good choices. Personally, I prefer the FN FNP over the Glock, but that is just "me". Good luck with your search!

I would go and have several, 1911's and one conversion kit. The kit allows me to shoot 22 cal. on the cheap. Having used a 1911 on the pistol team as well as in combat, the gun is hard to beat. It will take anything you put it thru. Lots of after market parts and upgrades. The design is over a hundred years old and is still used in competition. One of the very good things about the 1911 is if you run out of ammo you can beat the other guy to death with the gun. I do belive the colts are overrated, I have two. Remington and Ruger have just come out with thier own 1911. I just purchased a Remington, the gun is a mil spce type nothing fancy but a good weapon. You could go high end, Ed Brown, Kimber, or a custom maker. Just my 2 cents.

I agree, the Glock just doesn't fit my hand and the trigger is for shyt. I had two and sold them both two months after purchasing them.
Try a Beretta 92fs.

I love all the 1911 configurations (just fits my hand) so I built a 22 conversion for practice.


http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1311603402.jpg

Might find something local here.

Private Firearms Sales - Calguns.net

Bought me one like this as my first...
Hope to have the permit papers sorted out end of week

http://joecachia.files.wordpress.com/2011/01/dw26.jpg
http://joecachia.files.wordpress.com/2011/01/dw9.jpg

This is the last one I bought. Took less than five min. to buy it and that was only because there were a few people ahead of me in line. The guns were laying on folding card tables and, when the doors opened, it looked like the bridal gown sale day at Fillene's Basement.

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1311608196.jpg

OK, from the other side of the fence and the where did that question come from:

Have you tried a revolver? Seriously, go try one before you buy a semi-auto.


Ruger is a good firearm, nothing spectacular. It will get the job done. It is average.

XD is a nice firearm, considered more desireable in many circles though definately not all.

I like the 1911 frame and safety features, but that is me.

IF you a stuck on a 9mm, I would sugget to try the Browning as well. I do not like the S&W though many swear by them. I'd rule out Taurus. There are also some very nice, older European models out there you might consider as well. Just because it is used does not mean it is a poor choice.

If you are stuck on the Piccatinny rail system then you are stuck on modern spoons.

Seriously, try a revolver before buying the semi. Easier to use, safer to handle, fewer (WAAAAAAYYYY fewer) issues with misfire/misfeed, and they can be more interchangeable. For example, buy a .357, also shoot .38 through the same weapon. Just saying.... ;-)

Eric Holder must explain 'Fast & Furious'--Michael Walsh - NYPOST.com



"Law-abiding gun owners and dealers think they already know. With the Obama administration wedded to the fiction that 90 percent of the guns Mexican cartels use originate here -- they don't -- many suspect that "Fast and Furious" was a backdoor attempt to smear domestic gun aficionados as part of its stealth efforts on gun control by executive fiat."

Not that I'm biased or anything...but my suggestion is to pick up a decent .22 1911 (there are a couple available now) and a real 1911 (in any caliber you choose, but .45 is what real men shoot).

Alternatively you could get a real 1911 and a .22 conversion kit. After you put about a 1000 rounds through the .22 kit then you can graduate to using the orignal slide/barrel.

http://img228.imageshack.us/img228/4905/img13302sm.jpg

OK, if you want to mod a gun, then a 1911 or Glock is the way to go.

I shot a bunch of guns before I bought. In one sitting, I was able to shoot a glock 9mm and XD 9mm back to back to back. Both guns felt and shot nearly identically to me. I was equally accurate with both. I ended up feeling like there was just a tiny something that I preferred about the XD even thought I couldn't put my finger on it. I can only guess that it was the grip angle, but can't be sure.

Glocks and XDs are like timex and casio. They are both entry level, reliable to a fault, and will serve you well for a long time.

I really liked Browning Hi Powers and 1911s, but the BHP is pretty pricey, as the 1911 can be.

I ended up going with a full size XDm in 9mm, then I sold it and bought an XDm 9mm Compact to make it a bit easier to carry.

I have no doubt that I'll end up with a 1911 and a BHP, and probably others as well eventually.

I don't believe there is a 22 conv kit for the XD line, and I don't think there ever will be. You can get that for a Glock though, I believe.

Thanks for all the suggestions.

I'm not getting a 1911. Just not interested in either a .45 or a .22. Plus, none of the 1911's I looked at fit my hand.

This is just going to be an entry level, fun on the weekends thing. I'm not really looking for something expensive at this point.

The only thing I can think of is a guitar analogy. I played lesser quality guitars for years before I got good enough to justify buying ESPs and Gibsons.. With a gun, I'm just looking at the original MIJ Squiers right now.

1911 not fitting your hand?? did you by any chance look at hi capacity 1911's?
i haven't got big hadns myself..
When i was looking for mine, i had a hicap in my hands, felt ackward too, but the single stack fit's like nothing else.

I second the notion. Considering the flexibility offered with "slim" stocks, regular stocks, arched vs. flat mainspring housings, bobtails, officer's, magwells, a plethora of grip safety options, short vs. long triggers...Unless you use your feet to shoot, 1911s fit or can be made to fit just about any grip found in genus homo.

I vote for the XD. Its a great firearm.
I love 1911's but rarely carry one because they are single action on the first round. I dont like to carry cocked and locked.
The Para LDA 1911 45 ACP is double action...I will probably grab the next one I see
Till then I will carry the SIG

I carry the 1911 around the farm when I am not carrying a SA revolver. Safety in the back must be depressed before using trigger. Holsters hold with hammer ready and have a safety strap of leather between hammer and pin. Then again, I prefer revolvers so cock to fire is not an issue to me.

It is my choice, you have your choice. This is the same arguement with the Glock, effectively no safety besides yourself on the Glock if you touch the trigger. My 1911 has several safety mechanisms that can be turned off rather quickly.

Sounds like you're doing a good job with you selection. You have caliber and budget considered and you've narrowed this down to a couple of guns that feel good. Go fondle some more guns and if possible actually shoot them. Any ranges in your area that rent? Feeling good in your hand is important but that doesn't always translate to accuracy in actual shooting. I have a M&P .45c that for the life of me just doesn't ever feel 100% right to me. That being said I shoot plenty tight groups with that gun. So it remains a tool that fits a need.

Both the Ruger and the XD have a reputation for going bang every time and for addressing any warranty issues that might arise. Springfield has one of the best reputations for customer service around. I'd take either in a pinch and not loose any sleep thinking the gun wasn't going to work.

All that aside I have an XD40 that is one of the early ones, back when it was a $425 gun. Unlike the M&P it feels like it was made for my hand. It's been great. 1000's of rounds and not one single hiccup. Ever. More that one freind has purchased their own XD after shooting mine. I carried it for a long time and it's since been moved to bedside duty. Once broken in the trigger settled in somewhere between 4 and 5lbs. Some complain about the long reset but I shoot relvolvers as well and it doesn't bother me.

At some point you'll have to ingore the fanboys and just pick a gun from a reputable manufacturer that shoots well for you.

J

I love my XD. Glocks have a different handle angle, which does not feel as good as the XD. One of the main reasons I bought the XD (.45) is because according to reports, it is about as reliable as the Sun.

Jared, I have no idea how inconvenient it is for you to shoot. I shoot in my yard whenever I want. I have shot thousands of rounds this summer, and while I'm getting better, I need more practice. Shooting well takes practice. I've saved more than enough to buy either of those weapons by shooting thousands of rounds in a .22 rather than a 9mm. At 20 cents per shot (9mm from Cheaper than Dirt) vs. 3.5 cents (for the Winchester .22 ammo I like). For every 1000 rounds fired thats a cost differential of $165. If you shoot 2000 rounds from a Ruger MkIII, you've saved more than the cost of the gun.

Seriously, if you want to build your skills with an inexpensive tool and when you're worthy get a higher priced firearm buy a .22. They are WAY more fun than you think, and you can much more easily afford the practice you'll need to be a good shot. You're going to end up with one anyhow if you like to shoot.

Oh, and Groesbek is right about revolvers.

Springfield.

Look at the different models in the caliber your looking for.

M&P (S&W) is also making a very nice CCW in 9mm, dependable/reasonable as well. Keep an eye on Co. Gun Market (Rocky Mountain Gun Owners) for private party sales. A sale or transfer through an FFL may work (RMGO) for you.

Karl
88 Targa

I would recommend you look at the CZ P-01 or Compact. Excellent guns for the money. It's the only 9mm I own as I usually shoot my 1911's.

Thinking about this, a longer-barrelled gun would be great at the range, easier to shoot accurately, and you're not going to carry concealed in CA anyway. Here's some inspiration pics, I recognize the OP said he wasn't into certain models but I'm just throwing out pics (edit: none of these mine! Sorry for any confusion.)

Glock 24C competition model w/ 6" ported barrel
<img src="http://www.firearmsforum.com/I24758.jpg">

Longslide 1911 w/ 6" barrel
<img src="http://www.bansheearms.com/2007_06_25_1911_longslide_2-large.jpg">

Colt Trooper w/ 8" barrel, scoped
<img src="http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_LVy4D8vHUcA/ShHVn2lbq4I/AAAAAAAAACQ/TI7cqJ0cxRE/s320/colt_trooper_mk5.jpg">

Wow, nice 1911 there John.

I have a 9mm Glock 34 (it is a G17 frame with slightly longer competition geared slide and barrel) for range and IDPA competition. 1 1/2 years ago when I bought it, 9mm practice ammo was scarce so I bought an Advantage Arms .22 G17 sized kit for it. I have probably shot 5000 rounds of .22 thru it. It is by no means a bullseye competition type gun in .22 (I have a Buckmark and a couple Ruger MarkII bull barrel guns for that, but it definitely has been nice for IDPA practice where I typically shoot at cardboard targets with an 8" zero zone at 5-20 yards.

It takes mere seconds and no tools to switch back and forth between the longer 9mm barrel/slide and the .22.

I have about 10,000 rounds of 9mm thru the gun and it simply works every d@mn time. It has been cleaned only a few times unlike my .22 bullseye guns that get cleaned between each match to keep the hair trigger smooth and light. Shooting from a rested position it still groups 2" or less at 25 yards. Once I started using a high/thumbs forward/weak hand rotated max forward type grip, the Glock felt incredible in my smaller hands. I now use this basic grip style with all my handguns and it now feels "natural" to me.... It provides great recoil control for faster follow up shots.

.22 conversion on my Glock 34 next to my old Ruger Mark II bullseye gun.
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1311857818.jpg


G34 with 9mm parts installed
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1311857955.jpg

IDPA gear
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1311858081.jpg