Mac Question
 

I realize this thread will go to hell in no time so I'm hoping to get a couple good answers first :)

I've been told Windows can be loaded onto a Mac and run exactly as a PC. Is this really true?

Can I buy a Macbook Air, load Windows 7 on it and have an experience no different than I would with a PC? I can then load PC programs and download plugins and other nic-nacs meant for a PC without issue? It will appear in function to be a PC?

I can't imagine it actually works that way but thought I would ask.

***yea yea I know..."why would you do that? OS IXVCCMIII Spotted Warthog is a vastly superior OS"**** :)

all I can say is that most any pgm should run under bootcamp but not all

I have a datalogger pgm that will run on Win95 but not on ME or anything newer.

oh yeh - you have 14 days to figure it out once you get the machine

I tried a 13.3" Air book but sent it back

Interesting, so it is a workaround...not a true Windows clone type situation? That's where it loses me, oddball Windows programs like those used to program PLCs and other oddball industry stuff probably won't work but the more mainstream stuff probably will...???...

Parallels Desktop - 6 will run Windows 7 perhaps better than your PC - however, you have to buy both Parallels and Windows 7... And 7 is a hog...

But, you should notice no difference - and you can still run MacOS (I assume Lion, but it should work with any 10 based OS) at the same time - even games - like Call of Duty run pretty good - sort of depends on the video card you are running...

Ohhhhhhhh - you have WartHog... I am impressed, I was told WartHog wasn't even out in beta form yet... wanna share ;)

Ok, that would be cool. So I could boot the Mac in Windows seven and if I never looked I would never know I was on a MAC?

Oh and Spotted Warthog is pre-beta, ya gotta know someone. I could probably get you a bootleg copy of Domestic Calico though.

I run Lion and Win7 on my Macbook Air. I haven't had any issues loading and running my windows programs on Win7. Macs are all x86 now anyway so it is basically the same as a PC under the skins.

That's what I was told...hmmmmm

you know - this is a lot of effort just to run COBOL...

All Bootcamp does is assist in installing an OS other than OS X. It has no impact of effect on what software will run under the alternate OS. Lion version of Bootcamp only supports Windows 7. Snow Lepoard will support previous versions of Windows. Bootcamp can also be used to install Linux.

So to answer Lens question, if you install Windows on a Mac via Bootcamp and boot into Windows there is nothing different about the experience other than you are running it on Apple hardware v Dell, Acer, Toshiba, etc.....

While not the same as booting into an alternate OS VM's, (virtual machines) like Parallels work very well.

I used Parallels early on but have since found VMWare Fusion to be a better product.

If you want to play around with VM's bto get an idea of what can be done then get Virtual Box from SUN, it's free, has a decent amount of features, not as robust as Parallels or Fusion but it's free so whatever.

A few years ago, the fastest PC you could buy running Windows was a..... Macbook Pro. True story.

Yea, I believe that. I am starting to get swayed by the lure of build quality though, don't really care about speed. All the newer machines mac/pc are plenty fast, I'm just tired of stuff failing. I've always admitted that Macs are better built but I hate the interface(my wife if a Mac nut and trying to operate those things drives me batty). So, if I could have Mac build quality and run windows on it in such a way that it acts EXACTLY like a PC during operation...well that would be tempting.

A number of our developers and project leaders use Mac hardware and dual boot so they can run the win-only game engines. My son runs XP on my old MacBookPro on a daily basis. Beats the crap out of it...

Yes, dual booting will run the OS ... for a while when Vista came out (or maybe Win 7) a Mac was the fastest performing machine with it per the benchmarks used...

That said, I'd recommend using OS X for as much as possible (web, email, etc) and run Windows in a virtual machine using VirtualBox (its Free and free) for the one or two critical apps that you require windows for.

Why? Just because you like Mac stuff better or because there will be hiccups with the windows side?

I think that is Warty Warthog and Oneiric Ocelot. Warty is a way old proof of concept and I don't like the UI change in OO, as well as some changes canocial has made in the past few releases. I'll stick with Lucid Lynx until it isn't supported (its a LTS release) and then back to pure Debian. :D

There should be no hiccups on the windows side.

other than windows itself...

:D

Well that goes without saying but I guess it was worth saying.;)

That's something I've never heard before. Do Dell, Acer, etx machines really fail so soon?
Have you considered that regardless of the hardware you get now it will probably be obsolete, out of business, and perhaps not supported any more?

why not get a better cheaper non mac
and add OS-10.6 or .7 as a hackintosh
the chips are all the same now by intel

btw the air is a lightweight as a computer to

I decided to go the easy route, I need a PC soon and the Mac route leaves questions...I don't need questions, just a unit that works.

I went with a Dell (yea I know.....) XPS15Z which is a ultra thin 15" unit (almost the exact same dimensions as a MacBook Pro). Pretty decent specs and in home repair warranty.

-- Windows 7 Home Premium

-- Processor: Intel Core i7-2620M processor (2.70 GHz with Turbo Boost 2.0 up to 3.40 GHz)

-- 15.6 inch FHD (1080P) WLED Display

-- 750 GB SATA Hard Drive (7200RPM)

-- 6 GB DDR3 SDRAM 1333MHz (2 DIMMs)

-- NVIDIA GeForce GT525M 2GB graphics with Optimus


All of this for a touch over a grand from the Dell outlet. It's probably 10X the computer I need, but I need one fast and need to be done with all this. If it stays together I'll be very happy, if not I'll never buy another Dell.

Hackintosh is just that, a hack. Not reliable. I'd rather use Windows.

You would have been fine with the Mac but that Dell looks like a nice machine.

Enjoy it.

Looks like a decision has been made but I just went through this in the last couple of days so here is what I found in case someone else is searching later.

I loaded VMWare and Parallels both on an iMac (i5) to try them out. I had a laptop already running windows XP so I migrated the entire laptop PC to run under virtual machines on the Mac using both Parallels and VMWare. Both products worked well but the VMWare was slightly faster on the benchmark I chose and it used 1/3 of the memory footprint of Parallels.

On the VMWare software I set it up so the virtual Windows machine had its own IP address and appeared to the other computers on our network as a separate computer. I could also share files between the Windows OS on the virtual machine and the Mac OS X. Both Parallels and VMWare are available on a trial basis. Download them for free and see if it will work for you. Buy it only if you like it. It can be a memory hog depending on how you set it up. If you migrate an existing computer it will take more disk space than the current disk in you computer. One of my computers had a 1TB disk and both Parallels and VMWare wanted 1.4TB of disk space to migrate the old system. You could also start from scratch with a fresh Windows install to use less space.

I intend to try a couple of external pieces of hardware next to see if I can get them to work..... a USB to quad serial port converter, a USB video capture device, and another small data logger device with Windows only software.

SuperPi benchmark of (4) threads, each computing Pi to 16 million digits

iMac running Windows XP under VMWare virtual machine limited to 4 processors and 4GB RAM
6 minutes 45 seconds

3.2 GHz Dual Xeon processor capable of 8 threads but limited to 4 for the benchmark
11 minutes 15 seconds

I admit I punked out a bit, I'd love to try the Mac route (the machine not the OS), but I decided I don't have time for that right now.

If this machine pisses me off with build quality issues I'll probably go the Mac route next time. I'll admit the whole idea of sourcing Windows 7 and the associated programs was what tipped me over the top. I don't need that hassle.

I just want my machines to work........is that so wrong?

I know this doesn't add much to the discussion, but FWIW I know people running Windows 7 under bootcamp on MacBooks with no issues, and I personally run VMware Fusion with no issues. I have virtualized Windows Server 2003 and 2008 systems and they run fine.

I would also like to say thanks for all the input and sorry for what seems like wasting of your time, but rest assured your input helped me make my decision. Thanks again guys.

I think you made the correct purchase decision based on your individual needs.

Thanks, the older I get the more "Keep It Simple Stupid" seems like sage advice. I respect your input, I know you know your stuff.

I was wavering between this and the Samsung Series nine in 13.3" (which is a silly cool little PC), but that too left me with a lot of questions.

lendaddy - if you want to go mac - you'll just have to do it - it will never be totally seamless... and it will always have a learning curve. But it will be a computer that works.

I have been using Parallels for about 2 years - mostly to get access to some stuff at work, where everyone but the art dept (me) is on Windows machines. I have liked it because it has been very stable. I don't pay much attention to size - I have huge drives and a ton of memory. It seems plenty fast for the small amount that I use it. I got an i7 mac last winter - with snow leopard, and it has worked great on it - haven't had the time to go to lion yet.

However - Domestic Calico - neat - I'll take you up on that ;)

quoted for emphasis

that is exactly the way I feel

My wife is the Marketing Director at her place and is the only Mac user there as well. Her stuff really impresses me in several ways but I 'v tried to do the OS and it just doesn't compute with my melon.

In particular the AC power connection is a great idea, why no PC mfg can get with the program on that is beyond me. The Samsung I mentioned uses something sorta similar from what I'm told but not quite as good.

The case quality on her MBP is stellar, again....why can't PC mfg's do this? The Dell I ordered is all aluminum and magnesium construction but I'm under no illusions that it will be comparable.

reviews say it is a tad flexy - not a unibody carved shell like on the McBook

OTOH - you save lots of $$ and saved the hassle of transitioning to a new GUI, OS etc.

Yep, there are a few odd complaints in the multiple reviews I read but nothing that really scares me. We'll see....

post your findings - I'm looking for a 15" "ultrabook" or thin, light, long battery life, fast booting thingamajig

it'll be obsolete in 4 years anyway, so it really only has to last that long

True, but it's the BS issues between then and now that drive me crazy.

My current unit XPS M1530 is about 3 yrs old and the motherboard dumped on me. Not totally (I'm on it now), but the charging circuit or whatever it's called is fried so I can't disconnect from the AC supply...It also crashes all the time do to related bugs. So in essence....it's useless (and fixing it exceeds it's value).

That being said I have a Dell netbook that has been nothing short of awesome, an absolute rock of reliability.