Race on Sunday sell on Monday....again

[quattrorunner]

So I just saw something funny. A mclaren keep up with and in part kick crap out of a modern, new NASCAR with all of its 920 race horse powers on a road course and oval course. Until the high oval part that is. But even still, after 5 laps it came down to one car length. Slicks on the race car and dot tires on the streetcar too. Hmmmmm.
So....I was just thinking, and have been actually for a few years, about hp in newer cars. The past 10 years I've noticed a trend that has gotten a little out of control. See, 10 years ago, 400hp was lots of power! But now, it seems if you don't have that much and you want to stay competitive selling cars, ya gotta have some silly power.
Back to the race between that super car and the stripped out tube frame NASCAR, lets look closer at this, NASCAR cup car cost is 150k. A super car like the mclaren costs 230k. Ok, we'll that's at the dealer, and does a race car need the ac and comfort gadgets like navigation and airbags?
Look further still, NASCAR engines are not made for longevity, or pump gas, or flexibility. I'd bet a consumer engine could last longer than a race car engine. And better mileage too maybe.
Can you see where I'm heading? I'm not talking about building million dollar race versions of streetcars like the gt cars of alms or Rolex series. Just stock cars!! Wait did I just say that? Stock cars? No not the NASCAR stock cars that have no common parts from the cars the stickers make them look like. Let me change the designation from stock car to streetcar racing.
Look at the corvette, in its biggest iteration it's fast. Nissan can come. Bring the gtr. O-perhaps we should make a rule or two yeah? No homogation special limited editions. Sorry porsche, you'll have to race what you sell normally. One more rule that I can offer is that we turn more than one direction? I like the idea, and think its worth something. I take PayPal. Your welcome.

[Tervuren]

Lets see how long your average street engine lasts pegged at red line around 'Dega for 500 miles...

Those engines are built. The radiator openings are tiny on a track like 'Dega, in that environment, you'd blow most production motors pretty darn click.

[BReif61]

The biggest problem I can see with using truly stock cars would be the length of the races. Camrys, Fusions, Impalas... none can hit nearly 200mph stock. If race teams used stock cars, the Daytona 500 would take a day and a half.

Better bring a lot of ice in that cooler; gotta keep those mountains blue.

[on2wheels52]

How about you can race your street car in if you can make the field during qualifying?
You may have to work on your pit stops for fuel, but of course your street tires should last almost the whole season.
Jim

[id10t]

Originally Posted by Tervuren

Lets see how long your average street engine lasts pegged at red line around 'Dega for 500 miles...

Those engines are built. The radiator openings are tiny on a track like 'Dega, in that environment, you'd blow most production motors pretty darn click.

I'd think a "well set up" Porsche could do it... IIRC they are designed to cruise at just below redline...

[Tervuren]

Originally Posted by id10t

I'd think a "well set up" Porsche could do it... IIRC they are designed to cruise at just below redline...

But they aren't doing it bumper to bumper, less air to go around. But true, BMW and Mercedes with their 155MPH limited top speeds can cruise around at top speed for a while I would imagine...

[asphaltgambler]

uh....hmmmm.... a well set-up 944 is up to the task

[911SauCy]

Don't know how a GT-R would hold up.

Just this week I caught a few minutes of the show "Fifth Gear". They were trying to break world record for farthest distance traveled in 1 hour...distance to eat was 145.xxmi.

The GT-R lasted at 155-160, for about 5 minutes before stuff started falling off.

[BReif61]

Originally Posted by 911SauCy

Don't know how a GT-R would hold up.

Just this week I caught a few minutes of the show "Fifth Gear". They were trying to break world record for farthest distance traveled in 1 hour...distance to eat was 145.xxmi.

The GT-R lasted at 155-160, for about 5 minutes before stuff started falling off.

IIRC, it was a tire failure. Hardly the GT-R's fault.

[nota]

http://lawrenceburgspeedway.com/details.php?dID=5
current purestock rules for short tracks


what happened to pure stock road racing ?
IMSA use to run pure stock at the miami GP as support races

[IROC]

Originally Posted by id10t

I'd think a "well set up" Porsche could do it... IIRC they are designed to cruise at just below redline...

I seem to remember a story in the mid-90s of a guy who bought a brand new 993, slapped the requisite safety equipment on it and entered the 24 hrs of Daytona. I think he finished 24th.

[TechnoViking]

I saw that Top Gear US episode and I call total BS that the "race" would have been close at all. The tube-frame NASCAR car with 400 more HP could run at whatever weight it wanted. And of course there was no mention of what either car weighed.

The race car would trounce the street car, of course, but getting lapped does not make for a nail-biting TV segment.

[Tervuren]

Originally Posted by BReif61

IIRC, it was a tire failure. Hardly the GT-R's fault.

factory stock GTR's have had trouble when pushed at the limit. Its a car with fantastic performance, but I'd rather take the aforementioned Porsche for a 500 mile race at 'Dega.

[Aragorn]

If you are saying a start a series for stock based cars to race around World Challenge is pretty stock based with few modifications. Grand Am Continental series has the street tuner class as well as the GS class which are stock based cars with mainly safety modifications.

[quattrorunner]

Originally Posted by TechnoViking

I saw that Top Gear US episode and I call total BS that the "race" would have been close at all. The tube-frame NASCAR car with 400 more HP could run at whatever weight it wanted. And of course there was no mention of what either car weighed.

The race car would trounce the street car, of course, but getting lapped does not make for a nail-biting TV segment.

So, you'r saying that a nascar driver would just go along with making everyone think his car was slower than reality if it were not? Nascar cup cars weigh around 3400lb with an average driver. That mclaren weighs at least 400lb less fully lit. Including ac and all the comfy amenities a 200k plus car must have to sell it.
I believe it was that close but who knows.
My point is that this nascar crap is stupid. I know I know, I must be the only one that thinks this......
Also my point is to say that we could have much more diversity using close to off the shelf cars, in a compitition to see who can make a better car that we can buy.

NASCAR is rediculous. I realize it's fun for most the country to see their favorite candy or paint haul ass in a circle. But I don't get it which supprises no one that knows me.

[911SauCy]

Originally Posted by BReif61

IIRC, it was a tire failure. Hardly the GT-R's fault.

Tire, body panels, transmission...doesn't matter.

The summation of the parts make the whole...it failed.

I'm not trying to be jerky, but you get my point right?

[BReif61]

Originally Posted by 911SauCy

Tire, body panels, transmission...doesn't matter.

The summation of the parts make the whole...it failed.

I'm not trying to be jerky, but you get my point right?

I get your point, I was just highlighting that the issue that stopped the car could have happened to any car. But a defective tire on a GT3, try the same thing, get the same result.

[911SauCy]

Originally Posted by BReif61

I get your point, I was just highlighting that the issue that stopped the car could have happened to any car. But a defective tire on a GT3, try the same thing, get the same result.

Roger that

[id10t]

Originally Posted by quattrorunner

So, you'r saying that a nascar driver would just go along with making everyone think his car was slower than reality if it were not? Nascar cup cars weigh around 3400lb with an average driver. That mclaren weighs at least 400lb less fully lit. Including ac and all the comfy amenities a 200k plus car must have to sell it.
I believe it was that close but who knows.
My point is that this nascar crap is stupid. I know I know, I must be the only one that thinks this......
Also my point is to say that we could have much more diversity using close to off the shelf cars, in a compitition to see who can make a better car that we can buy.

NASCAR is rediculous. I realize it's fun for most the country to see their favorite candy or paint haul ass in a circle. But I don't get it which supprises no one that knows me.

I think an awesome series would be "you've got $50k to spend at any dealership on any car within a 200 mile radius of this track. You must pay sticker price - sales taxes, etc. do not count against your budget. You have 3 weeks to prep the car in any way you see fit - still going against your $50k budget - and you must add the following safety equipment - xxxxxxx - which does not count against your budget".

Make it half reality show, half racing. You'll have guys buying a '78 Camero and trying to trick it out, the rice car racers putting on their fart can mufflers and nitrous in a Civic, I'm sure a few pelicans would just go buy a well sorted 944 (or 911 or 993 or....)

Could be hours of fun - anyone a TV producer that could take this idea and run with it?

[BReif61]

Sounds like LeMons with a better budget.