Not entirely true, but considering the economics of the alternate choices, it might as well be true.

You can make ethanol from plant material, although the input of petroleum-derived materials is required to get the final product. You can make methanol from plant sources as well, but again, some form of energy is required as input. Hydrogen for direct burning, or as fuel cell - again, some kind of energy to get the hydrogen in the first place...

It's cheaper and easier just to burn the petroleum products in the first place.

Actually, there is one form of hybrid tech that I am surprised is not being used much - diesel-electric. Diesel seems like a perfect match to an electric generation scheme where you need high torque and low RPM.

Diesel-electric seems overlooked and seems to be the all around most energy and technologically simple and efficient way to propel vehicles. A Diesel engine could run as a generator at it's most efficient, least polluting, constant speed. A small battery could store energy as an energy buffer and all speed control would be handled easily by electronics. And another advantage is the high torque of electric motors when you need it most, at low RPM's.

Dang - there are deals out there...

Seattle Craigslst
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1413072600.jpg

SF Bay Craigslist
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1413072661.jpg


Such low prices I bet a person could get one with a straight across trade. . . . for half a dozen Prius's. ;)

Seriously, I just wanted pin this for comparison over the next few months.

Some of these cars for sale have just a few hundred miles on the clocks. -the jonez'n has begun for the 2-motor Model S.

I think I'll wait for the 4-motor AWD version. --I wonder if it will have lots of Green tax breaks too.

Because that is what this IS all about. ...saving the planet and sheet. :cool:

Update....

My dad was finally able to analyze a 2 month utility bill and compare it to a spreadsheet he has kept for 10+ years. Drum roll.....................

Since switching to the time of use meter, the total KW hours for those two months were just a bit higher than the average over the spreadsheet. Next drum roll............

There was a $100 SAVINGS for each of the two months of the bill. Next drum roll, one that really isn't Tesla related, but fits in..........

I am now running my dad's workshop on the side of their house for a few hours every day. I run a lot of 240V tools, most times, simultaneously, as the dust collection system runs off 240V and kicks on every time I use the table saw (240V), drum sander (110V, two motors), disk/belt sander (V?), band saw (110V), jointer (110V), planner (110V).... Numerous shop lights, though FL.

Then there is the fuel savings.... Offsets the bill roughly $75 a month. So, at the moment, during the highest Summer electric rates, they saved $350 over two months. We're now on Winter (cheap) rates for the next 9 months. :)

Tesla road trip!

Heading down to Ramona, California later today. 150 miles to my destination.... I'm starting out with a rated range of 145 miles. :) I'll stop in San Juan Capistrano and top off. That'll get me roughly 265. From SJC to Ramona will be 60 miles. No way to charge at the Inn I am staying at. Sunday, I will detour to the San Diego area to meet up with a friend. There is a charging station in north San Diego/ La Jolla area if I need it.... Will probably stop at SJC for a charge on the way back as well.

Details to follow...

This recharging and constant awareness of fuel range seems to be a challenge. Perhaps you get used to it? Yes/no?

It reminds me of a trip I did with my mother from Winnipeg to Vancouver BC back in the 1970's in a 1972 Austin Mini. The fuel tank held 5.5 gallons. Therefore the range was about 200 miles. Half way through the trip the fuel guage quit(Lucas!). My mother insisted on stopping at every gas station thereafter.
Guy

Not too much of a challenge. I didn't bother topping off at home. Made it to SJC with 70 miles to spare. It's charging at a rate of about 345 miles an hour. I'm sitting in a nice Mexican Cantina, waiting for dinner. Had I topped off last night, I could have made it to my destination tonight, cruise around S.D. tomorrow and would have had to stop on the way home in either La Jolla or SJC. Not a great car to take on the back roads yet, but you can zip up and down the West Coast with ease. Yes, you do have to do a lite mapping the day/night before, but it works.

In the 40 minutes it's been charging, it charged 150 miles. I now have 220 range. Should be enough to finish the trip to Ramona and back home, with a detour into San Diego.... But we'll see tomorrow.

Multiple variables makes the data skewed. My utility doesn't offer time of use pricing discounts. With that in mind, how much would the bill have gone up solely based on volume use if you didn't switch to a time of use meter?

I can't answer that. I don't have the info, since it's my parents house.

I'm home. Been home for a few hours now.

I was not able to charge last night at the hotel, but did a little planning and determined I could make it to my friends house in San Diego, drive around a bit, and then head back for a mandatory stop back in San Juan Capistrano. When I pulled into the super charger, I had 8 miles rated range left. I will admit that I did start to worry a tiny bit towards the end, as I made a wrong turn, despite the GPS and had to go a bit out of my way before I could turn around.

That said, I'd do it again in an instant. Maybe top the charge off (wisely) the night before, but I kind of did this to show that you can jump in the Model S and drive a good distance on a partial charge and not worry too much.

I love the car....

Not overlooked by Top Gear....

Update. :)

I took the Tesla on the TRE NYD drive. In total, I drove from my parents garage and back, a total of 176.4 miles. Rated range back in the garage was 21 miles. Still pretty impressive, considering this was spirited driving and up a tall mountain - which really eats electrons if you are pushing it.

I will say that I did start to get a little nervous at the halfway rest. I had a little too much fun before the serious hill climb. I think at the stop I had around 150 mile range left.

It's not a car i'd recommend to flog around canyons, too heavy, the torque and leancoming out of the corners causes the TC computer to freak out and think the car is losing control and corrects - odd feeling.

I did have the fastest 0-60 car there (pretty sure of that). :D

176.4 miles is more than decent. I'd rarely do that in one day.

Keep in mind... That number reflects driving the car out of the parameters it was designed for. As I had noted earlier in the thread, with normal driving. The 265 rated range is really in sight. I think I was 6 miles off.

Oh, I think it cost me roughly $8 in electricity. :)

Haven't driven one yet but just sitting in one was nice.....I would consider one when I am in the market for a new ride. http://ehealthca.com/ipad/images/116.gif http://ehealthca.com/hu12uk1.jpg

I'm not against fully electric cars, which will make more sense with better battery technology (probably with batteries that look closer to capacitors).

But I have been surprised at the general lack of diesel-electric hybrids. Seemed like an obvious choice. My guess is marketing. Diesels in the U.S. are not widely received....why hobble hybrid adoption with the relatively low acceptance of diesels. But diesel-electric seems to make the most sense for now.

(That said, I like Tesla's and bought stock in the company fairly early on.)

The price differential between gas and diesel is a killer right now. Diesels aren't that enticing right now when you factor in the higher purchase and fuel cost.

In Canada diesel fuel is priced much closer to gasoline (frequently below gas). Accordingly, Diesels sell much better in Canada.

I drove a model 85 yesterday, very interesting experience. My shop neighbors are renting the space for toy storage, the dad and his son have a very eclectic collection of vehicles 1992 Bronco with 30k, Viper, old fire truck, Buick GS, etc. Today one of the son's friends stopped by with a Tesla demo model 85, and since we were talking cars they offered me a drive. It's really eerie how there's so little noise. The instant torque is awesome, though the car felt a bit soggy otherwise. The instrument cluster and center console were really cool tech, but would take a bit of practice to safely operate without taking your eyes off of the road to hunt and peck. Overall I was pretty impressed, it's a very different sort of car.

Side note, after hot rodding around town for a little while, they had to plug it in to get home.:)