New Revolver
 

O.k., so most of you guys are aware of my affinity for single action revolvers. I have an equal love for .45-70 rifles, either single shots or lever guns. So, it seemed only natural to combine the two interests... That's right, a single action revolver in .45-70 caliber.

As it turns out, Magnum Research makes what they call the "BFR" (Big, Fine, Revolver). They use Ruger Blackhawk frames and action parts, so they have a pretty fine base from which to begin. The longer chamberings get their own proprietary frames, but I believe the revolver caliber guns just use the Ruger frame and add their own five shot cylinder.

Anyway, I saw one at the local Cabela's, so I figured "why not?". No sooner than having hit the range with it last weekend, however, I discovered why they probably don't sell many of these.

Recoil was beyond brutal with my standard 410 grain / 1900 fps "Marlin loads". Something had to be done. I've seen Magna Porting and the like, but most of that stuff just doesn't like cast bullets. What to do?

Fortunately, one of our members who was watching my tribulations happened to be a gunsmith as well. You may have heard of him, his name is Cleetus Goldberg. Cleetus offered to help, saying he had his own tried and proven method of porting big bore revolvers, so I left the revolver with him. At the time, I didn't notice the chin strap he had sewn onto his Skoal ball cap...

It turns out, unlike most gunsmiths, Cleetus works pretty darn fast. He called me yesterday and had me meet him at the the range - "bring ammo". I was amazed - recoil was all but gone. It kept blowing my ball cap off of my head, but at least it didn't kick anymore.

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1418322061.jpg

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1418322086.jpg

Cool! ....but I don't think that's what BFR really stands for :D

Looks effective but it isn't (no way to put it delicately) very pretty. I know the ones built into the big S&W X frames are pretty effective though. How much does it change the velocity?

Kinda looks like he just went at it with a dremel... You sure that's safe?

As an ex-machinist who doesn't know diddly about spoons, all I can wonder is how the bullet gets thru that barrel with all the burrs he created on the inside.
Is he going to clean it up now that it's been shown to work?

ROFL!!!!

I think "you" should mount an Eotech on there. Everyone knows Sightmark is hillbilly junk masquerading as a real red dot. :D

looks like a way around offending anti-gun people ... now that you can claim it's just a rape whistle.:cool:

Red dot? I'm not sure I know what you are talking about. I just center up whatever it is I'm shootin' at in that big old TV screen and give the trigger a yank. I must still be flinching, though - I just can't seem to hit a damn thing with this gun.

You might have hit a rabbit, you just couldn't find it.

This is a joke, right?

driil bit skip marks everywhere....

Yikes.

rjp

Yeah, his workmanship isn't all I would have hoped for. The turnaround time was astounding, however, especially in light of the fact that his work is in such high demand around here. I don't know how he cranks it out so fast.

Cleetus is somewhat of an innovater, as you can see from his work. You won't see porting like that from any other gunsmith, regardless of skill or reputation. We kind of attribute at least a bit of this to his father, Rube, who forged quite a name for himself in the world of machinery design. The apple doesn't fall far from the tree; while Cleetus chose a different vocation, he is certainly demonstrating all of his famous father's aptitude for creativity. That, and he's even offered to fit my shooting cap with a chin strap, just like his.

I hope you checked the bore carefully? In looking at it closely there seems to be some burrs inside the cutout areas? We have a local gunsmith named Doug Knoell and I watched him bore the cylinder on a plain BFR and also do the ports on top similar to yours. He uses a milling machine to do the cutouts and look to be about the same size although the barrel on the gun he had was using a longer barrel by about 2 inches? I loaded several 530 grain Goex FFG loads for it and test fired it and actually lived through it although I did have a range officer behind me just in case!!!!

What?

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1418333011.jpg

Cletus's dad, Rube Goldberg.:D:D:D

Knowing what we know about Jeff, I think his tongue is in his cheek.
Yikes man...
Troy

Did they use a chainsaw to make those cuts ? :D Man that is ugly but I'd watch the video of the first shot............hey hold my beer comes to mind :rolleyes:

A guy has one in hock but fortunately it is still in original condition.
But still a pretty useless piece of metal. I'll take another look at it tomorrow.
Jim

Are you kidding? I used to win Cowboy Action fast draw competitions with one of these all the time in my youth!

Here I am warming up before a match:

http://viennanet.info/wp-content/upl...sclebound2.jpg

two words: monkey roll

Cleetus actually uses a plasma cutter for most of his gunsmithing work, or at least for the detailed stuff like this. It's one of the ways he can turn these jobs around so fast. It turns out all those marks that look like a drill bit or rotary file got away from him are just from the slag hammer. Nothing to worry about.

He tells me that stainless guns like this one are actually a bit harder, and take him a bit longer than blued guns. He has to polish up the stainless guns a bit when he is done, but not so with the blued ones. He tells me that's one of the reasons her prefers the plasma cutter - it re-blues them as he goes along.

Looks like Playa's gat....Piece of crap....

Pfft... I have an angle grinder... I will cut Cletus's price in half!

yer pulling my leg...right?

Yeah, what Dave said..

If I send you my 8" SS 357 Python could you get him to work on it?

Oh, Cleetus will work on anything. Even transmissions. As far as Colts, he does have a special tip for his plasma cutter that does a pretty good job of matching their "Royal Blue", so it's too bad yours is stainless. You'll miss out on his finest work. Never fear, though, he'll just polish up your stainless Python with the same care and attention to detail he put into my BFR.

Joke or not, that is the some of the worst work I have ever seen done on a firearm.

So honestly Jeff, just how long did it take you with your B&D drill and hand file to do that craftsmanship?

I see one in my possession is merely a .45 Colt/.410. Outgunned again.
Jim

I've mentioned already that Cleetus is quite the innovator in his chosen field. It's amazing the projects one will see in work if one is ever privileged enough to visit him in his shop. Granted, he'll endeavor to cover up much of it with dirty old shop rags, piles of sawdust, feed bags, or whatever he can find to keep prying eyes off of it, but sometimes he is willing to share.

One of his more intriguing new ideas gets right back to recoil reduction in revolvers, involving a really imaginative way to approach the venting idea. Cleetus is really thinking outside of the box with this one, and has been reluctant to share his ideas. At least until recently. He has now discovered that many budding gunsmiths have been toying with his idea (a simple internet search will reveal many examples of work resembling his). So, he has relaxed a bit and has told me it's o.k. to lift the veil of secrecy from his latest project.

His reasoning is this: Most 'smiths port the end of the barrel in an effort to reduce recoil. Cleetus believes he can do so more effectively by arresting recoil right in the beginning, before it even has a chance to get going. With this philosophy in mind, Cleetus has begun porting cylinders and back straps on revolvers. While he still has a few bugs to work out, his current focus is to beat others to market, so he has been working feverishly on this concept.

Below is an example of his work. Please excuse the somewhat rough machining, as this is, after all, and early prototype. He has told me that pressures and velocities drop sharply with this arrangement, but he feels the simple solution is just to add more powder to get them back up to snuff. Cleetus always tries the simple, obvious solution first. One of the things I like about him.

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1418405425.jpg

were you wearing the hat with the chin strap when you fired that one?

Well played, Jeff.

That's the beauty of Cleetus's design - you don't need the chin strap for this one. The clever way in which he raised the top strap, but left it (relatively) intact accompishes a couple of his design objectives. First, it allows the gasses to vent out of the sides, and second, it provides a shield to keep it from lifting your hat. Cleetus thinks of everything.

You need to make a sawed off revolver.....That would be *****in.

rjp

I have a couple already - a Charter Arms Bulldog in .44 Special and a 3" Ruger Super Blackhawk in .44 mag. I love them both, but the short barrels make them pretty specialized little guns. I have longer barreled sixguns as well, but there are certainly times when I brought the short one and wished I had brought the long one, and vis versa.

Enter my friend Cleetus. He's got this one covered, too. He tells me he has had some trouble finding a supplier of suitable set screws, but as soon as he does, his adjustable barrel length sixguns will be ready for market. Those will be pretty darn handy.

Cleetus may want to think about welding nipples to the gun proper and also to the proximal aspect of each length of barrel.
He could then use a castrating band on either side to hold the barrel to the gun.
This method would eliminate the need to carry a screwdriver for the set screws and would truly make it a quick change to different lengths.
Just a thought, Cleetus may see some flaws or weaknesses in my design.
He is, after all, the expert.

Matt

I'm assuming that Bulldog is vintage - 70's or so. Because I can't for the life of me picture you accepting one of the newer ones in exchange for your hard-earned valuta.

You two should try and get together.

He was initially using lock collars, like from photagraphers' tripod legs. He was dissatisfied with the return to zero between barrel length adjustments, however. I told him I thought maybe he had the front sight soldered to the wrong part of the whole arrangement, but he insisted that by soldering it to the collar itself, it gave him something to hook his thumb over and really tighten it down. I wouldn't have thought of that myself, but like you say, he's the expert.

And yes, my Bulldog dates from the early '80's. Great little gun.