Yahoo has your ANSWER

Hahahahahaha

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A canoe is not a problem as long as you are on a lake without wind / chop.

If you are on a river with swells, not so good. Or if you are on a river with swells and your Great Dane riding in the canoe decides to get up and jump around.

I hunt out of a Radisson Canoe (buddy owns) and it is a duck killing machine. It spots a trolling motor for easy getting around. It could pack a dressed moose no problem.

That all said, listen to JYL - an ocean kayak - sit on top, is what you need. Plenty of angler models out there that will do the trick for wally and whatever. Also good to skin dive out of and fish the kelp a the north coast.

Another piece of advice is to RENT a canoe or kayak. Usually means you can get it where you use it, no hauling, no worries about it blowing off the car if not fastened right, not getting stolen, no up front $1k and no storage.

HTH? I have a 13 Ocean Kayak Trident in Camon on my wish list (Abalone diving, fishing, duck hunting).

G

Canoes are fun. Especially a Canadian canoe. And they are so long and flat on the bottom they don't need much depth to the water.

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1423729503.jpg

Even the dog likes riding in it although he's more of a standup paddleboard sort of a guy.

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As long as you dont go for this kind of kayak you should be fine:

http://www.ldeo.columbia.edu/users/m...vanquish_2.jpg

My wife fell into the water as she tried to sit in my racing kayak, and she was holding the pier! :D

My group of friends used to take annual 3-day canoe/camping trips down the Potomac--usually (1) of us dumped per trip (there were some rapid sections)--so long as you are prepared and the water temp is high enough it is no big deal, and canoes are a lot of fun.

Or take the tack my buddy used when we went to Deep Creek Lake, he fitted his canoe with home-made PVC outriggers and a small trolling motor, the 2 of us fished out of that thing all day-stable as could be.

Which is perfect for me .....

Canoe or kayak, it just takes practice.
I started in canoes at maybe 11-12yo. Most times I went over was due to someone else. Practically lived in them in the summer.

Have a couple of kayaks now. Usually stay in the sound. Have been out in some pretty rough water, high wind and tide. One day we went about 2 miles. It felt like 20.
Start out into the wind, come back with it. Makes for a quick and easy return when you're tired from paddling out.
PFD highly advisable, especially when alone. I'm not the strong swimmer I used to be.

Carter

I have an Old Town Pack. 12' and only 30 lbs. Perfect for solo. As has been said you learn to be stable.

I have an early Discovery 158 that I bought in the early '80's, when they first started making that line. It originally had "contoured" plastic seats that really didn't match anyone's behind, so they were soon replaced with proper wicker seats.

This thing has served me faithfully for 30 years now. When my kids were little, we would pile the whole family in it - including the dog - for many a wonderful paddling adventure. As my boys got bigger and they began to take it out on their own, they soon learned the value of teamwork and cooperation. Of course the dog was always in it with them, adding a bit of spice to the adventure. We even used the darn thing to haul deer out after many a successful hunt (possibly even made successful due to the fact we had to canoe to get there, thereby diminishing the crowds). Great times and lots of fond memories.

When I fell like taking it out on my own, I simply turn it around backwards and it handles just fine with only me in it. It does, however, get better if I put Katie, my Golden Retriever, in the bow. That works out to be the perfect balance, for a lot of reasons...

I found that option 1 works best when alone in a canoe, but instead of sitting, I found that kneeling in that same location works better - weight distribution is better, center of gravity is lower, and your rowing is more efficient.

A canoe is more stable than a kayak, but less stable than a jon boat. As said before, if fishing is your primary goal, a jon boat is a better option. But a canoe cuts through the water more efficiently than a jon boat, and I wouldn't take a jon boat through rapids. (Kayak is most efficient of the three on the water).

In college, every fall we did a canoe-a-thon - a day long trip from the Yellow Breeches to the Susquehanna river outside of Harrisburg, PA. Lots of fun, and I learned a lot of the basics...

-Z

dunno, doan care, I'm having fun.
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Come on!

You know the words, Roxie!

Under the mind of the normal male is something interesting.
The canoe is a vagina. Don't laugh. Men don't deal with this very well.
Look at the canoe.
Personally, I am an avid Kayak (they look even more like a vagina) user.
I take mine out and cover a lot of the river in it.
Yes... it is a snatch but just like the real deal... I enjoy stroking the paddle through the
nasty slime and dirty water to enjoy the ride.
If you are scared of the canoe for other reasons... I would like to hear why.

:D :confused:
Honey, lets go fishing today and take the vagina. Oh, please help me load the vagina on the top of the Edsel.... (note the flesh tone paint) :D

https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3397/...c30b6300_z.jpg

Sorry, but I can't stop laughing.

Over sized stand up paddle boards are the rage in SWFL, but I still want a sit down Kayak with foot peddles.

Kayaks: Hobie Sport Caribbean Blue 09'07"

Agreed. The wicker seats are great. People have the idea that you actually sit on them. When paddling, I kneel on the closed cell foam pads that you can see forward of the stern seat. I have the same in the bow. Very comfortable and much promotes proper body mechanics.

The canoe in the pic is actually a 160K. It came with a middle seat, but I removed it and added the thwart for use on my annual 3 day camping/canoe trip. You can load a lot of gear in that canoe. It is a little wider than the 158, but very similar in every other respect.

what?..that makes the paddler the elusive G spot? that is scary!!

Ah -o.k., I thought maybe it was just an updated 158. The reinforcing rib down the keel is absent in my 158, plus the thwarts are entirely different. Mine has the contoured carrying thwart, which is invaluable for loading and unloading it on the roofs of my Landcruisers, plus for short solo portaging.

Boy, and no kidding about "a lot of gear". How about two guys, our camping gear, and two large Washington mulies? Did that several times over the years.

This thread is making me want to break out the old canoe and get back into it again, at least more actively than the last few years. I've been pretty much just spending a few hours on a small local lake, or cruising up and down a slough that connects two local lakes. Just me and my partner Katie the Wonder Dog. I really need to head back up into the back country with it again. Those were the days...

I was actually without a really good means to haul it out to the back country for a few years. My local paddling was accomplished by hauling it on top of my '72 911 (with Katie riding shotgun). Now you want to get some looks, waves, and thumbs up - try driving around in an old 911 with a canoe on the roof and a Golden Retriever hanging her head out the passenger window... good times...

Haha, it's got me grinning.

The right canoe can be amazingly stable.

About 30 years ago, friends were visiting, so we took them for a paddle on the Annapolis river (about 1/4 mile wide where we are). Since there were four of us in the 16' canoe, we told PJ, our Lab/Setter mix to "Stay". For a while we saw him trying to follow us along the bank, but then we couldn't see him any more.

We were 2/3 of the way across and sure enough we saw PJ swimming towards us, about half way to the canoe. We doubled back and once I had everyone else set, I grabbed the dog by the scruff of the neck and lifted him aboard. Only problem was a Lab/Setter's coat holds a LOT of water.

One of our friends was sitting in the bottom of the boat and ended up with a wet bottom, but she just laughed and took off her shorts when we made the beach. I suspect dog + water would have been about 70 lbs.

That old tub was stable.

Best
Les

Is a canoe safe? Depends on the operator(s). One time we were in northern Ontario in the middle of the lake. Out of nowhere comes a power boat and creates a big bow wave. We had to turn quickly into the waves to avoid getting swamped. In hindsight we should have been hugging the shore.

Second time this time with the first wife. Had a few days in Northern Ontario. Had to come back coz we had to work in a couple of days. Tried one day to paddle back to shore in Rock Lake(Algonquin Nat'l Park). Too rough. Had to turn back and camp another night. Tried another day and the waves were almost as high. Headed into the waves and the water was just about swamping us. Hugged the shore line and fortunately reached the dock without incident. Canoe like we had needed those canvas covers to prevent water coming in. There are safer ways to travel on water than an open canoe.

Guy

Sounds scary, and yet those two situations would have been nothing special in an ocean kayak.

It isn't just that canoes are usually open while kayaks are usually closed.

In a kayak, your center of gravity (hips, basically) is very low, maybe 6" above the bottom of the hull. Even if you kneel in a canoe, your CG will be much higher. In a kayak your knees are locked under the cockpit coaming so that you can be rigid with the boat, or torque it with your hips. In a canoe you are flopping loosely around, unless you're strapped down like for competition. In a kayak you have a long double ended paddle, in addition to the advantages in power and efficiency - both from the paddle and from your ability to lock your knees to the boat and use your lower body strength to paddle - the paddle lets you instantly and reflexively brace, whether against a poweboat bow wave or for surfing swells and breaking waves. The canoe paddle is short and has to be lifted and moved from side to side. In a kayak you sit in the center of the boat, regardless of wind, and that long paddle allows you to reach back to steer or correct a broach, reach out to brace, without moving your body. In a canoe, if you're sitting in front to deal with the wind, then have to surf down a big swell, good luck controlling the stern if it starts broaching. In an ocean kayak, you have a long keel that tracks straight, and pedal operated rudder for easy steering and cross wind correction, you just focus your power on forward propulsion. In a canoe, you waste power on steering strokes. I could go on . . .

I see the charm of canoes. If I lived on a lake I'd have a canoe. For calm days. I just think they are to ocean kayaks as a Model T is to a 911.

Anyway, vash, that is why I linked to the second Feathercraft kayak, that can be configured as a double or a single or an open boat ready to load the cooler of beer. Even set up as an open boat, it will run rings around a canoe, especially paddled solo, and especially in more difficult conditions. Then attach the spray deck and you can launch that boat into breaking ocean surf.

The one disadvantage of a kayak is initial stability. They are narrower than canoes, with more rounded bottoms. So they feel more tippy If you're just sitting there, not actively paddling. Like if you're holding a fishing rod instead of a paddle . . . So attach some foam or inflatable sponsons for those situations.

Oh yes the beer. I have never operated a kayak but I would think that the amount of stuff you can carry is limited. In our 14 foot canoe we carried wine, beer, groceries basically enough provisions for several days. I would surmise that the kayak is way safer. To add to the woes of a canoe I noticed that some of the modern ones mentioned above are made of very light materials. The effect of the wind and waves I would think would make them less stable.
Guy

My kayak is 17 ft long. I've carried enough in it for five nights camping - including tent, cooking stuff, food and water - about 100 lb. It has to be packed in drybags and stuffed into the ends of the boat. Not as convenient as loading a canoe.

Loaded down like that, the kayak still paddled fine. I made a mistake landing on a beach during that trip. Wave picked the boat up, we surfed onto the beach, but there was a rock outcropping there that I didn't see, and the bow of the boat went straight into the rock, nose-on, while the rest of the boat was lifted up and then crashed back down into the water after the wave broke. Paddled the rest of the way to the sand, no fuss, just cosmetic damage to the nose of the boat. A canoe - well, you wouldn't paddle a canoe ten miles in open ocean anyway, or land through surf, but anyway it would have been ugly.

[QUOTE=jyl;8486566]My kayak is 17 ft long. I've carried enough in it for five nights camping - including tent, cooking stuff, food and water - about 100 lb. It has to be packed in drybags and stuffed into the ends of the boat. Not as convenient as loading a canoe.
Jyl I am impressed that you can carry so much. What does your kayak weigh empty?
Guy

[QUOTE] About 55 lb empty. It is one of these, except that mine is 20 years old so is an older model

K1 Expedition*»*Feathercraft

Specs for the current model say payload 385 lb.

This rocked my boat! Went to the Field Museum / Chicago yesterday and this was in the Egyptian exhibit. I would imagine some of the planking is modern to reinforce structure, preserving it.

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Spambot reported.

Not true.

You might have to work harder and change sides on a wind on the quarter, but with some experience and the right canoe, you can paddle on one side until your shoulders tire.
Also, in calm water you can go silently without taking the paddle out of the water at all.

Best
Les

I wasn't clear. I was referring to when the boat is being hit with chop and waves from all sides, like in really confused water. Your paddle is on the right side, suddenly you need to brace on the left. With a canoe paddle you have to lift the paddle and transfer it to the other side, which is much slower than with a kayak paddle which already has a blade on whichever side the brace requires.

I remember having to rescue some friends who had set out in a canoe to paddle a few miles along the shore of Lake Tahoe, the wind came up and there was a lot of power boat traffic, the water got really confused, they were getting hit with 2+ foot chop from every side and had to run for shore. Both are experienced canoe paddlers, in a good boat, they made it about two miles in those conditions. The next year we took ocean kayaks and paddled about 16 miles RT across part of the lake, had the same conditions on the return, no sweat at all.

I think I'm using the term "confused water" correctly. Random waves from every direction, adding to substantial peaks and troughs that are unpredictable and seem to hit the boat without warning.

i went for a dunk in a canoe. water was maybe 45F. i came up and hit my head on the seat of the upside-down canoe. it was super sketchy and i was in about 8 ft of water. like the idiot that i am, no life jacket. yeah, i won't be doing that (no life jacket) ever again. i had hypothermia, which led to some laughs and shenanigans with mrs. nynor.

I spent one of the best summers with my father going down the Huron River.
A three day trip from the origination point near Flint back to Ann Arbor.
The river extends well past into Detroit and Lake Erie.

Look at the distant surface. Predict. And try try to dodge the hidden rocks ahead.
Captain yelling "rock" at the back.
The young bowman still learning.
The labrador retriever leading the way most of the time, swimming full time in the water and running up banks until we finally hauled him up, whereupon he'd crash in a wet heap on the towel on the cold aluminum.
We usually went for a dunk ourselves and just floated with the current for most of the trip.
Warm rippling waters, silky grasses, pesky mosquitoes swarming near dusk.
Watching huge Great Blue Herons in the trees ahead get upset and fly downstream squawking.
Set up the the tent finally at campgrounds, see what is dry left in the pack, try to cook a warm meal on a kerosene stove, before finally curling up in sleeping bags on hard ground exhausted.

Sounds like fun John.
And well written.
Guy

Spambot reported

Yes. That's the term I'd use if I wanted to avoid profanity. In my understanding it comes from wave patterns reflecting off shores and travelling back across the lake. I tend to get "a little nervous" when the water's like that. Definetly not ideal canoe conditions.
Therer's no doubt a lot of folks have gotten into trouble on the water by using the inappropriate craft.

Stay safe.

Les