I never found him that masculine to begin with. Even when he was appearing on Wheaties boxes, he sort of gave me the heebeegeebees.

Seahawk...always a class act.

ok, now that we've said all that, I think if my brain wanted to eliminate my pecker, I would bet odds that the pecker would win. It would somehow recruit the hands to take a railroad spike and off the ol' brain.

+1

You missed my point. De-mystifying is fine but the major TV networks / media is constantly bombarding SEX related topics as the top money maker AND primarily in primetime. Not late evening and its all sensationalism. Jenner is a greedy one and it didn't need to air his problem period, let alone primetime. Libby's lawmakers refuse to pull in the reigns and the FCC are hypocrite's. A line has to be drawn otherwise what each adult thinks about morals today, its completely gone for future generations. There is a breakdown and promiscuity of youngsters is far more than ever before. Maybe that's fine for some parents but it brings more problems than ever. Its the proper thing for laws in these regards to keep things in check, but these lawmakers haven't enforced and have failed.

Part 1 ~ We now have grade school aged kids saturated with titillation, the oddity and hence makes it acceptable in their eyes. After Jenner sells out and airs his episode on primetime ABC, how many kids wouldn't inquire or wonder what mommy / daddy parts are about?

Part 2 ~ Youngsters obviously going thru body changes, and chemically the mind, media influencing them by the media makes sex the hang-up and all they get caught up in. Sexual exploration and yearning time.

Part 3 ~ They've warped the kids well down to the middle grade school age. Nobody wants to discuss it and parents are embarrassed when they find out or perhaps are just absurdly naïve that kids are having at it at that age. Where or what do you believe is driving this?

Whether you think we're a healthier society today on the subject or not, good luck to you parents.

You think to build and have great trust in them, but most have you fooled. When I see the news outlets report on kids busted for sexting, graphic images of themselves exchanged, you can't deny where they kids come up with these ideas. 7 and 8yo's, oral at school!!! Rarely does a parent even want to know , believe or accept that it exist. That's how protective they are! Scary reality right there.

Well, your answer is obvious.

Buy one of those old missile silos, hide your kids in there until they are 18.

Problem solved.

.
It's my notion that the decay of America began with my generation - born 1945...I was in my early 20's in the '60's...the hippy generation, etc.
"Do what you want if it feels good."
Smoking dope in front of their children, etc...several of my buddies did this...broken families, all.
.
"Our" children (I'm childless) back in those days are now the parents of this generation.
Now, the grandchildren of my generation is who you're speaking about here.
Pre-teen sex is rampant today...and the parents are unconscious...in their own little narcissistic world.
.
What I observed back in my late 20's and early 30's was my generation wanting to be friends with their offspring because they lacked the wherewith all (wisdom, energy, and courage) to be genuine parents.
What happens to those children when they age is that they face the hardship of having to parent themselves.
But then, that's the pseudo Full Employment Act for the psyche community. :)
And the beat goes on...unfortunately.
Talk to anyone who harbors any semblance of sensibility in the psych community and they will tell you that this is a multi-generational problem.
And with each generation it's getting more impoverished.
.
That's my take.

Are you suggesting transgender is a mental illness?

Its more of a condition then an illness. An illness means that there is either an invading body or toxin or a genetic abnormality or an inherited malignant trait. I fail to see how being homosexual, transgender or transsexual is an illness.

Psychosis, neurosis, neuro-chemical imbalance such as depression, those are illnesses.

I still say that if you remove all the clothes and divide up the chores there is no transsexuals. You can only dress as the opposite sex and wear make-up if its available. No clothes no make up ergo no transsexuals. Of course transgenders don't fall into that arena. Being naked and transgender would seem to want to quicken the case if your transgender I would think.

Wonder if "she" is going to get remarried? :D

x2.

You guys are a pile of old curmudgeons. How do you know that youth sexual activity is on the rise? Or even high. Have you looked this up at all or do you believe sensationalist stories of those sex laden TV channels you complain about? Do any of you have teenage kids?

2% of under 12 year olds have sex in the US. And only about half by the time high school is over. That's not the picture you are painting here. When did you have sex for the first time. I sure hope it was before you were 25!

American Teens' Sexual and Reproductive Health
http://www.guttmacher.org/graphics/T...vity-Graph.gif

Looks like sexual activity is flat. This is Canada, but should be similar:
Statistics on Sexual Intercourse Experience Among Canadian Teenagers | SexualityandU

Ok, so now that that is said. I despise TV. There is no TV at my house. And I don't have to talk about weirdo celebs with my children. They don't know who Bruce Jenner is. I do not have a problem talking about transgender people and the subject definitely does come up living in the SF bay area. :) I'd rather not do it over this type of example rather than a real person we may see. Banning TV from my home has been a blessing for everyone involved. None of my children are obsessed with pop culture. YMMV.

G

Pretty much. A man who thinks they are a woman trapped in a man's body is little different than a man who thinks they are a dog and trapped in a man's body and barks at the moon and licks their balls. One is a protected species to be protected, admired and sympathized with and the other is considered bat**** crazy.

I am more concerned about people who think they have all the answers, and want to force them on their nation and the world than I am about those few people who want to physically resemble the gender that they wish they were born as.

One of these paths harms no one, while the other can cause a great deal of strife and suffering in the world. But in general, these types of conversations are only a sideshow to the great moral questions of our age, which many remain blissfully unaware of.

Lubey's daughter has a better grip on this than most of the adults here. Once you start voicing your beliefs as absolutes of right and wrong, this becomes PARF fodder.

The following seems appropriate for this discussion:

Personally, I am more concerned with those here who would prefer to control thought and speech to only what they believe. That is really scary. It is just as bad if it is liberal thought like yours or more conservative thought like mine.

No one here has tried to force Mr./Ms. Jenner to do anything...but it doesn't mean they have to agree with what he/she does. He/she can do whatever he/she likes with his/her body as long as he/she doesn't ask others to pay for it or require their approval.

What makes you think that Lubey's 12 year old has an especially good grip on transsexuals...or for that matter, how do you know her position on the matter at all?

I don't see anyone here planning to dress like a woman and chopping their pecker off. Why? Because its just weird that's why.

"Looks like sexual activity is flat. This is Canada, but should be similar:"
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

You just might want to look at the facts for the USA.
.
CDC - Sexual Behaviors - Adolescent and School Health

Many young people engage in sexual risk behaviors that can result in unintended health outcomes. For example, among U.S. high school students surveyed in 2013:

- 47% had had sexual intercourse.
- 34% had had sexual intercourse during the previous 3 months, and, of these 41% did not use a condom the last time they had sex.
- 15% had had sex with four or more people during their life.
- Only 22% of sexually experienced students have ever been tested for HIV.

Sexual risk behaviors place adolescents at risk for HIV infection, other sexually transmitted diseases (STDs), and unintended pregnancy:

- Nearly 10,000 young people (aged 13-24) were diagnosed with HIV infection in the United States in 2013.
- Young gay and bisexual men (aged 13-24) accounted for an estimated 19% (8,800) of all new HIV infections in the United States, and 72% of new HIV infections among youth in 2010.
- Nearly half of the 20 million new STDs each year were among young people, between the ages of 15 to 24.
- Approximately 273,000 babies were born to teen girls aged 15–19 years in 2013.

Then there are some people that consider those that think like fintstone to be bat**** crazy.....

There are LGBT people on this board. I speak out because I have this crazy idea that all people are equal.

Your comment is based in fear (big surprise). You are threatened by LGBT people. People who are truly confident in their own sexuality arent bothered by "weird".

By the way, genital surgery plays less of a role than you think it does.

I second nostril cheese - I have met a bunch of folks on this board. Many are exactly as you would expect while there are a few that have alternative appetites. Perhaps I give off some freak vibe but a few have confided in me with their life style choices and proclivities and they know I would never spill the beans.

So, what goes through on in a mans (or women's) head is their world according to their personal God or not. As reflected before, as long as the don't hurt me or others I do not find their lifestyle at all offensive.
I have yet to meet a man or women superior enough to pass complete judgement on anthers life style if that life style doesn't involve harm.

Plus who has time to invest in another's issues when so many of us barely have time to address our own?

Straighten up your house before you decide what color I should paint mine.

Teen pregnancy rates are down. And teen sexual activity is flat. Teens have always been horny. Doesn't take TV to get them there. As a matter of fact, the less open the society is about teen sex the higher the pregnancy rate. Compare the U.S. to Scandinavia for example!

I was sexually active in High School - you guys weren't?
Safely. I don't see why it is a big deal. I'm glad I didn't miss out!!!

G

There may be axe killers, child molesters and islamic terrorists on this board...but that doesn't make them any less weird to most of us. Transexuals are pretty unusual where most of us live.

Are they all in Portland? Besides, you throw in the whole LGBT card, while I was talking about 1 freak show. I have a gay employee and as a matter of fact the gay bar has pretty good drinks. But even for them, Jenner is sort of out there. So cry me a frikken river.

I hope Bruce finds help while he remains in this condition. Since he's gone public, perhaps his issues, at some point, will bring mental wellness into the national spotlight. I try to look at the bright side of things.

Bruce Jenner is really into remote control heli flying so he has s ok by me

i don't.

his quote in your post was right on.

This is only one piece of the story. Here is the another piece:

"Since 1991, there have been declines among high schoolers in the percentages of students who ever had sexual intercourse, who had sexual intercourse for the first time before age 13, who have had sexual intercourse with four or more persons in their lifetime, and who report being currently sexually active.15

In 2008 (the most recent year for which national data are available), the pregnancy rate for U.S. teens aged 15-19 reached 67.8 pregnancies per 1000 young women: its lowest point in more than 30 years, down 42 percent from its 1990 peak of 116.9 per thousand.16

The birth rate for U.S. teens aged 15-19 reached its lowest point in 2009 (39.1 births per thousand young women) in nearly seven decades; the 2009 rate was 37 percent below its most recent peak in 1991 (61.8 per 1000).1"

http://advocatesforyouth.org/storage/advfy/documents/adolescent-sexual-behavior-demographics.pdf

As for Bruce Jenner, I can offer compassion but not understanding. This is so foreign to me, how could I really understand his situation. I don't. There is plenty I don't understand about the whole gender and sexuality spectrum so I just believe in live and let live.

I followed one of the first public transgender/gender reassignment persons back in the 70s. Walter/Wendy Carlos. She was a celebrated classical musician who first applied the Moog synthesizer to Bach, Brahms, and Mozart and her music was used in several film soundtracks at the time. She is still active in music and an avid solar eclipse chaser. That was 40 years ago and my understanding is no better now than it was then. I wonder what she would say to Jenner now after living as a woman since the 70s.

I have to agree with Rusnak. Have a friend who's gay- he thinks the idea of cutting off your pecker is just weird.

I figure Bruce was surrounded with so much Kardashian estrogen he finally flipped.

"You think that's weird? Watch THIS!"

I actually feel sorry for Bruce Jenner, he was the epitome of a healthy man's man when he won the Olympic Decathlon, and you would think he has the world by the Azz. I truly believe he wasn't as macho and confident as what the media at the time portrayed him to be, and I think the whole Kardashian clan ruined him for good by belittling, and talking down to him to the point he had no identity remaining. Bruce's biggest problem is being concerned with what the public says , and the media reports......he should just live his own life and not make this a National news item.

I have no problem with alternative lifestyle individuals as long as they don't push thier agendas on me, and just try to meld into society like normal human beings. I have friends who are a gay female couple who run thier own electrician contractor business. They are in high demand for thier honest work ethic and fast, proper results. The subject of thier sexual orientation has never come up, but they don't hide it either. I personally applaud them and enjoy talking to them.

What is most puzzling to me is his decision to go about this at his age (64). but I guess as the saying goes, "It's never too late to have a happy childhood".

I work with a LOT of gay people in my business, one who has had surgery (male to female) and a few women who dress and act as men. No big deal for me working and socializing with them. Some are more "in your face" than others about their sexuality but all in all, they all seem very well adjusted. Different strokes as it were.