My GF was one, left his family and ran off to CA. with a blond. Died @ 57, my exact age now. My dad, (his son), was one as well. He drank away his marriage to my mom and therefore his family. He paid a steep price but got sober later, in late 40s, was sober until he died @ 82 two years ago.

Out of 5 siblings, I'm the only one afflicted but one died as a baby so we'll never know there. One of the only great decisions I've made in this life was sobriety, quite a few years ago.

Just to be clear, everyone is entitled to their opinion and some have more actual experience than others. I'm not "anti-drinking" or even anti-weed smoking or anti-anything else. I only know that I can't have it or things will go sideways in a hurry. I'd love to tilt back a cold one or burn a spleef but the price is too high in my case.

I almost did not post on this thread because I try to keep my anonymity online as much as reasonably possible. It's not for me to judge anyone else's habits but if they reach out for help in this area, I have to be there for them. It's a pact I made w the great spaghetti monster long ago. :)

No, you don't understand. They were given up for adoption at birth. They had physiological birth disorders.

The little girl cried uncontrollably for hours and hours for no reason until after she was 3. Took her to all kinds of doctors and couldn't find any reason for the crying. She also sleeps with her eyes wide open, and always has.

The boy can not distinguish between right or wrong and whats worse doesn't learn from the outcome of actions. As an example: When I was visiting once when he was 8 we were awakened SEVERAL times the night by loud wacking noise and him screaming. He was getting up and sticking his fingers into a fan. Said he wondered if it would hurt. Think the only reason he stopped is the bandages my sister put on his hands wouldn't allow him to do it again. My sister explained this sort of thing was normal with him.

Again, they neither were ever around or had met their parents for any time. My sister and brother were told both of their problems were atypical birth disorders of children with both parents being alcoholics and were not environmental. They found the girl abandoned at only a day to two old. The boy was given up for adoption at birth.

I'm glad you did post....lecture on Speederman :)

This board is chock full of experiences, knowledge, and very intelligent folks from hugely varying backgrounds....that makes it what it is...great!!!

I put a lot of personal info out here....probably too much at times....I blame it on.....

ME :)

I am here. First chance in a few days to grab a moment here. I am reading through all of the posts.

For real success, abstinence from alcohol, drugs (...whatever) is just the beginning. The core issue is almost always deeper and more insidious.

+1

If I could drink three beers and stop, even if three beers every single day, I would gladly continue and take my deep rooted baggage with me to the grave.

That would only be 1,000 beers a year rather than almost 4,000.

Sure. Everyone would rather bury their issues. If only the troubles would stay buried. Instead they tend to become an abcess that continues to grow and be painful until drained. Often times, daylight is the only disinfectant that works.

That can be where AA works best for people. It's a place where people can be themselves because nobody there is better than anyone else and they all have something in common from which the conversation can begin.

Some have argued that AA can be seen as a substitute addiction. I can see how that could become the situation. However, I'd imagine the potential for this would be fair game for discussion there as well.

Well, if you can, more power to you.


At a certain level of consumption, it takes a while for the brain chemistry to adjust, even though any actual withdrawal symptoms disappear in a few weeks. That amount of time varies between a few months and a year. The funny thing is though that the cognitive part of the brain will make up excuses as to why drinking would be a good idea. if you really quit though, be aware that if isn't the last drink that gets you drunk, it is always the first that starts the parade.

For those not familiar with alcohol abuse, that's about 2-4oz of ethanol (ETOH) per day*. Not 4oz of beer/wine/liquor, 4 oz of the actual colorless, odorless chemical ETOH.

There could be some serious physical symptoms with sudden withdrawal; like seizures, and heart failure. Psychologically, there could be major depression, psychosis, paranoia and delirium.

In addition to all that, there could be some serious social affects. Anybody whose been functioning on 4 oz of ETOH per day, say like for years, does not (some say 'cannot') have a very accurate assessment of his/her relationships. It is not unusual for people to realize their friends are not friends, their families have emotionally given up and moved on, and the sudden realization of the missed opportunities of life can be truly devastating.

Typically, the brain 'resets' after about six months of abstainence if one survives. Then the real work begins.

*Assuming my math is correct, which is a big assumption.

Bob, I surely don't have any answers for you, but I sincerely wish you the very best going forward. I'm sure I'm not alone...be well my online friend...

I'm gonna go about my daily tasks, but this thread is going to be in the back of my mind...
Troubling it is....

I am sure you are not alone in your situation Bob K. There is room for improvement.
Hat off to you for reaching out. Do whatever it takes to stay alive. Would suggest you go to your doc for a start. He/she will point you in the right direction....

The best description I ever heard for alcoholism is this. 'To an alcoholic, the world is black & white. Booze gives it colour'.

Realised I was drinking WAY too much & too often in my early 20's when I lived in the Scottish Highlands (where most everyone drank a lot, which didn't help). Decided to quit for a month. Stopped for a day short of 2 months, had one, realized it wasn't a big deal. Zero issues since. I wish you could have it so easy!

I was talking generally about alcoholics, not the kids. My heart goes out to these kids as sadly I don't think they will ever come right.

A few years back I went to Acapulco with a group of friends. One of the events we all signed up for was the "Booze Cruise" out into the harbor. It was all the rum and cheap booze you wanted for price of the cruise. I had just a touch of the Montezuma's revenge and I figured I did not want to risk a night of drinking so I just stuck with one single beer all night.

At one point as we were heading back in the group was together and I started telling jokes. They were the easiest audience ever. It was strange to see the people I knew acting so different because they were drunk. The next day they were all telling me how funny I was and I should become a professional comedian. I was not that good, they were that drunk.

Wow, vuja De. This is scary.

I don't like getting drunk because I'm not in control when i do. I don't drink hard alcohol (over 20 years).
I just drink beer and not to excess, don't care for the taste of wine. I don't drink two days in a row.
Typically I drink a couple beers twice week, an 18 pack can last a month unless my buddies who drink show up.


Besides, drinking is expensive!

Add up how much a drunk spends on booze, that's a whole lot of money that could be saved!

Not so much the issues that I am concerned with. I yam what I yam. Yes, there are issues. Secondary for right now.

It's 10 (average count) of 4.2% beers I drink consistently. Say, six "real" pints of beer. Mind you, if I drink eight pints of real beer, especially craft beer, I am officially blotto. No driving, sleep on shop floor, trip on the air hose, pee out the back man-door, drunk. Rare but fact. Rare means for a daily drinker. Once a month rare. Not pretty.

I am 60. I stopped taking Adderal six months ago after 25 years. I can't plow through until midnight with an amphetamine buzz masking the booze impact on my body any longer. It is painful the next day. If I do 12 beers, tomorrow is wasted.

This thread should almost be appended to the Adderal thread. I drink too much and now I know because I stopped taking Adderal.

I have five days w/o beer under my belt with help from reading these posts. The itch is present though.

Bob, that's where David was 32 years and 360 days ago. It's a damn good start brother, and you CAN do this...that itch will probably always be there, but will diminish over time imo. If you fall, then pick yer azz up and start back over, but if I were in your shoes, I would NOT even consider it. Proud of you man, I really mean that!!! You get the urge, post on this thead and we'll collectively perform a PPOT azz whuppin' on that bastard :).

It ain't gonna be easy...but Bob K is gonna kick his demon's azz!

I know it....

To paraphrase Crowbob's excellent post, if you're a heavy drinker it's impossible to have a very accurate assessment of your relationships. You get sober and you realize many of your friends are often not friends, your loved ones may have given up on you, and the sudden realization of the missed opportunities of life can be truly devastating.

Typically, the brain 'resets' after about six months of abstainence if one survives. Then the real work begins.

I should know, I hit (an emotional) bottom 3 years ago at age 50. I had a successful marriage, kids and job, but my life was out of control and I was powerless over alcohol.

I found a men's group, go 5-6 early mornings a week, and I absolutely love it. It's like a fraternity - of all incomes, colors, orientations, politics etc. And none of that matters because we all share a common purpose - a desire to stay sober and be the best version of ourselves we can be.

But like Crowbob said, a few months of sobriety and you learn that you stopped growing when you started abusing alcohol. You may find yourself looking at all you relationships with a new pair of glasses. And things can get rough for a bit.

The best analog I've heard is that it's like driving a station wagon. For years, you and your significant others (or work relationships etc) have been throwing crap way into the back for a very long time. Then one day you get sober, and it's like you slammed on the brakes, and all that accumulated crap comes flying forward and demands to be dealt with.

And that is why it is so important to do more than simply abstain from drinking. For me, that was the easy part. The hard part was to come to grips with the damage I had done, come to grips with the missed opportunities, find someone(s) to talk to about it, and then learn how to turn and face my demons sober. And then I realized, that for the first time in decades, I had a bit of personal growth.

And life is so much better now.

It's still a roller coaster, but the lows aren't so low and the high's are all different. Good, but different.

Good luck to you Bob. I really hope you find what you need. And feel free to reach out if you ever need anything.

Five days! That's great. Every day is a new one. How are your mornings? Do you feel sharper when you wake up? Are you experiencing any unexpected benefits?

Good for you, David!

The people closest to an alcoholic (or any substance abuser for that matter) sustain enormous anguish. Simply watching someone whom they love drifting off into oblivion sets off a myriad of emotions, let alone the intellectual conflicts they must also endure.

The frustration, pity and anger over what is happening (or has happened) force intellectual and emotionally honest bystanders into realities that are routinely repressed simply by virtue of their own self-preservation. Their own guilt and remorse over real (and imagined) responses to the self-destruction of a very close loved one make it difficult to forgive themselves.

The hoping and praying and waiting for recovery often go unanswered, leaving a void not easily described with words.

But the joy and relief when (if) it finally comes is a gift.