ODD home design and possible modifications

[masraum]

< EDIT >
FYI, it's not going to happen. More detail in a post at the bottom of the thread.
< /EDIT >

I've had a few threads. We are thinking about moving out of our apt and back into a home. We are not afraid of work, and have therefore looked at homes that need it.

We've found a home that's got potential (>1/2 acre in a great neighborhood, HUGE master and en suite, homes 3-4 doors down that are between $400k and $1.2mil), but has a design that for lack of a better word is whacky.

I'm wondering what you folks think about some of our ideas for possible modifications to improve things.

The first thing, the formal dining room is kind of small and isolated from the rest of the home. There's a large chunk out of the downstairs that was left as a patio. Extending the exterior walls out to where the patio is would create more interior space and help the dining room. I don't think it would be that technically difficult to build new exterior walls and then demo the existing walls. Do any of you folks with more experience see any major hurdles? And any ideas what to do about the fact that we probably couldn't match the brick for those new walls?



The stairs are VERY cramped, especially at the stair landing. I think if the modification above were completed, we could then alter the stairs to be L shaped vs a U-turn and therefore improve them. (I haven't worked out any details)


Also, it seems that 99% of the time when you go from a garage into a home, you dump into the kitchen (or very near the kitchen). In this place, the kitchen has an external door, and the garage has an external door that is adjacent to the nearest point between the garage and home. The REALLY odd thing is that the two doors are not adjacent to each other (they are both West facing), and there's no door in the home that's adjacent to the door from the garage.


Also, the wall/door into the kitchen extends into the side wall of the house which takes space away from kitchen cabinets and counters. I've thought that we might push that out flush with the upstairs exterior wall.





Another thing that's a little odd is that the front door is set back into the front face of the home which isn't that odd, until you open the front door and realize it opens into a wall that's so close that the front door has less than 12" between the end of the door and the wall. There's actually a tiny coat closet in the wall that's basically space under the stairs. It would be nice to push the front door of the home out to toward the front of the house. I didn't measure that setback, but I think it's 6-10'. I'm not sure how much work that would be compared to a couple of the other changes that we're wondering about. There's also a small box that sticks out just above the front door on one side about 2'x1'x1'. I haven't checked, but the only thing that I can imagine is that maybe it's for an A/C vent or something. It's odd.


This house is like something either created by a beginning architect student, or maybe someone built the house, and said "I want it this way." and the architect thought "that's really bizarre, but ok."

this layout is not to scale, but is, based on my impressions and observations, a pretty decent approximation of the floor plan of the downstairs of the house.



huge master

unfortunate master bathroom




What do you folks think?

[masraum]

Some possible changes (not thoroughly thought through)

[wdfifteen]

Over all, I like it. I could live there and I like space. The kitchen and master bedroom are great. That master bath - ugh. I would hate to wake up and walk into that room the first thing in the morning. It looks like the changing room at a swimming club.
It is odd that the garage opens into the living room.
Depending on your lifestyle that dining room doesn't need to be a dining room. After a year of wondering what to do with our small dining room MrsWD said, "It's your office!" And so it is. Our "dining room" is where your living room would be. We "live" in our dining room and it works out great.

[john70t]

I like the changes.
Kitchen to dining room is nice. Add door to porch and now there are three seating areas all visible from the kitchen command central.
'Open spaces' is the thing these days.

Get some white bullnose/wrap-over tile for the tub edges. I don't like sharp corners in the bathroom.

The structural support for an entire corner of the house is a couple decorative 4x4? ...err...no. Fix that.

You could still do a small vestibule/foyer/genkan with closet and/or bench seat for the entrance maybe.

Find a way to close off the living room. somewhat. Loud TV party can happen while not bugging people sitting at the table.

[Groesbeck Hurricane]

You should first find out what is a load bearing wall. This will limit the changes you can make.

I wonder if this was someone's idea of a dream home? I grew up in one where the designer wanted the kitchen to be the center of the home. It was literally in the center, you had to walk through it to get to the bedrooms, living area, entry, and dining areas. Everything led into the kitchen. Made for an interesting cooking experience. Oh, it was a galley kitchen as well. Looked at one that was designed as a gingerbread house. The weird angles and forced walls gave the home a feel of strange proportions. In some areas it felt bigger than it looked from the outside, in others much smaller. The second floor was supposed to have three bedrooms and two baths. In effect, you had to go through a bedroom to get to another bedroom. None were big enough for more than a single bed or crib. The unreal lines gave several roof areas showing signs of water/ice penetration.

It may very well be doable if you can put in beams and support the upper story.

Wife liked the blue tile. To each their own...

[masraum]

Originally Posted by wdfifteen

Over all, I like it. I could live there and I like space. The kitchen and master bedroom are great. That master bath - ugh. I would hate to wake up and walk into that room the first thing in the morning. It looks like the changing room at a swimming club.
It is odd that the garage opens into the living room.
Depending on your lifestyle that dining room doesn't need to be a dining room. After a year of wondering what to do with our small dining room MrsWD said, "It's your office!" And so it is. Our "dining room" is where your living room would be. We "live" in our dining room and it works out great.

What's odd is that the garage opens to a wall. There's currently no door, you either walk around to the front door on the back door. I think we'd want/need to put a door to the living room (probably adding a closet/entry area). Right, the rooms can be whatever we want.

Originally Posted by john70t

Get some white bullnose/wrap-over tile for the tub edges. I don't like sharp corners in the bathroom.

I think that we're thinking of ditching the blue completely. We also aren't fans of how the toilet is exposed right next to the bath. If not too difficult/expensive, I could see us putting the toilet in the spot where the shower currently is, and then moving the shower out and having a walk-in shower and "spa tub" together in the bathroom.

The structural support for an entire corner of the house is a couple decorative 4x4? ...err...no. Fix that.

You noticed that too? Hahah. That's exactly why I'm thinking, move the whole wall out to where those decorative supports are and make that patio part of the living room / dining room area.

Originally Posted by Groesbeck Hurricane

You should first find out what is a load bearing wall. This will limit the changes you can make.

Right. I suspect that every exterior wall downstairs is load bearing, but I would ASSuME that as long as you replace one load bearing wall with another load bearing wall, you should be good, right?

I wonder if this was someone's idea of a dream home? I grew up in one where the designer wanted the kitchen to be the center of the home. It was literally in the center, you had to walk through it to get to the bedrooms, living area, entry, and dining areas. Everything led into the kitchen. Made for an interesting cooking experience. Oh, it was a galley kitchen as well. Looked at one that was designed as a gingerbread house. The weird angles and forced walls gave the home a feel of strange proportions. In some areas it felt bigger than it looked from the outside, in others much smaller. The second floor was supposed to have three bedrooms and two baths. In effect, you had to go through a bedroom to get to another bedroom. None were big enough for more than a single bed or crib. The unreal lines gave several roof areas showing signs of water/ice penetration.

It may very well be doable if you can put in beams and support the upper story.

That's one of my thoughts, original home owner had a say in how the house was built. I think they only stayed 4-5 years. I suspect they realized "we know squat about designing a home, this has some serious flaws," and left.

Wife liked the blue tile. To each their own...

Honestly, I don't think the blue tile is bad. I think the way that it was done isn't the best. I think there's way, way to much of it. It may have been better if done in moderation instead of doing the entire tub surround and 2 entire walls floor to ceiling.

[A930Rocket]

Originally Posted by john70t

The structural support for an entire corner of the house is a couple decorative 4x4? ...err...no. Fix that.

First thing I saw.

[masraum]

Originally Posted by A930Rocket

First thing I saw.

You're not alone. Even my wife thought of that and that's not usually the kind of thing that she notices.

And the large spa style tub is in that corner, so that corner supports a bunch of weight if someone were to take a bath.

[Crowbob]

Look elsewhere.

Or, cash in your 401k's, sell the cars, take out home improvement, ELOC and builder's loans and demolish the thing completley and start over. The new neighbors will thank you for it.

Or, if you really are hankering for a never-ending, very expensive project of dubious value, immediately break up the mass of the side elevation, somehow. Open up the interior of the first floor, loose the blue tile and ultra modernize the entire interior, both levels.

The front elevation is the least insulting aspect of the house.

[rockfan4]

The wall you want to remove to bring the patio into the interior likely has the plumbing for the master bath in it. Factor that into your budget.

[VincentVega]

Originally Posted by Crowbob

Look elsewhere.

Or, cash in your 401k's, sell the cars, take out home improvement, ELOC and builder's loans and demolish the thing completley and start over. The new neighbors will thank you for it.

Or, if you really are hankering for a never-ending, very expensive project of dubious value, immediately break up the mass of the side elevation, somehow. Open up the interior of the first floor, loose the blue tile and ultra modernize the entire interior, both levels.

The front elevation is the least insulting aspect of the house.

This.

Since you asked.... thats a piece of work. It better be cheap, really cheap. New bathrooms, structural work, framing, new floors, stairs... and you end up with.... Good luck!

[masraum]

Originally Posted by VincentVega

This.

Since you asked.... thats a piece of work. It better be cheap, really cheap. New bathrooms, structural work, framing, new floors, stairs... and you end up with.... Good luck!

Yeah, that's also the kind of thing that I wanted to hear.

[Bill Douglas]

Another idea is you live in it and enjoy it for what it is. Then sell it to someone else who also doesn't mind the slightly quirkiness of the place. It's only slightly odd.

I, myself, I'd love the place.

I wouldn't try to fix it.

[dad911]

If you really love it...... put the kitchen/eating area where the large great room is. Other rooms become den/LR/office.

That porch ceiling is low. Is that the step down from the master?

I see $150-200k in renovations. Watch 'the money pit' before submitting an offer.......

[masraum]

Originally Posted by dad911

If you really love it...... put the kitchen/eating area where the large great room is. Other rooms become den/LR/office.

That porch ceiling is low. Is that the step down from the master?

I see $150-200k in renovations. Watch 'the money pit' before submitting an offer.......

No, the step down from the master is in the front of the house and that patio is in the back under the master bathroom.

I think the porch ceiling is a standard 8', but the interior of the home is 10'.

[masraum]

Originally Posted by Bill Douglas

Another idea is you live in it and enjoy it for what it is. Then sell it to someone else who also doesn't mind the slightly quirkiness of the place. It's only slightly odd.

I, myself, I'd love the place.

I wouldn't try to fix it.

The stairs are steep and the turn-around is REALLY tight. They seem borderline dangerous. I also think they'll be difficult to "fix" but they may not be. It's not like they are a load bearing wall.

We've also debated creating a large front porch with extension that goes to the garage to allow getting from one to the other in bad weather. I'm not sure how you connect two buildings via a roof that are on two separate slabs that can move around, but I assume it can be done.

There is a lot of deferred maintenance that needs to be done. The door into the garage that would normally provide access between garage and home is so rotten on the bottom 24" that there are 3-4" gaps along the sides and bottom where the door has disintegrated. The tile around the bathtub has popped off in several spots. The supports for the small roof over the porch outside of the kitchen are 4 raw 4x4 beams that appear to be fairly new.

We think there are foundation issues. I didn't see any cracks on the inside or outside of the house, but the living room feels slanted. The garage definitely has issues as one wall has a crack in the outside brick.

The house has a gas-log fireplace, but there's a piece of wood and ash in the fireplace.

[pavulon]

Run.

[abisel]

Originally Posted by pavulon

Run.

Run away! Run away!

For the costs you are thinking, you could find something that doesn't need fixing. Moving exterior walls like you are thinking would require foundation work too.

Can you say "money pit"? If you decide to buy?

[herr_oberst]

Originally Posted by masraum

I suspect they realized "we know squat about designing a home, this has some serious flaws," and left.

If this is one of the conclusions that you've reached, I'm just wondering why you're still showing an interest. This is, in my opinion, a weird house, and the word "odd" is in the op too many times to count. Throwing money at it in large denominations doesn't seem very practical, and the upkeep, (paint, roofs, brick maintenance, gutters, etc etc) is going to be really expensive because of the size of it....

[Crowbob]

If the ‘Why?’ involves taking on an enormous project for the fun of it then he should go for it. But if there’s any consideration of the ROI, then it’s a really bad idea IMWO*.




*W = Worthless