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White and Nerdy
 
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Nissan GT-R LM NISMO

I am still fascinated by this car, completely backwards of "how to do it".

I watched the stream from Nissan at Le Mans, it kept cutting out on the straights.

It sure got a lot of attention even if it failed.

If I were a race car collector, it'd be one I'd want.

Engine front of middle, gearbox front of engine, clutch front of gearbox.

It just puts all the orders "wrong".

Could it have been sorted out to work? Why get the green light if it didn't?



I remember driver's had problems telling where the track was relative to the car, they lacked precision.
Old 03-12-2018, 06:57 PM
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I was unaware of this car. Thanks for posting it.

https://www.motorsport.com/wec/photo/main-gallery/nissan-gt-r-lm-nismo-and-42-strakka-racing-dome-strakka-s103-nissan-nick-leventis-dan-2/



Nissan GT-R LM NISMO Press Kit: "Racing is a battle. Our weapon is innovation."

Nissan GT-R LM NISMO Press Kit: "Racing is a battle. Our weapon is innovation."

Quote:
Q3: So what are the GT-R LM NISMO’s key strengths?

Bowlby: It’s hard to separate individual qualities because the concept and design of the car is a system – every element influences the other. If I had to pick out three things I would say efficiency, stability and straight-line speed. But you have to remember these are the product of the aerodynamics, which in turn were only possible to achieve because of the forward positioning of the transmission and engine, and our commitment to run front-wheel drive.
That wheelbase sure looks longer than the other cars on the track - is that an optical illusion? Would result in more stability at speed, slower in the turns.

The Nissan DeltaWing also had a long wheelbase, I guess the rules allow for such experimentation.

Nissan GT-R LM NISMO Press Kit: "Racing is a battle. Our weapon is innovation."
Quote:
Q2: What challenges does this radical car present the drivers, and how does it feel to drive? Let Michael Krumm, NISMO’s most experienced driver, and the man who has been involved in the GT-R LM NISMO development program from the very first shakedown, put you in the driver’s seat.

Krumm: The driving position is very far back behind the engine, so it feels unusual the first time you sit in there (as you can see much more of the front end of the car than you usually would). But then you drive it and, initially to your surprise, you find it’s very sharp on turn-in and the traction is extremely good. We’re putting a lot of horsepower through the front wheels, so I expected it to have loads of wheelspin, but it pulls really well.

The wheels always “pull” the car, which means as long as you are under acceleration, the rear end of the car will always be stable and cannot suddenly spin you around. That is particularly helpful in wet conditions. Also, there are certain types of corners where this “pulling” of the car can actually create more grip than a conventional rear wheel driven car.

I think it’s going to be very interesting at Le Mans because we’re going to be quicker and slower than other cars in different places on the track. It’s going to be really exciting to see where we are better. If it’s wet or a little dangerous, suddenly I think the front-wheel drive is going to show some really serious advantages.

The aerodynamic concept and low-drag of the car means when you get onto the straights it just goes and goes and goes. We’re going to reach really good top speeds at Le Mans. Usually when you drive an LM prototype you accelerate quickly, but then you hit a bit of an aerodynamic brick wall; the GT-R feels really slippery through the air. I love the V6 engine, too. It’s a really nice
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Last edited by kach22i; 03-13-2018 at 07:56 AM..
Old 03-13-2018, 07:51 AM
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Sometimes an all new design or concept is revolutionary, sometimes it is just the wrong direction to go. Off the top of my head was it not Dan Gurney that first brought a rear engine design to Indy Cars and won. If it works, you are genius. If not, it is a forgotten concept.

I still find it interesting that in all the years of Le Mans, only one Japanese manufacturer has won overall. That was Mazda. Toyota came real close, but they call it the 24 hours of Le Mans for a reason, not the 23:59 of Le Mans.
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Old 03-13-2018, 08:01 AM
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That might change this year, but who knows with Toyota's luck. lol
Old 03-13-2018, 08:25 AM
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Their hybrid system wasn't running at Le Mans, I just wonder if they could have ever gotten it working, what would it have done?

Under the rules package you had different categories of allowed engine performance vs the hybrid power train. While Audi chose the highest engine and weakest hybrid, Nissan did the opposite.

Without it's hybrid systems working on top of the engine the car was down a few hundred horse power on its Audi competition.

And yet down the Mulsane it was able to hold steady with the prototypes, the reduced drag really was there.

Through the Porsche curves it was decent, it struggled off of Arnage.

The bespoke V6 had vibration issues, the hybrid system didn't work, what if the concept had been better executed?

Old 03-13-2018, 08:28 AM
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The car reminded me of my favorite racing air craft.

Old 03-13-2018, 08:30 AM
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Yea, with Porsche and Audi both bowing out of Le Mans the field is open. The two manufacturers together have 32 of the 68 race wins overall since WW2. Kinda dominate.
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Old 03-13-2018, 08:33 AM
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This onboard of the Audi lets you listen to the hybrid system at work. The mechanical energy storage is making the gear box noisy from negative or positive torque when its working hard to harvest or release, and when it runs out of energy it goes quiet.

You can literally hear when the hybrid runs out of juice on the straights and the car is running on just engine power. You also hear when the hybrid is harvesting under braking.



The Nissan depended on a hybrid system with even more energy storage than the Audi.

I automatically think of "hybrid" not as a fly wheel ERS in conjunction with a mechanical ICE. Yet this is what Porsche, Audi, etc were using at Le mans.
Old 03-13-2018, 09:45 AM
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A race car is a complex system of compromises, very few design chiefs actually get it right consistently from one season to the next

Too easy to lose focus and concentrate on the wrong aspects of performance eg aero over mechanical grip, weight over power etc etc

Porsche and Audi LMP1 cars are the way they are from evolution not innovation and will always be quicker in the long run.

This car was never a serious contender for LMP1 race wins or Le Mans 24hrs more a show case of innovation for Nissan.

I don't think it is a good example of race car design but I do like it for being different
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Old 03-13-2018, 04:23 PM
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I thought this car was deliberately radical as there was no way a team could realistically arrive with a new car that's basically the same concept as that which everyone else has, and expect to beat the other teams with years of development under their belts. Nissan basically took the approach of trying something radically different in the off chance that they may just hit on something which would give them an advantage.

It's a smart strategy - You already know you have very little chance of winning without spending mega-bucks. Best case, you pull it off. Worst case, you get a boat-load of publicity for being creative.
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Old 03-13-2018, 04:37 PM
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Ahhh, I still remember this picture, right about the time the entire team was fired just before Christmas....



It was nice to see something out of the box for a change, but things went horribly wrong....


This is my own opinion, but I know many others feel the same way. The car seemed to be marketing great, but that's where the money seemed to go... rather than developing it. The car was overhyped and it under delivered.


The following is all from memory so I probably got some things wrong:


The car couldn't run 4WD so because of issues with the hybrid system, so they disconnected the rear drive and the GTRLM turned into front wheel drive only, which killed any hope of doing anything remarkable. Braking was bad, understeering in many places, and they couldn't run large enough front wheels and rotors to make power for the hybrid system.


It would have been great to see what would have happened if the hybrid system and 4wd actually worked. Maybe it could have changed the landscape of prototype cars, who knows?


I'm still waiting for Toyota to win Le Mans. It has been heartbreak every single year.
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Old 03-13-2018, 04:55 PM
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