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the the is offline
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Are the Big 3 CEOs Retarded?

The last time they went to Congress to beg for money, they of course flew in their 3 separate private jets.

They were criticized.

On their next trip to beg for money they are going to . . . drive to D.C. in hybrids.

Good gawd. What's wrong with these people. No wonder these companies are going bankrupt.
Old 12-02-2008, 10:04 PM
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Their behavior (the 3 CEOs) does not make me want to buy any American car in the upcoming future. Yes, the cars, like the Cadillac CTS, may be in the same league with the BMW 3 series, but it's the principle of GM, Ford and Chrysler asking taxpayers to bail them out for their overall incompetence that will steer my automobile purchases elsewhere.
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Old 12-02-2008, 10:15 PM
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Quote:
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Good gawd. What's wrong with these people. No wonder these companies are going bankrupt.

Ok, I can see the Ford guy in a Ford Escape but what is the GM guy driving? A Prius? At least go in a Corvette and show the world they have one decent car.
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Old 12-02-2008, 10:18 PM
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This thread is an insult to mentally challenged people





dipso is totally offended
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Old 12-02-2008, 10:19 PM
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Imagine if you took a private jet wherever you have went for the last thirty years. All of the sudden people ask why you didn't fly commercial. Last time they flew commercial, stewardesses looked like them chicks on Catch Me If You Can!!
Old 12-02-2008, 10:29 PM
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Ok, I can see the Ford guy in a Ford Escape but what is the GM guy driving? A Prius? At least go in a Corvette and show the world they have one decent car.
Sure, makes sense for a GM exec to drive a Toyota.
Old 12-02-2008, 10:36 PM
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GM has the Escalade and Yukon hybrid now.
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Old 12-03-2008, 12:41 AM
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SAAB and Volvo may very well be on the market soon at a really decent price. We should get together and pick them up, start our own company and make a fortune.
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Old 12-03-2008, 02:04 AM
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Old 12-03-2008, 03:24 AM
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GM's CEO is driving a hybrid version of the Chevy Malibu I believe.

The whole thing is just a dog and pony show anyway. If these three stooges get their mitts on our money, do you REALLY think there will be any change? Nope. It'll be a lot of bluster and hot air and ultimately more of the same. These guys will still end up with tens of millions of dollars at the end of the day, even if their "salary" is $1. Bonuses and options will still represent the lion's share of their real out-the-door compensation, just as it always has.

Congress doesn't even care - ultimately they just want to be able to dictate product requirements to the automakers anyway. Nancy Pelosi is practically salivating at the chance to nationalize the auto industry and establish a national, Congressional-approved line of vehicles to impress her nutty "Bay Area" liberal/socialist base. She can practically contain herself.
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Old 12-03-2008, 05:05 AM
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FYI, November auto sales were slightly worse than October.
GM -41% YOY
Ford -31%
Chrysler -47%
Toyota and Honda -32% to -34%
It is a very severe fall in auto sales, and is hitting everyone.

I read the Ford and Chrysler "plans" last night.

The Ford plan basically says they can make it through this without assistance, but if GM or Chrysler go under and take the parts suppliers with them, then Ford will need help and thus requests a $9BN standby loan to be drawn in that event.

The Chrysler plan says they need a loan before year-end, they are that close to the edge. Claims that a reorg in BK will take many years (refers to Delphi BK) and require debtor-in-possession financing 3X larger than the requested loan.

Haven't read the GM plan yet.
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Old 12-03-2008, 05:43 AM
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Quote:
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FYI, November auto sales were slightly worse than October.
GM -41% YOY
Ford -31%
Chrysler -47%
Toyota and Honda -32% to -34%
It is a very severe fall in auto sales, and is hitting everyone.
Are Toyota and Honda begging their govt for billions?
Old 12-03-2008, 06:57 AM
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The CEO's are playing the game the idiots in Congress are making them play. They had no choice but to do this. Stupid but required.

This whole thing is asinine, Congress directing which vehicles to make, setting manger salaries, etc... Just stupid.

Many on here rail against GM for making SUV's the last 20 years when in fact they made sick, disgusting money on them where as the micro cars you claim they should make never sold worth a damn and even when they did it took 12 of them sold to equal the margin on one Tahoe. Have you noticed the Camry and Accord have gotten huge when compared to their original iterations? Americans don't want little cars, period.

I'm not absolving management from blame but about the dumbest thing I could possible draw up as a game plan would be Government calling the plays. Just way way way beyond stupid.
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Old 12-03-2008, 07:01 AM
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This one seems quite fitting:

"Were we directed from Washington when to sow, and when to reap, we should soon want bread."
-- Thomas Jefferson, Autobiography, 1821
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Old 12-03-2008, 07:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by the
Are the Big 3 CEOs Retarded?
If ya have to ask....

Well, I think the Ford CEO is a bit less so. But the other 2 are clearly idiots.



Those with IQs between 51 and 70 were called morons. Morons had adequate learning skills to complete menial tasks and communicate. Imbeciles, with IQs between 26 and 50, never progressed past a mental age of about six. And the lowest of all were the idiots, with IQ between 0 and 25, who were characterized by poor motor skills, extremely limited communication, and little response to stimulus.
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Old 12-03-2008, 07:19 AM
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The CEO's are playing the game the idiots in Congress are making them play. They had no choice but to do this. Stupid but required.

This whole thing is asinine, Congress directing which vehicles to make, setting manger salaries, etc... Just stupid.
A poor excuse. All the U.S. govt has done was raise the CAFE and emissions standards, much like what has been done in European countries. Has M-B, BMW and others been unable to adjust their design and engineering to new European pollution and efficiency standards? No. They simply supplanted their line with more fuel efficient cars, such as clean-burning diesels. For GM, Ford and Chrysler to blame the govt for their woes only shifts the responsibility from their inattentiveness to create new and innovative product.

Quote:
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Many on here rail against GM for making SUV's the last 20 years when in fact they made sick, disgusting money on them where as the micro cars you claim they should make never sold worth a damn and even when they did it took 12 of them sold to equal the margin on one Tahoe. Have you noticed the Camry and Accord have gotten huge when compared to their original iterations? Americans don't want little cars, period.
Micro cars? What are those? Are they legal in the U.S.? Smaller cars are - and there are plenty of those on the roads here. The Yaris, the Prius, the Fit, the Focus, etc. No, the American car companies refuses to make more smaller cars for consumers because they can't sell them for as high a price as Yukons and Expeditions. It's all greed on their part.

Quote:
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I'm not absolving management from blame but about the dumbest thing I could possible draw up as a game plan would be Government calling the plays. Just way way way beyond stupid.
Govt needs accountability before it unleashes $25 to $35 billion dollars to these wastrel companies. Part of that is telling the big 3 what they should produce for today's consumer so that a similar bailout isn't needed in the future. After all, it seems Govt has a better idea about what the people want in efficiency and design more so than car companies who refuse to listen to the buyers.
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Old 12-03-2008, 07:28 AM
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My SLK is dwarfed by 99% of the vehicles on the road and I actually have more than enough room in it. I think it's comfortable and if anything, maybe even slightly large/heavy for me.

When I grew up (in New England, with snowy, icy, and generally schitty weather for six months a year) we didn't have big gigantic 4x4 whatchamacallits with 8,000-pound towing capacities. We had what at the time was considered "normal" cars. Yes, these were large too, but that's pretty much the only choice you had in the 1970s. Well, my mom did have a Pinto for a while, but that ended pretty quickly after the news of their safety problems became apparent - she got rid of it after something like six months.

Anyway, the SUV represents everything that's wrong about America. They're obnoxious, they're oversized, they're gluttonous, they're wasteful and they exist to satisfy Americans' "need" for comforts that they hopelessly confuse with "wants". They embody the attitude so prevalent in our country that people think they're better than everyone else and "I'll do whatever I want - screw you". This is translated through their profile and perhaps more worryingly, through their design which DELIBERATELY seeks to KILL the drivers of other, "normal" vehicles through the higher placement of bumpers and centers of mass. But as long as you walk away and can get home in time to watch your American Idol, who cares if the other guy is lying bleeding to death in the street, right? His fault for not buying an even bigger SUV, right? Such is the arms race of idiots that this trend has inspired... Welcome to America - inconsideracy is expected.

I have no love whatsoever for these vehicles and look forward to the day when the last one is crushed, removing them from the face of this earth forever. It'll be a better day for all of us. But that said, I do respect the right of people to buy and do whatever they want. If they want to be wasteful idiots, such is their right. At least it makes them easier to identify and avoid.

Sorry for the anti-SUV rant here, but I'll find it all the more fitting if these stupid-arse vehicles end up being the death of the "big three" in the same way they've been nothing but destructive since their inception. They've been a scourge on everyone except maybe some very wealthy middle eastern sheiks, who will undoubtedly lament their passing.
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Is it paranoia if everyone really IS out to get me?

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Last edited by Porsche-O-Phile; 12-03-2008 at 07:57 AM..
Old 12-03-2008, 07:51 AM
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SUVs and PU trucks were a cash cow for the big 3, there is no doubt about it. Any vehicle from any company with a high sticker price is a boon for any car company in general, they're all mass-produced crap when it comes down to it. How much do you think it costs Porsche to make each new 911 that it sells for ~$100k or MB to stamp out those $150k AMG pimp-sleds? Not much. The only variable is just how massive the profit is, they are all massively profitable.

So the big 3 had a heyday stamping out SUVs for the last ten years and making 10:1 profit ratios, where did the $$ go?? How can an industry make billions for a decade straight and then be BK after one bad year? This is the part of big business that always confounds me. But then I've never claimed to be an expert at commerce.
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Old 12-03-2008, 08:18 AM
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Quote:
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Are Toyota and Honda begging their govt for billions?
No, but the European automakers are starting to. And so are the Chinese automakers.
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Old 12-03-2008, 08:18 AM
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Well said, Jeff.
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Old 12-03-2008, 08:22 AM
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Old 12-03-2008, 08:22 AM
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