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Just wondering - if we are so broke, how come China hasn't invaded yet?

Are they as broke? How come no one's kicking us while we're down?
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Old 03-14-2009, 11:11 AM
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Our military is still exactly the same as it was....obama hasn't gutted it yet. Though he has pretty much pledged to.

He states he will maintain the US as "the #1 military power on earth", but that's really not much of a guarantee, as we are actually currently so far out in front of everyone else that if you were to build a top 5 most powerful air forces list it would look like this:

1) US Air Force
2) US Navy
3) US Marine Corps
4) Israel
5) UK
etc, etc

To use an automotive analogy, the US military is the equivelant to Porsche, Ferrari and Lamborghini all wrapped into one. Supremely nimble, powerful, advanced, and expensive.

That's how far out front the US military is. The US Army is equally prohibitive as an opponent WRT land combat, particularly in conventional war.

I read the other day that the US defense budget represents 50% of all global military spending.

I expect Obama is going to slash the hell out of the military budget to pay for his socialism, and soon we, like europe, will be able to afford only tiny little self-defense military's because the vast majority of our coffers get spent on socialist pork and stupidity.
Old 03-14-2009, 11:22 AM
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I have secret inside intelligence on why the Chinese aren't invading. Their version of the CIA just went through an exercise to determine the feasbility of an invasion. The exercise had a team of Chinese University of Chicago MBA graduates competing with a group of Chinese Wharton School MBA graduates to do an invasion cost/benefit analysis.

The two competing teams independently arrived at the same cost/benefit solution. That is: the cost of a military invasion was extremely expensive, but the value of owning the US over the long term marginally paid for the invasion costs if you amortized the expense over long enough time. But that there was no reason to bother with an invasion because the price to purchase America outright was lower than the cost of invading. Further, that the price to purchase the US was dropping daily, so all they had to do was wait long enough and we'll pay them to take us off our own hands.

Good news: no invasion. Band news, Mandarin is a hard language at best and almost impossible to learn if you are tone deaf.
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Old 03-14-2009, 01:12 PM
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Interesting situation.

China's production capacity either comes from U.S. dollars or from forcing its own population into virtual slave labor. Obviously if they want to attack us, there will be no U.S. dollars going to support the effort (at least not directly), and FWIW there are very few U.S. dollars going there right now anyway since the U.S. is collapsing economically.

So their alternative is to try and whip up domestic production, which largely entails using their military to force its poor, uneducated populace to build more military machinery, guns, equipment, etc. To grow food and refine fuel to support a VERY long supply-line offensive against the U.S. Obviously this is counterproductive since it divides the resources of their military, but it certainly CAN be done - there's plenty of precedent for it (think Nazi Germany for example). They also need to retain some military presence at home to prevent themselves from being attacked by either Russia, Iran, Pakistan, India or any one of a dozen others that would love to get a piece of them while they're off distracted with trying to fight a long-distance war against the U.S.

So for the time being I think they'll bide their time since there's too much risk of becoming destabilized at home with so much resources dedicated to a U.S. attack/invasion (which is what it would take). They'll bide their time as they've done for the last 50 years, allowing their policies to erode our military, our production and our economy. It won't be long and they've been very patient up to now, so I see them as willing to wait a few more years until our economy is completely on its knees (due to socialism) and our military is broken/dismantled (thank the war in Iraq for a lot of it, thank Obama's plan to gut the military for the rest).

I think China will wait about 5-10 years before making a serious aggressive move - and when they do it will involve a massive amphibious assault and tactical nuclear strikes against our population centers. There's no longer much in the way of manufacturing to destroy (since they've deliberately stolen it all away for the past 40 years by pegging the yuan to the dollar), there's little value in our fat, lazy population, etc. They want our natural resources and the agricultural promise of the midwest.

Another damn good reason to get out of CA. Do you really think the disarmed, passive, soft, flabby and government-dependent population of this state can REALLY mount any kind of militia resistance against a motivated Chinese invasion? Phat fkin chance. In WW2, the Japanese deliberately ruled out an invasion of the U.S. mainland because "...there will be a rifle behind every blade of grass..." (I believe that was Yamamoto's quote). Now? Hahahaha!!! We've disarmed the populace for the most part, making them a far easier target for "mop up" of anything left after the tactical nuclear strikes.

Yes, I think China would LOVE to destroy us militarily. They are NOT our friends and have done nothing to convince me that they have anything but ill intentions and ominous long-term plans to enslave the entire world - starting with us.

And thanks to our own stupidity, we're playing right into their hands. They're right on-track.
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Old 03-14-2009, 01:21 PM
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everybody else is broke worse than us

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Old 03-14-2009, 01:22 PM
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Old 03-14-2009, 01:40 PM
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Chinese invasion? WTF are you nutters bangin' on about? Tactical nuclear strikes?

The United States has something on the order of 5000 operable nuclear weapons. We have a fantastic nuclear navy. The chinese know the score. They can't be assured of knocking out all of our capability. If only 1% of nuclear assets were able to respond ot an attack, it would kill 300-400 million people, mostly the Han chinese. The Han are not stupid. Their commitment to military affairs is half hearted. Good for rattling around the neighborhood, but they don't have the long range punch we have.
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Old 03-14-2009, 02:24 PM
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We wouldn't use them against our own cities/populations. The Chinese would use our own west coast cities as the basis of tactical strikes against others.
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Old 03-14-2009, 03:02 PM
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I'm gonna buy Reynolds Aluminum stock because evidently tinfoil is selling like hotcakes.
Old 03-14-2009, 03:09 PM
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The Chinese couldn't land a single battalion of men on the west coast of the US.

Total non-threat.

If we fight them at all, it would be someplace like Taiwan, on THEIR doorstep.
Old 03-14-2009, 03:23 PM
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You really think the Chinese would spare you or treat you differently there gwailo?
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Old 03-14-2009, 03:24 PM
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Old 03-14-2009, 03:26 PM
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They'll certainly be able to land troops on U.S. soil if Obama follows through on his plan to dismantle the military...

Who's gonna' stop them then? A bunch of stoners in Santa Monica coffee shops who have been disarmed by (then) Governor Feinstein? What are we gonna' do? Throw screenplays for "Everybody Loves Raymond II" at them?

Eventually China will get sick of Taiwan's crap and issue them an ultimatum. The U.S. will be "forced" to back Taiwan per our agreements with them. The Chinese can simply then call in all the U.S. debts and collapse our economy (like it won't already be collapsed by then anyway, but work with me here). While we're farting around wondering what to do (look no further than the current economic crisis to see how well this works) they can land a couple thousand troop transports anywhere on the west coast and start hucking nukes against U.S. cities from our own soil.

I seriously doubt the Chinese government really cares if the U.S. retaliates against some of the Chinese population. People are just expendable cannon fodder to that regime.
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Old 03-14-2009, 03:33 PM
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Originally Posted by nostatic View Post
I'm gonna buy Reynolds Aluminum stock because evidently tinfoil is selling like hotcakes.


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Old 03-14-2009, 04:46 PM
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You really think the Chinese would spare you or treat you differently there gwailo?
Jeff, do you really think that Chinese invasion is imminent? Seriously, do you think that within the next 5 years we will see the Chinese military engaging US troops in the CONUS?
Old 03-14-2009, 05:20 PM
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Serious paranoia.

However, I sometimes have the same thoughts about Guatemala.

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Old 03-14-2009, 05:31 PM
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"Imminent", no (see above). "Inevitable", absolutely.
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Old 03-14-2009, 06:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Porsche-O-Phile View Post
They'll certainly be able to land troops on U.S. soil if Obama follows through on his plan to dismantle the military...

Who's gonna' stop them then? A bunch of stoners in Santa Monica coffee shops who have been disarmed by (then) Governor Feinstein? What are we gonna' do? Throw screenplays for "Everybody Loves Raymond II" at them?
They would need a blue ocean navy with numerous aircraft carriers and dozens of wings of naval carrier aircraft first. And about a hundred blue ocean transports.

They have none of those things.

Beyond that though, nothing is stopping them.

Amigo, China couldn't take Taiwan, let alone the US west coast. You know what a hypothetical Chinese invasion of Taiwan is derisively called? "The million man swim."

China wants no part of a naval war with the US- you are seriously underestimating the might of the US Navy. The USN could take on most navies on earth at the same time and still emerge victorious. The disparity of power with any other nation on earth that the USN possesses is ridiculous.

On top of it, China's navy is just not very large, nor very good. They have a few good ships, but most of it would just be cannon fodder for US cruise missiles. I have been told by Colonel Yu from CHIMO that PLAN ships rarely even leave the sight of land. If there is a naval war with China it will almost certainly be in the Straits of Taiwan and it will be over in about 72 hours.

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Old 03-14-2009, 06:54 PM
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If/when China buries us, it will be financially. No military necessary. I don't see them physically annexing the US any time soon. And in fact their economy is so dependent on ours, *they* are the ones that are at risk right now. As the saying goes, if I owe you a little money, I'm in trouble. If I owe you a LOT of money, the *you* are in trouble.

Forget Guatemala - I lose sleep over the Falklands. They are still pissed off...
Old 03-14-2009, 07:11 PM
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Agreed.

China owns 1 trillion dollars in US debt. For their economy, that's real money.
Old 03-14-2009, 07:31 PM
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