How NOT to Damage paint on fender bolt heads

911 tweaks · 05-04-2008, 04:31 AM

I need some help in that I need to remove the front fenders on a 82' 911 to make sure their is no rust under there and to replace the seam tape, if that is what that Black rectangular oe stickey stuff is called...?

Q1: since I don't have any touch up paint, how do I remove the bolts that attach the top lip of the fender in the front trunk W/O cracking~chipping the paint off as they look perfect from the factory or when ever it was resprayed?? (I will need to use a wrench or socket w/ ratchet to remove bolts)

Q2: what, if any, kind of spacers should be under the head of these fender bolts to aid in the attachment of the fender here? (i.e. flat washer OR flat + lock washer OR schroner washer, OR ?)

Q3: what should I find UNDER the fender i.e. the space between the fender & the body? I am guessing that I should find the Black seam/body tape... is there any good tips~ procedures to remove this tape anh how best to prep and do the re-attachment?

Q4: something in the back of my head, don't go there, ... anyway tells me that there is a better procedure and/or material to put between the fender and body as this Black seam/body tape traps sh^t that causes rust? Is this true? Maybe if tape installed wrong causes rust, otherwise if used correctly it is the ticket??

I hope you all can help me as I am intimidated to begin this one as I don't want to open a can of potentially unknown rust worms lurking underneath...?

HELP !!

Thanks,
signed...chicken Bob when it comes to body work

911 tweaks · 05-04-2008, 09:10 AM

any ideas here guys?? I would like to make some progress on this today is I can get any ideas on what to try...

I did try an adj wrench w/ a cloth wrapped on the inside of its 2 flat jaw surfaces and it started to wrinkle the paint on the 2 corners of the bolt head... so I tried a socket 1 size up & 1 @ 2 sizes up w/ rag mat'l inside of the socket and it wouldnt fir w/ the 1 suze up... the 2 size up wouldnt grab and started to mar the paint...

HELP please... I am trying what I can think of... any one else have an idea??
Thanks,
Bob

chris911sc · 05-04-2008, 12:04 PM

Bob, unfortunately I have not been able to find a method that does not cause damage to the paint when removing a bolt. It may be a long shot, but perhaps you could try and find 10mm socket with a nylon insert similar to the non marring lug sockets. I have not come across one in my years working on cars but there may be one available. My fender bolts use about a 3/4" flat washer. You should find the black tape in the jamb where the fender meets the body. The stuff is pretty pliable and easily removed. I would probably take a plastic scraper and a some lacquer thinner to remover the stuff. I would not be concerned about putting the black tape back on. I would just make sure the mating surfaces are primed and protected(paint, undercoating,etc) and reinstall the fender. I can tell you from experience, VW/Audi/Porsche are some of the only companies that use that type of sealant.

911 tweaks · 05-04-2008, 02:34 PM

Thanks Chris for your info and suggestions...

Now what do I do... I guess since the car is not a unique car, I will do my best to minimize the damage to the bolt heads and maybe put a trunk carpet strip down the area since their are the snaps present...
Oh man... its gonna look like dog when anyone lifts up the carpet to check it out and/or look for rust ~ damage repair... and there will be those honkin bolt heads with 1/2 the paint missing... I know what I would think..."that fender must of come off due to some damage...why would anyone take the fender off??"

Well, after closer inspection, the drivers side has a bubble buldgeing out from the middle area of the fender attachment area... here goes nothing...I guess I have reason to investigate ~ fix that now... I hope it is not bad...!!!
Bob

chris911sc · 05-04-2008, 02:47 PM

I usually just touch up the bolt heads with some acrylic touch up if Im trying to hide evidence. Get the good stuff from Porsche not the cheapo Pep Boys touch up paint. Chances are, if you do a good job touching them up, it will look factory to the untrained eye. Plus, you are talking about a 26 year old car. Most realistic people will figure a car of that age that looks great will have had work at some point.

911 tweaks · 05-05-2008, 02:26 AM

sounds good... so you are recommending I get one of those little touch up bottles of paint and have at the bolts and touch them up AFTER the re install?

That sounds fine, however, I dont think the color of the car is matching the sticker in the engine bay that says "Zinmetalic" & the COA from PCNA says Zinmetalic and the car is a very lite goldish color of silver, NOT, the silver color of Zinmetalic.

Does anyone have a car that is Zinmetalic? Maybe I should post a seperate questiuon of this?

Thanks,
Bob

Porsche_monkey · 05-06-2008, 11:06 AM

That's a nasty job, I hate doing them. The bolts in the wheelwell are the hardest to get off, they are glued in with undercoating. Use a heat gun and cut the goop away with a box-cutter.

Have fun. ike I said I hate that job.

And please post the correct 'sealant' for the fender if you find it.

chris911sc · 05-06-2008, 05:28 PM

You should touch the bolt heads up after you are completely done. PBH, I am not sure where to find the correct black sealant that goes in between the fender and the body. I can tell you though that for astetics, the Wurth Spayable Seam Sealer can duplicate the factory sealer that covers the bolts inside the wheelwell to the cowl section perfectly.

cgarr · cgarr's Garage

I have the ribbon that goes between the fender but I just removed my 1/4 windows and under the sill was some clay from the factory that looks and felt a lot like plain old plumbers putty, thats what I am using when it goes back together too.

911 tweaks · 05-07-2008, 05:18 AM

thanks guys!

I will post when I get into this and we'll see what I have to deal with... trying to plan ahead here and as always, these things take WAY too long for me to do...becoming an issue as all work and no fun...the fun has only been you all with all of your help here on pelican as to how to do's, not to do's, where & what to use, BUT, finding the time is way beyond brutal for me...maybe why it has been 7+ yrs to date of collecting parts, learning the + & - on all...time, time, time... man is it valuable these days!!
Remember back in high school when time was free and throw away mentality... man if I could only have 10% of what I wasted back then I would be done with this resto... dont get me wrong, I had a ball back then but as far as something to show for it, well, memories and friends...well those are important but not able to help me here...
I'll stop whining now... sorry I guess I needed to vent.
Wife gone all this week to TX on business and I have not been able to do anything on the resto...except once again have all of you keep answering my q's and keeping me sane... but no tangiable progress... we'll see what happens soon

Bob

Bob

Deschodt · 05-14-2008, 11:13 AM

I just pulled my fenders on an 83, but was not concerned with the bolt paint because there wasn't any - a sign that they we pulled before, then.... I will say that I also did not find the seam tape, as you call it... I had bought some from our host in preparation of replacing it, but since my car was fine without it and I hear that tape is a rust trap, I will leave it off... there was some caulking and I may replace that.... there was zero rust there (Ok, one little spot of surface rust only) after at least 12 years since the car has been mine (no telling when the fenders were pulled the first time, or why). Based on that, you may want to skip the seam tape... Your call...

Wcb4 · 05-14-2008, 02:29 PM

Stoddard's sells the sealant tape. If done right and taken care of ie pulling the weather striping and a careful check form time to time all should stay healthy. You might want to check the channel along the front of the windshield at the same time. This is a bigger water trap than the wing to fender. Keep it clean with paint on the metal. Porsche would not have bothered with the tape if they did not think it necessary. Helps keep the dirt and water from being forced from the wheel well up. But some how I do not think Porsche thought these cars would still be around some thirty years later. It only took them 12 years to get around to galvanizing all the parts that needed treatment in the first place. Sorry I'll stop rambling.

911 tweaks · 05-14-2008, 04:45 PM

thanks once again... I am still not there yet... delays, delays...

I am leaning twds using the tape/sealer, however, I will reserve final decision till I open'er up.

Is there a general consenus (sp)of what to do here?? I can see good arguments both ways, but why would the factory us it unless they had a reason,,, my guess is the factory didn't want the 2 painted metal surfaces rubbing against each other which would definately rust up in short order there after in my opinion

What do you all think on use of tape/sealer?? Yes OR No ???
Thanks, Bob

Porsche_monkey · 05-15-2008, 03:52 AM

I vote yes.

LM3929 · 06-21-2008, 11:10 PM

There is a product that will work as a replacement for the seam tape that does not collect water it is used to sell seams on motorhomes runs about $8.00 per roll.

LM

911 tweaks · 06-22-2008, 06:58 AM

Thanks LM for the input... I am still not there in this project... still cleaning and collecting final parts... anyway, do you have a product name a/o info on where to check out this seam sealer you say is used in motorhome bulding ??
Sorry for the delays guys... :-(
Thanks,
Bob

911 tweaks · 06-22-2008, 06:58 AM

Thanks LM for the input... I am still not there in this project... still cleaning and collecting final parts... anyway, do you have a product name a/o info on where to check out this seam sealer you say is used in motorhome bulding ??
Sorry for the delays guys... :-(
Thanks,
Bob

911 tweaks · 06-22-2008, 06:58 AM

double posting... I only clicked 1x
Bob

LM3929 · 06-22-2008, 08:45 AM

It is just called seam sealer, there is a grey putty style sealer that matches the original what we used to call Dum Dum, by Elixer or a white/Black or grey non hardening Butyl tape by Chemtron both are available at any RV parts department. The Butyl is the far superior product.

Lorne M.
LM

frankc · 12-28-2008, 06:38 PM

Reviving this thread...

So with the fender bolts painted over, does this mean the factory painted the chassis with the fenders bolted on? This doesn't seam right as then there would be no paint in the seam between the two panels. So was the chassis painted in two stages - once with fenders off (painting the fenders at this time as well as seen with most re-paints), and a second time with the fenders bolted on just to cover the seams/fasteners? This seams like it would add quite a bit of time to the painting process as the paint from the first stage would need to dry before proceeding to the next stage.

I'm interested because I need to pull at least one fender to tend to some rust at the seam.

thanks,
Frank