930 Front Fender Lip Repair

[MikeD930]

A previous owner of my 930 had 275/40-17 tires on 10" wide front rims with its offset being too far out of the fender. This caused severe tire contact with the fender lip which was already rolled. This contact caused the fender lip to bulge out. The car now has 245/40-17 tires but the wheels are still 10" wide. My plan is to change the rim halves to 9" using correct wheel offset.

Can anyone tell me how the fenders can be corrected? I'm not sure if I can tackle this job myself (I have never done body work) or should hire a pro to work on the fenders?

[bobrestore]

you can do the exact opposite of what was done. you will have to rig up a reverse mandrel process. you want a broad area of force to be applied to the outer flair lip surface and move it back and forth throughout the area while applying inward pressure. Above the area that is under pressure VERY GENTLY with a rubber mallet tap the metal. This is to wake up and excite the molecules.... do not tap hard enough to dent the metal.... Also on the board or rubber or whatever you are using to press on the flair lip, you can strike with hammer with moderate force while it is under pressure.... After doing this, if you haven't gained an intuitive feel for how to fix the "bent" part of the flair lip, you can get a paintless repair guy to tweek the rest... easy peasy...... bob

[MikeD930]

I'm trying to picture what a mandrel looks like. I imagine it can be a piece of flat wood (eg 2x4) which you lay on a fender and smack it with a 3 lb hammer? Or is it a big flat pliers (have not seen this before) to bend back a fender lip? How does one protect the paint during a mandrel process? Are the tools lined with rubber?

I did not know that a typical paintless repair guy have tools for this repair. Maybe I should hire a repair guy to do this repair and also repair a used deck lid (I bought recently) that has deformed edges at several locations.

Thanks for the advice!

[bobrestore]

A block of wood can be a mandrel .. However just striking it with a hammer will likely not produce the best results... It could end up moving the metal at that immediate location only, when you really want the general area to move uniformly.... I would suggest talking to the shops that do the fender flaring. I have never used them and do not know what tools they have. They may have a way to uniformly press the flair back... I know I could come up with a set up, but it would be totally on the fly.....

[MikeD930]

I agree...it's best for me to have it done by a pro. I'll take it to a shop...rather than effing up the fenders. Now I'll have to find body shop that I can trust...but first will have to deal with the front wheels.

[bobrestore]

rather than an actual body shop.... inquire what the "fender roll" industry has to offer. keep in mind there are different professions out there that have different ways of doing things ... think chiropractor verses orthopedic surgeon....

[962porsche]

to move the roll wheel opening back is not near as easy as it is to push the lip out .
i have had to repair more then i really want to think about . because of how and were the rolling takes place it's far from a simple job to move it back into it's OE position .
no paintless repair place will screw with some thing like this that i know of .
your looking to have it pushed back and not have paint work done ? another thing no one can or will guaranty . 1st the lip is flattened out being folded over on it's self then the lip is pushed out .
what was the quality of the rolled lip ? did they skim coat it with filler to fix and damage they may have done by pushing the lip out ?
to repair a lip you use a dolly on the under side and hammer it outer edge to move the lip back into it's original shape . you hammer slowly and easily just moving the metal a little at a time across the hole lip . one problem is who to hammer with out damaging the finish or not to damage any filler if there is any ? then your not just moving a single layer of sheet metal but two as the lip is folded over on it's self .

[Cairo94507]

I agree 100% that this requires someone who knows metal work. Don't "learn" on this car. I am sure someone on this forum will recommend a metal guy in your area or close enough to make it work, to handle this in the best possible way.

[962porsche]

this is basically what your dealing with .
moving the metal with out having to do any filler work is easy how ever moving the metal with out damaging the finish is a hole other matter .
things like thinking your going to use a rubber mallet to move the metal and not do damage to the finish is BS ! it takes the same force load with a rubber mallet as it does with a metal hammer to move the metal . it's the force load on the finish that will damage the finish .

[kevin930t]

In your pic looks to me like someone previously cut the inside lip of the fender to keep the tire from rubbing,its hard to tell from your pic,it looks cut then roled

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[MikeD930]

962...thanks a bunch!! Your words are worth 1000 words and your pic is worth 1,000,000!

As far as I can tell...my fender were rolled (lip folded over) without any filler. The inside lip of the fender was not cut.

Now...I will have to expect to have the fenders repainted when this repair is done. That's what I wanted to know...it's more work than I thought. I won't try to "learn" body work on this car!

[962porsche]

if your car looks as good in person as it does in the photos returning the wheel openings back to how they were from the factory will bring the value up more .
so part of the repair should be to also not just move the opening back into place but to also repair the lip that was folded over .

[MikeD930]

I'd say the paint on my car is 8/10 (chips on front). It has original paint but the car has fiberglass front hood and 3.8 RS rear deck/lid. I do not have an original hood or tail. Plus my car is heavily modified (suspension and engine) so there's no concern (actually no desire) to go back to stock.

With that in mind do you think it's important to unfold a lip when straightening out the fenders? I'd be concerned with wide tires catching the lip so I'd think it's best to leave the lip folded (not sure how far in the wheels will be when I go to 9").

Here's one photo of my car plus you can check out my 'garage' at my avatar.

[bobrestore]

you have the original paint on the car.... that means the adhesion will be superior and there are no bondo on the flair .... factory did not use bondo... I know if it was my car I would not want to patch paint the car.... more so ... I know I could fix it with out the paint work. In my original post I said you need to use a mandrel to reverse what they did. In the pencile sketch above were he shows the hammer and dolly method ... you would be applying pressure were he shows the hammer striking...

[bobrestore]

the damage was done by pressing out and moving to even out the result, that's what they call fender rolling. I suggest you do the opposite, pressing the fender in while distributing the force to keep the movement smooth.... actually at the same time the inward force is being applied you would want to press out in a massaging way where the picture shows the heel dolly... Actually the place that might get some loss of adhesion would be when you try to unfold the small lip on the bottom of the flair, in this area you would want to heat the area with a heat gun and then bend it back slowly and gently. It is worth your while since you don't have the know how, to talk to some fender roll shops ,,,,you will know immediately if the have the ability... don't go negative.. and believe me when I say that there are ways to painless repair cars that most people have know knowledge of (ignorance).. I have wrapped hammers and dollys in leather to do paintless hammer and dolly repair on air dried lacquer... you can always cover the area in 3or4 layers of masking tape as well if you need to strike with hammer. I don't suggest you do the work but you should be able to find some one that can do it so that you can preserve your original paint.

[962porsche]

you could design and build a totally new tool to reverse roll a fender ?
you never know there could be a big market for it ????
bob states he could roll the fender back if it was his car. needless to say 99.9% of the body people out there would do the same if one of us screwed it up it's on us to repair it our self's . so i'm guessing he will guaranty he would not mar the finish one bit . so i'm also guessing he would refinish the panels for free if he did .
debating if it can be done and at what success rate is so pointless it's just laughable .


i like patch paint funny never heard it called that spot painting or spot repair is what the industry calls it .

as for heat guns and urethane finishes . it works on enamels and lacquers but because of the heat wave a heat gun works on they do not break the chemical links of a urethane finish making them as pliable as other finishes .
there are 3 different basic types of heat waves picking the proper one for the finish your working with is kind of important .

now the reality of it is the car owner i'm guessing doesn't have the skill level to do this type of repair him self !
you options are find a shop that will guaranty they will not screw up the finish one little bit .
if they do the shop will most likely charge you to spot repair what gets screwed up .
from what i'm seeing posted someone is so good they will not screw anything up and if they do they will also repair it at no cost to the customer ?
to boast about things like this as there is a chance something could happen is just so dam funny .
things like the finish may not have the best adhesion now after being bent by rolling the wheel opening . by bending it back could crack the finish then it may chip or flake ?? not the fault of the tech but there is a chance some thing like that could happen .
to make a claim it can be done with a 100% success rate is total BS ! to many unknown factors come into play just looking at a few photos on line .


would a paintless dent repair place take on a job like this .
my guess is not at all !
but call around and see you never know ? how ever there is nothing for them to use as a fulcrum to push the lip back in .

you could design and build a reverse rolling tool . the reality about that is cost to do so .
so talking about using or making a mandrel (mandrel is just a round cylinder ) to roll a 911 bodies fender back is pointless ! the cost will out weigh the result .

take the car around to shops in your area and see what other shop owners have to say .

call the paintless dent repair places and ask them .

[MikeD930]

962...no worry I won't consider any body shops (including a painless repair shop) unless they are familiar with 911 body work. Plus I'll expect to have some paint work as a result from fender work. It won't be for a while if I ever decided to have the fenders rolled back.

Again thanks to all for suggestions!