1964 SC Cab barn sitting 30 years...

[Telephunken]

Greetings all, Ive been on the 911 forum for help but this is my first time posting in the 356 forum. I need some expert opinion or info on a couple things: Ive owned about a dozen 356's, but not since about 10 years ago. I know the market has changed a lot. I have an opportunity to buy a car I have known about and been after for over 20 years.
Its a 64' SC Cabriolet. Its been owned by this family since 66'. He bought it from the oringal owner, (his sister)driven until 82' when it was parked in the garage and covered. Its NOT seen the light of day out of the garage since. He has uncovered it a few times over the years, and even said he woul strat it up a couple times here and there at first but at some point quit doing it. I spoke with the owner today at a family get together and I got as much info as i could, history, etc. It has no rust that he knows of, 90% stock except for an engine rebuild in 80' with a big bore kit and carbs changed to webers. Other than that ALL STOCK. never been repainted, original top, interior, everything. accessory wood "C" era steering wheel. Its a european model with the different heating system. he says he thinks the top may be deteroriating some, and the seats VERY dusty, etc. Other than that, I know noting else. He did say that the front bumper was off but he had it. He is very knowledgable about the car itself, but doesnt have a clue of what he wants for it. He says he hasnt thought about it in 30 years. We have agreed to have me come look at the car and "let him know what I think is a fair price" (his words). I wont know any more until then. I dont think I would be lucky enough to get it without him doing any research on the market. I just want to be prepared to pay fair price and I need to know what restoratio costs could be so i can use that as leverage in my negotiations. I know there is much info to still learn on this limited info, but here are my questions:
1. How many 64 cabs do you think came with the SC option? I know total cabs built was 1700+ but I cant find an engine option number breakdown;
2. With the info I have given, what would be a price range that would be fair to both the buye and seller for it?
3. And last, which i guess would hinge on the answer to #2, what would someone expect to pay to restore? say from a Reputable shop, and pretent the car needs very little or no major metal work or rust repairs?
Im just looking for a ball park guys. Thanks all.

[Les Paul]

He could easily get 50-60 as is. And it might just be a steal at that. As far as restoration just how much money do you have to spend?

[Telephunken]

Les, thanks for the input. As far as the restoration goes, I was trying to get a feel for what would a typical restoration for this model cost given there is minimal metal work needed, etc. (from a reputable shop; NOT an amatuer but also NOT the most notable shop in the world either)
Could it be $30,000 or $40,000? or $50? I know this is a loaded question, but if you have a very complete car, with minimal parts needing to be "found" then assume full strip, minimal or no metal work; then full re-do, as well as full engine rebuild, barring ay big SURPRISES...shouldnt be hard o come up with a range.

I need to come up with a best guess because if I expect worse case the deal to go like this: he and I come to an agreement on what the car would be worth with n good restoration; then I give him a number of what i think the resotration would cost, then we arrive at a fair price "as-is", then I can try to negotiate from there. =)

[Telephunken]

Whats scarry is that I sort of feel that i may be buying this car in the height of the market. There may be another 356 "bubble" looming like years back. Prices were very high and then they fell. I used to buy 356 driving coupes, even pre A for less than $7,000, projects for $4,000 and even passed on a 54' cab that was half restored and drivable for $15,000, only 15 years ago. I see what these cars can bring, but I also tink about the fact that 356 have never been higher than they are now. Is this a trend? prices can only go so high before they cannot be substained, like the housing market did. I dont want to buy at $50, spend $50 on restore, then be at $100K to brak even. And thats in this high market. No?? If Im wrong, please correct me someone, i am no means an expert, im looking for that from you all....

[Les Paul]

As has been stated here numerous times register over at the 356registry. Those guys restore cars all the time. They know the answer there or will give plenty of advice.

[Telephunken]

ok, thanks. Im not on the registry, and I think the forums are blocked. I may have to join I guess. =) Thanks agin Les.

[Rusty 356]

A nicely resored SC CAB could easily bring 150K. If you can maintain a survivor, original paint un restored car could be even better. Good luck with whatever you decide to do. I'd go 50K all day long for a nice barn find SC cab.
best to you,

Rusty

[GWN]

I tend to agree with Rusty,

Also it is worth joining the 356 Registry... they show sales of 356's every month and the late cabs are going for 135K+, so jump in and buy it for $50 and put another $50K in it and you will still be ahead...the SC is even better bet!!

George

1963 356N coupe
1972 914 1.7
1983 SC Coupe
1987 Carrera Targa

[Rusty 356]

And as someone more insightful than I said "I've never paid too much for a Porsche, I just sold it too soon"
Go for it
Where are you located?
One last thing, get it running and driving, enjoy it as is then if you like what you have put the money in the cosmetics. If not then sell it for 70K or so.

[Unobtanium-inc]

I think Rusty's valuations may be slightly optimistic, save for the most pristine, matching numbers, correct restorations out there. $100,000 is a high number for even an SC cabriolet in very nice driving condition. You don't see them hit the six figure mark often. You can always find one of the high end resellers offering a car for $100-150k, but real sales don't support these numbers. That said, Rusty is spot on when he says you didn't pay too much, just sold too early. I remember seeing the first $100k Speedster sale, thinking "Wow, this is SOME bubble!" Here we are some years later and $150k is not unheard of for a restored Speedster. There will be ups and downs (remember the Ferrari market in the '80s -- ouch!) but the cars will always have major value.

A proper restoration will be quite costly, but the good news is it doesn't cost any more to restore a cabriolet than it does a coupe, but the return is much higher! If the car is out there, and you want it, you should grab it. $50k is not a bad number for that kind of project. But try to do it out of love for the car rather than the hope of making a profit in a year's time.

-- Matt

[Rusty 356]

This is one I refubished in late 09. Now belongs to a dealer in CA that paid a little over what I stated in an earlier post. Car had been sitting since 76.
So I may be a little optomistic, but still hold my ground on value for an SC CAB.
This was a factory black on black.

[Unobtanium-inc]

Originally Posted by Rusty 356

This is one I refubished in late 09. Now belongs to a dealer in CA that paid a little over what I stated in an earlier post. Car had been sitting since 76.
So I may be a little optomistic, but still hold my ground on value for an SC CAB.
This was a factory black on black.

I think you actually made my case when you stated that it is held by a dealer in California. That's the top of the retail heap pricewise.
-- Matt

[Fixer]

I have seen Coupes do well over $100K when the top goes down the price goes..

Hemming's average sale prices for 1964 356C cabriolet

1,745 cabriolets were made in '64, 8,567 coupes were made

356C Cabriolet

Low: $70,000 Medium: $85000 High $110,000

I did not come across SC Price Guide

[naparsei]

I have two SC coupes, and I would say $100K is a pretty fair price for an SC Cab (fully restored, or original/refreshed). You might $120K, depending on options and esp color. If I could buy that car for $50K, I would, esp if the color is interesting. I don't think we'll ever see restored $60K #s matching open 356s again. The parts and labor are just too expensive, never mind the cost of the car. 356s are great rally/touring cars, much better than many 50s and 60s era cars, and are easy to use/drive.

Just my $0.02

[Rusty 356]

So Telephunken, did you buy the SC CAB?