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What kind of welder is it? try a little more speed and less heat. Pulse the trigger so you dont blow through. That sure isnt a job to be experimenting on. Any imperfection or warpage will stare you right in the face. Iv been welding for 15 years and that job would scare the hell out of me.

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Old 12-25-2019, 02:10 PM
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Heres how I did this

cut 2 inch sections of the rail off, DO NOT GRIND THE RAIL FLAT with the roof, leave yourself a little lip, 1-2mm

Get yourself a stiff wire brush and propane torch. Heat up one section at a time to burn out the sealant in there and hit with wire wheel to clean out, put a couple tacks in place.

move to next section, keep rotating between the two sections of the rail you removed, ONE WELD at a time, nothing more, youll never get your roof straight again if you warp it to bad

once all the 2 inch sections are filled with welds, start making your second round of 2 inch sections,...

after your welded front to back, grind smooth, weld again, I think all in all It was 4 passes with a welder and grinder filling holes etc,..

You have to do this job with gas welder, flux is to hot man.

decent heat and speed up the wire as much as possible till you start bouncing off the panel
Old 12-25-2019, 04:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jimtweet View Post
Heres how I did this



cut 2 inch sections of the rail off, DO NOT GRIND THE RAIL FLAT with the roof, leave yourself a little lip, 1-2mm



Get yourself a stiff wire brush and propane torch. Heat up one section at a time to burn out the sealant in there and hit with wire wheel to clean out, put a couple tacks in place.



move to next section, keep rotating between the two sections of the rail you removed, ONE WELD at a time, nothing more, youll never get your roof straight again if you warp it to bad



once all the 2 inch sections are filled with welds, start making your second round of 2 inch sections,...



after your welded front to back, grind smooth, weld again, I think all in all It was 4 passes with a welder and grinder filling holes etc,..



You have to do this job with gas welder, flux is to hot man.



decent heat and speed up the wire as much as possible till you start bouncing off the panel


That is MEGA. Thank you.


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Old 12-25-2019, 04:55 PM
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Also put your ground as close to the weld as possible especially if your using a cheap welder it might help a bit with better trigger response.
Old 12-26-2019, 05:38 AM
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And use 0.023" wire. You also need a welder that has good power control. Not one of those that has a couple of switches for power control.
You need something like this.


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Old 12-26-2019, 05:39 PM
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I fought the pinch seam sealer off and on...thought several times I had it clean, the all of the sudden the weld would spatter like crazy. Jimtweet is dead on; all I can add is take your time...it will be worth the effort....
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Old 12-26-2019, 06:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JSA993 View Post
I fought the pinch seam sealer off and on...thought several times I had it clean, the all of the sudden the weld would spatter like crazy. Jimtweet is dead on; all I can add is take your time...it will be worth the effort....



Can you walk me through the process that you did? Any pictures?


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Old 12-26-2019, 06:10 PM
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Here are some photos of what I did on mine...not easy, but do-able, plus I was pretty well able to tie all three sheets together which ** ought ** to make it stronger

Dennis
Old 12-27-2019, 01:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iciclehead View Post
































Here are some photos of what I did on mine...not easy, but do-able, plus I was pretty well able to tie all three sheets together which ** ought ** to make it stronger



Dennis


Super helpful Dennis. Thanks. Can you talk at all about the process you went through? How much you shaved down before welding? What I found was, if I ground it all the way flat, there was too much of a gap to weld.


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Old 12-27-2019, 01:13 AM
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take your time, burn out the seam sealer and for gods sake don't use a flapper to grind the weld down... they take a large amount of metal off with every pass... use a die grinder with a sanding disc and take your time
Old 12-27-2019, 08:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by emptyo View Post
Super helpful Dennis. Thanks. Can you talk at all about the process you went through? How much you shaved down before welding? What I found was, if I ground it all the way flat, there was too much of a gap to weld.


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I cut as shown, for the most part I left a very slight pucker (as in above the surface) and since I was leading the joint, I was pretty free about tapping the material down to make a slight valley for the lead to fill.

There were some larger gaps, what I tended to do is very small spots with a circular motion first joining two panels together, then a second spot to join those two into the third and then sometimes a pass down the middle.

I did use a flapper for the highest part of the MIG weld, but as recommended, most of the finishing was done with a high speed air grinder and very carefully at that.

I leaded the joint, and to be honest with you, unless your sheet metal and welding work is perfect enough for high build primer then paint, I would not bondo a thing....lead or nothing.

Lead work is not that hard, certainly no harder than the welding you are doing and the finish is permanent.

By the way, here is the finished product....I am pleased I did this as well as taking out the sunroof....



Dennis
Old 12-27-2019, 10:10 AM
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Welding anything is 30% science/process and 65% art/technique and 5% luck. Welding requires 100% clean, solid dry base metal. The welding process has do be done properly, mig, tig, or oxy require the same base requirements. A skilled welder can take a cheap machine machine and make it work within its limitation, a rookie can take a 5K welder and make an incredible mess. Learning to weld on your Porsche is a fools pursuit, get yourself a bunch of bent auto sheetmetal and practice, then continue until your process is under control and you are confident of your skills. Learning how heat affects metals in terms of expansion/contraction will help control the inevitable distortion that comes with welding. Wanna know where pounds of bondo come from? Lots of bad welding practices have to be a major contributor.
A couple of resources:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lPtNTGW4Xmw

https://www.youtube.com/user/weldingtipsandtricks

Welding appears to be simple, get some basic looking tools and have at it, not so much.
I worked for this guy:
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Old 12-30-2019, 10:39 AM
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Obviously 911 is much more beautiful with 935 / RUF Yellowbird style raingutter delete option. However be REALLY avare, that those four layers should be welded together all of them... otherwise you will loose lots of strength. I have driven now 15 years with smooth car without problems, but my professional body work shop (for decades only bodyshop in Finland to be certified for Porsche Ag warranty body works and crash repair) did it properly welding all layers to each other very carefully and throughout. Also car was fixed in body jig with racing rollcage... Then your body rigidity actually crows, as originally it is not throughout welded.

Here is my Strosek 911 RUF BTR 'evo'




My street legal race car has run strong for 2 decades with this streamlining. Originally -82 body, with some minor aero mods .
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Old 12-30-2019, 11:01 AM
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OK, it might be too late, but, just to to this to a vintage 911 just to customize it, is imho a wrong. this kills the look of it.
do sunroof delets, do wide fenders, do slantnoses, whatever... but not this.
it looks like a suppository.
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Old 12-30-2019, 12:54 PM
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I don't want to be a kill joy here. But it appears the car will be weakened structurally and if you are in an accident and someone gets hurt, the lawyers will be going after you're arse.
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Old 12-30-2019, 02:59 PM
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Quote:
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I don't want to be a kill joy here. But it appears the car will be weakened structurally and if you are in an accident and someone gets hurt, the lawyers will be going after you're arse.


First of all, the car has a full cage. It was a race car in its previous life. Second of all, if this car is in an accident bad enough to be on the roof, I donít think a rain gutter is going to make a difference.


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Old 12-30-2019, 03:09 PM
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I donít think a rain gutter is going to make a difference.


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Not so.

The roofline adds to the structural integrity of the car - particularly if it gets a bang on the front or the back of the car. . The lawyers don't care if it's got a roll cage.
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Old 12-30-2019, 03:21 PM
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Not so.

The roofline adds to the structural integrity of the car - particularly if it gets a bang on the front or the back of the car. . The lawyers don't care if it's got a roll cage.
Ok...whatever. I'm doing it anyway. Thanks for the feedback.
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Old 12-30-2019, 03:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ClickClickBoom View Post
Learning to weld on your Porsche is a fools pursuit
Thank god I didn't pay any attention to that when I built my grey RSR with a Harbor Freight welder and very little body filler.

Love that 6061 guy...been subbed for years!
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Old 12-30-2019, 03:25 PM
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... Get an engineer to say it's fine. And that way you are covered. And you get to have the car looking as you want. Good luck with the project.

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Old 12-30-2019, 03:26 PM
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