Long hood Dansk fender fit 2019

[dhamilto]

Dear all,

Greetings all. I have been reading through some quite old threads on the accuracy of fit of repro fenders/wings because I am thinking of going in that direction.

QUESTION-1 Can anyone share their very recent 2018/19 experiences of the accuracy of fit of the latest Dansk fenders, and precisely where and how much they needed reworking?

QUESTION-2 Also, if you purchased both sides, were they accurately constructed and identical, or where the brackets and other welded on parts differently/poorly positioned like on some of the original factory ones?? ??????????

I am considering buying these because the cost is reasonable and, only if they are accurately constructed L & R and fit pretty good, they could save me a LOT of time and get me on the road faster.

My existing fenders are so different, and so poorly constructed, that they are forcing me to make big compromises on gaps everywhere, or spend a significant amount of time reworking them.... they are also very pitted under the fender support skin (I removed it) and that whole area ought to be replaced, but otherwise solid and rust free everywhere else...

I hope you can help!! cheers, Dean


Here is more detail about the fit of my existing fenders for anyone interested:

I am working on final fitting/fettling of the whole front end following a front latch panel and suspension pan and support replacement. These are the issues with my fenders/wings:

-the front fenders dont match and dont fit very well:
>poor fit at the doors
>distances down to the front tip above the horn grille are about 7mm different
>the front tips are both stick up too high
>the gap adjacent to tires is about 40 and 50 mm respectively
>large gap about 10mm above the front light cluster on one side
>front light cluster bracket closest to the wheel is about 7 mm too close to the front lip
>underneath, the strip that positions the bumper to fender rubber is badly positioned

Overall, after a lot more work cutting a re-welding, I think I can come up with a semi-reasonable compromise for all the gaps.

[dwelle]

i used dansk fenders on my green backdate. the fenders were bought in '17. i found the fit to very reasonable, only a small amount of work was needed to get gaps i'm quite happy with. i wouldn't hesitate to use them again. ymmv...

[Geronimo '74]

No experience with Dansk panels but that car sure looks great.
Nice color too.

[dhamilto]

Thanks for your input Dwelle, and your car looks amazing... looks really low too - is that within the scope of adjustment of stock suspension?

73T Targa, 334 met blau

[dwelle]

when i finished building it, i put 205/50’s on it and had to lower it further than in that pic. that was ultimately too low for my tastes: and the tires were just too damn small. here it with the 50’s and really low:



that set up was too low for what is ultimately a daily driver. i ended up raising it a bit and stuffing 205/55’s under there and have been really happy with the set up. the rear is easy, and the front just needed a bump stop and some turbo tie rods. i could raise the spindles, but for this car i don’t feel it’s necessary....

[dhamilto]

Hi again, sorry for follow-up question. I tried to find out from my local supplier of Dansk fenders whether the fuel flap AND bowl were included/fitted but they couldnt tell me and didnt get back to me. Would you be able to tell me please? Interesting that they L and R are the same price.

By the way, did you have to rework along the top of the front side light seal where there is often a gap between the fender and seal, or does it appear that Dansk have fixed that issue?

Thanks again!

[Thomas Owen]

I purchased both left and right in 2018 and have found them to fit very well. There was/is not a turn signal or horn grill gap issue.
Lastly, the left side did include the bowl and gas filler flap.

good luck

[Taycan]

Originally Posted by dhamilto

Hi again, sorry for follow-up question. I tried to find out from my local supplier of Dansk fenders whether the fuel flap AND bowl were included/fitted but they couldnt tell me and didnt get back to me. Would you be able to tell me please? Interesting that they L and R are the same price.

By the way, did you have to rework along the top of the front side light seal where there is often a gap between the fender and seal, or does it appear that Dansk have fixed that issue?

Thanks again!

Very nice work indeed!

[dennisO]

Dean,

Just curious, are your existing fenders originals or repros? If originals, did they come from different cars?

[dhamilto]

Originally Posted by dennisO

Dean,

Just curious, are your existing fenders originals or repros? If originals, did they come from different cars?

Hi DennisO,

Pretty sure that they are originals because they are clearly too old to be repros, but I suspect that one or both are not original to my car. Same goes for the doors, and fitment of the doors. Who knows what was changed in the first 30 years prior to my ownership. The inner fenders/wings appear to be all original. For sure, if I line up my fenders at the windscreen cowl end, I cannot get them to line up with the horn grills and the bolt holes at the front tips - from recollection, I think there is around 3/8" to 1/2" difference. There is also quite a big gap at the top of one of the front signal lights, between the seal and the fender. Anyway, both fenders are crusty enough under the hockey stick shaped wing supports and adjacent to the rockers/sills to justify buying new....

Cheers

[dhamilto]

Originally Posted by Thomas Owen

I purchased both left and right in 2018 and have found them to fit very well. There was/is not a turn signal or horn grill gap issue.
Lastly, the left side did include the bowl and gas filler flap.

good luck

Thanks for this clarification Thomas, cheers!

[70SWT]

Further: has anyone had experience with the Dansk-looking fenders sold by "smcporscheplatz" on eBay?

They are a little cheaper than Dansk, begging the question of whether they are the same thing and, if not, of the same quality.

[dhamilto]

Hi all, just a quick update after have purchased/returned a pair of pre-73 Dansk front fenders/wings and then paid the extra for a pair of OEM Porsche versions.

The Dansk fenders received had the following issues, so I returned them:

- one was about 3/8" longer than the other, when measured (precisely) along the top of the mounting rail to the front tip.
- there was a major issue with the mounting rails, where the headlight / nose section part of the fender is seam welded to the rest of the fender. The two sections were extremely badly joined together at the mounting rail such that the mounting rails were completely out of shape and would have needed to be cut, dressed and re-welded.
- the horn grill / signal light brackets were welded together completely differently to the point where they would have to be pulled apart and reassembled to make them look correct and match L and R sides. In addition, the front bumper seal guide rails on the underside of the brackets were both really far out of position so the bumper seals were badly aligned with the fenders (I tried them). All of this would require a LOT of rework.
- badly packaged for transport - only a piece of polystyrene at both ends which were completely destroyed in transit ans one fender was badly damaged.
- I cannot comment on how they fitted on the car because they never made it past inspection

The Porsche wings were MUCH nicer, as I suppose we should expect, but they were far from perfect. They gave a 10% discount on list price BTW. Here is what I found:

- L and R were the same length (phew!) along the mounting rails, and tip to tip, and looked almost identical in every way when sitting side-by-side on the rug.
- the horn grill / signal light brackets were a reasonably good match L and R, with one of them welded on flush with the fender mounting rail and one welded about 1/8" back from the mounting rail. The guide rails for the front bumper rubber were perfectly positioned (yay!).
- HOWEVER, ANNOYINGLY, the top edge of last inch of the L fender mounting rail was incorrectly finished, at the front tip of the fender adjacent to the top of the horn grille. Instead of having a smooth rounded edge like the rest of the fender, it was a sharp right angle for about the last inch. In the light, this sharp edge makes it look like the tip of the fender was bending in towards the hood. Porsche were happy to exchange it, but the replacement was EXACTLY THE SAME.
- The fuel filler cap needs a lot of force to close, and was same on the replacement.
- the seam weld that joins the front section of the fender to the rest of the fender was not ground down at all on the inside and looks quite a mess.
- Lot of weld splatter and quite rough paint on underside, outside surface finish good.
- Not very well packaged for transport, laid loose in custom L-shaped boxes with a soft foam block ender each end. One fender busted through the cardboard in transit but, luckily, no damage occured.
- They are on the car, and fit really well - both sides look the same.

Looks like very little little or no re-work will be needed for the Porsche fenders, but the Dansk fenders would have needed MAJOR time-consuming re-work on the horn grill brackets and mounting rails.

Last point, it is interesting that the Dansk fenders had the same issues as the original 50 year old fenders that I was replacing, except the mounting rails were straight and nicely finished on the originals, so arguably Porsche had better quality control 50 years ago than Dansk in 2019. Judging by the 3 fenders that I received from Porsche, they do seem to have made some improvements to these in recent years but there are still some major quality issues and room for improvement IN MY HUMBLE OPINION.

All pics are Dansk except the ones marked OEM.

[70SWT]

dhamilto - Great information. Thanks for going to such lengths to look into this.

I wonder if the "smcporscheplatz" fenders are simply Dansk fenders. I asked the seller and he said no, but...there are only so many 911 fender makers in the world...

[coomo]

Done a few 911s.Have learnt to only use Dansk for inner/outer sills etc.They always need a lot f work.Wouldnt touch fenders/Bonnet.Theyve been around a long time.I reckon the presses are getting tired.
Will now only use Restoration Design.Its no coincidence, they have a long waiting time, fullfilling orders.
Having said that.If you have a 40 plus year od car. and expect panels to be perfect and /or fit.Your expectations are unrealistic to be honest.
If no panels fit, your car maybe twisted or has had previous botched repairs.Or it just maybe your car, is like most of em out there.
You will spend many many hours panelling these cars.Its an art to some degree.If you cant get a body guy who can preferably with a jig.
The car im currently rebuilding needed both wings(fenders) Its a back date.Its difficult to find nice original panels in Europe.Dansk are ****.So, We used perfect SC short hood ones, and a lightbox kit from TRE.
Easier to jiggle fit, and saves a lot of money.

[dhamilto]

Originally Posted by 70SWT

dhamilto - Great information. Thanks for going to such lengths to look into this.

I wonder if the "smcporscheplatz" fenders are simply Dansk fenders. I asked the seller and he said no, but...there are only so many 911 fender makers in the world...

You're most welcome - I wish I had known what I know now. Maybe I was unlucky with the Dansk fenders I received; they are obviously assembled from the parts by hand, and with questionable or no jigs, so there is likely to be some variation. The ones I received though looked like they might have been assembled by someone with extremely poor eyesight, and then skipped quality control.

No idea about the SMC fenders. Can there really be a 3rd manufacturer - seems doubtful. They are unlikely to be Porsche, I think, so most likely Dansk, or maybe something really terrible, or really great. There is only one way to find out !

If the Porsche fenders didn't have "Made in Germany" stickers on them, I would have suspected that they had hand-picked the best ones from the Dansk production line...

[70SWT]

Originally Posted by dhamilto

...they are obviously assembled from the parts by hand...

So is it the case that Dansk, Porsche's supplier, and smcporscheplatz's supplier (if it is indeed a further party) all start with the same subcomponents of the fender, and then each welds them together using their own approach to produce the final fender?

I'm picturing the main body of the fender, the headlight bucket, the turn signal support and the gas filler items all coming as separate pieces from some original manufacturer in Europe.

This could explain the differences you saw between the Dansk and Porsche items, smc's claims that they don't sell Dansk, and why some folks seem happy with Dansk.

Maybe Porsche's supplier simply adheres to a more reliable standard that Dansk sometimes accidentally meets. So you see the length difference you found for Dansk vs. Porsche.

Just a theory, and/or maybe what you (dhamilto) are thinking...

[Thomas Owen]

I should have noticed this earlier, but did not. I replaced my inner fenders with Dansk and everything seemed pretty good until I go to the front and forward of the latch panel.

For some reason the hood seal lip stops way to early and leave a gap down to the end finish piece:


Next, I did a test install of my Dansk fender, which I had previously posted 'fit real well'. It now appears that the fender is short up by the horn grill. I close the hood (properly aligned at the rear) and the nose of the hood sits out a bit from the horn grill by 3/8".

I can't move the hood back, and I can't move the fender forward.

Do you by chance have the tip to tip measurement you took on the Dansk and OEM fenders?

[dhamilto]

Hi Thomas, welcome to my world ! I didnt measure the Dansk fenders, and returned those unmarked pronto, and then ordered OEM fenders for both sides. I can go out and take measurements of the OEM fenders later, but I am not sure how helpful a tip-to-tip measurement would be given that the indicator light assemblies in particular are so roughly assembled in 3 dimensions and so I think those measurements would not be a good reference for you. Potentially, your hood is too long and your fender is correct. The M^ bolt holes set the front position of the fender, and you have removed them I think. If you have your original fenders, they would help you to position your new fender rail end pieces in the correct M6 bolt location. Strange that some suppliers have removed that piece from the inner fender seal gutter, by the way.

I also wanted to point out that I have 3 long hoods and have been trying to work out why they all fit differently and especially at the nose, including one overhanging by about 3/8 like yours, and how I can make them all fit the same (I will post this information when I get time). To cut a long story short, I carefully hammered the front tip inwards on the 3/8" too long hood with a rubber mallet and block of wood, to match the two other slightly shorter hoods, with quite good results. I first traced a line along the hood noses on card to use as a reference with the wide ends of the hood raised about 40" (all 3 hoods were off the car, on the ground). Even though it seemed to be perfect on the floor, it was about 1/16 short when sitting on the front tip of the bumper seal on one side of the car, and about 1/16 too long on the opposite side. So, I think some careful malleting of the sharp end of the front tip will result in a perfect fit on top of the front bumper seal (I haven't done it yet). The outline of the frame did show through a little bit along the shorter side, so it is possible to go too far... Aside from the differences at the nose, there were also small differences in the curvature of the last 12 inches or so of the front sections of the 3 hoods, almost as if the factory potentially might have tweaked the curvature of that part of the hood to make them fit the cars (at the point where the frame narrows, which would be just above the highest part of the latch panel.

I also noticed that even slight adjustments of the hood height at the screen end, by repositioning of the hinges, can make a big difference to the position of the front end of the hood corners to the tips of the fenders. Raising this height allows the hood to shift back, and vice-versa. However, raising the hood height at the cowel end also increases the gap and height between the sides of the hood and the fenders. I am still playing with this compromise, alongside all of the other compromises...

I am also having real trouble getting the OEM fenders to fit well between the cowel and the door - its seems like the support frame (double skin) at the door end underside of the OEM fenders might not be welded into the ideal positions, or at least not for my car, and the door end of both fenders sit too high. They are so stiff at that end that there is no wiggle room and I am on the verge of cutting a slot in the fender, where it mounts against the cowel, to TRY to lower the tips and close the gaps adjacent to the doors. Any tips that you can share would be mucho appreciated!!

[dhamilto]

Short update - I measured one of my old fenders tip-2-tip as 1620 mm (63 3/4") and one of the OEM fenders measured the same. This was measured UNDER the fender from the point at the cowl end, to the point on the underside of the horn grill frame. My other OEM fender is fully bolted on at the moment, but I can measure it when I (inevitably) remove it next. I also have two other originals tucked away. Why don't you post your measurements and we can see if it is worth measuring other fenders?

Perhaps other people with fenders already off the car could contribute their tip-2-tip measurements. This would no-doubt help other guys in the future too...