Can't pressurize brake system (Motive pressure bleeders)

Greg White · 04-26-2003, 11:05 AM

I am bleeding my brakes for the first time today. I am using the Motive pressure bleeder because of all the posts about it. The first step is to test the system by pumping it up to 10 psi to check for leaks. Well I must have leaks or I did something wrong. My system will not pressurize at all, not even one pound. What am I doing wrong or how do I stop the leak? (yes, I tested the pressure bleeder to see if it was the problem) Thanks in advance, Greg White

Ps this is only my second DIY project, my short shift kit went in this morning and worked perfectly, thanks to all the posts and tech. articles here. Thanks for that too.

911pcars · 04-26-2003, 11:09 AM

Greg,
You may have forgotten to pinch off the reservoir breather hose. Check the open end for spilled fluid and neutralize w/water.

Sherwood Lee
http://members.rennlist.org/911pcars
(Litespeed Ti as well)

Greg White · 04-26-2003, 11:47 AM

Thanks Sherwood, if any directions mentiond this, I did not see i. I will try that right now. Greg

Which Litespeed do you have and what type of cycling do you do?

Greg White · 04-26-2003, 11:55 AM

Well Sherwood, that was it!!!!! I was looking right at that tube and never thought to pinch it off. Another question, what pressure should I pump up the bleeder to? I also could not find that number anywhere. Thanks again Greg

911pcars · 04-26-2003, 12:34 PM

I use the gravity method, but I think most folks here use about 20 psi on their pressure bleeders.

BTW, Litespeed Catalyst, circa '96. Weekender mostly, but got dropped by my riding buds this morning. Gotta get back into shape. And you?

Sherwood

Greg White · 04-26-2003, 12:50 PM

As is my usual fate on any DIY car project, I went through the first three brakes without issue (used 10 psi just to be safe) and the last bleeding valve was frozen and rounded off. I have it soaking in WD-40 now and hope it will let loose. Assuming it will, (it has to) how do I replace the valve without getting air into the system or making a big mess?

Mine is a 97 Ultimate for all around road cycling. Today is my Porsche day and tomorrow is a bike day. Kentucky has some of the best road cycling you can find anywhere. (Assuming you like hills) Tomorrow will be about 60 miles through the hill of the Bluegrass. I can't wait! Greg

s_wilwerding · s_wilwerding's Garage

Quote:

Originally posted by Greg White
As is my usual fate on any DIY car project, I went through the first three brakes without issue (used 10 psi just to be safe) and the last bleeding valve was frozen and rounded off. I have it soaking in WD-40 now and hope it will let loose. Assuming it will, (it has to) how do I replace the valve without getting air into the system or making a big mess?

Mine is a 97 Ultimate for all around road cycling. Today is my Porsche day and tomorrow is a bike day. Kentucky has some of the best road cycling you can find anywhere. (Assuming you like hills) Tomorrow will be about 60 miles through the hill of the Bluegrass. I can't wait! Greg

I just swapped out my bleeder valves with Speed Bleeders. Of course, I managed to round off one of the old ones trying to remove it. Use a vice grips to try to turn it - it worked for me.

As for air getting into the system, as long as no one is pumping the brake pedal while you're replacing the bleeder, it shouldn't suck any air back in. You will have to bleed that one side that you replace the bleeder valve on after you install it.

Greg White · 04-26-2003, 01:14 PM

Thanks Steve, I think I will go and get another (better) type of "liquid wrench" to apply to this valve. I only have WD-40 on hand at the moment. Do you know of a better product? I think I will get the speed bleeders also. I know that with the pressure bleeder, this is kind of like suspenders and a belt, but it can't hurt.
Thanks, Greg

Greg White · 04-26-2003, 01:43 PM

It Broke loose!!!!!!!!!! I just needed a better set of vice grips with teeth. The rest of the procedure went without a hitch. Assuming I have good break pedal feel, this Motive system is the *****. No bubbles and used very little fluid to replace the old. Truely a one man job! Thanks again for all the help. Greg

sundaypunch · 04-27-2003, 05:12 AM

You might want to try "PB Blaster". $5 at most auto supply stores. Works much better than WD40 or Liquid Wrench. The stuff is corrosive on rubber over time so you need to be careful where you spray it. I always spray things down a day before a project and rarely have a problem.

rlane · 04-28-2003, 07:22 AM

Greg, glad your DIY'er has been productive. I second the recommendation for PB Blaster, I know Advance carries it..super stuff, as evidenced by no real issues redoing my 78SC suspension..which I can confirm had NEVER been touched!.
I work in Louisville about three days /week and perhaps we will convince you to bring your 84 up to a DE at Putnam or Mid-Ohio this year.

caliber60 · 04-28-2003, 09:07 AM

I had the same problem. The instruction is too general for Porsche. I wished the instruction is better. I was so pissed when the whole brake fluid just pouring down from the reservior tube. Pressure bleeder is a nice product but the instuction sucks. I email with the manufacturer about the issue last time but he thinks the it's just fine.

mike f · 04-28-2003, 11:02 AM

It's all in 101 projects, which I consider a must have for any DIYer.

Decolliber · 04-28-2003, 01:03 PM

... and don't forget to bleed the clutch while you are at it.

Rick Lee · Rick Lee's Garage

Speaking of bleeding the clutch, will the power bleeder be enough psi for that? I've bled my clutch the old fashioned way several times and did brakes once with the power bleeder. But I've heard that the foot method is all that works for the clutch. True?

911pcars · 04-28-2003, 01:14 PM

"I had the same problem. The instruction is too general for Porsche. I wished the instruction is better. I was so pissed when the whole brake fluid just pouring down from the reservior tube. Pressure bleeder is a nice product but the instuction sucks. I email with the manufacturer about the issue last time but he thinks the it's just fine."

Too typical of many products. Product engineer/team in charge works on something for a long time and doesn't take user's perspective into consideration - assumes the user (pro technician) knows how to use it and/or put it together (wrong assumption) - uhh, what about the rest of us? They also don't allow as much development time on documentation; instead they rush to production and to market. In this case, it wastes time, brake fluid and potentially damages paint surfaces.

Their response to you sounds neanderthal if not arrogant.

Sherwood Lee
http://members.rennlist.org/911pcars

Lucky · 04-28-2003, 01:34 PM

The Bentley manual (at least the Carrera version) has a procedure for power-bleeding brakes. I consulted it and the steps printed on the side of the Motive when doing my brakes a few weeks ago. Bentley says you can do 1 bar (14.7 psi) safely with a power bleeder.

Complete fluid replacement and bleeding took about 20 minutes on top of a 3 hour job to jack up, remove wheels, swap in new pads and replace flexible lines with new. I can honestly say I look forward to my next brake bleeding!! What a great tool!

Rick Lee · Rick Lee's Garage

Hey John, just get yourself a cordless impact driver and see how fast it goes. That was the best X-mas present I ever got.

SteveStromberg · 04-28-2003, 05:13 PM

To answer the question on keeping the fluid from leaking out, keep the vent plug and cut a square of plastic from a baggie and placeover Res. fill er then screw the cap on. this will keep the fluid from leaking out.Steve

Lucky · 04-28-2003, 05:43 PM

Richard, I've got air tools!! That 1/2" impact wrench is awesome! I'm not NASTYCAR quick, but can do a wheel in less than 30 seconds with only a few scratches.

Question that seems thread appropriate. I now have two pints of used brake fluid stored in my garage... how do you properly dispose of this stuff? I take may used oil to a local gas/service station. Is it likely that they'd take brake fluid, too?