‘72 911S authenticity

[boxer246]

Looking at buying what allegedly is a ‘72 S, a rough project car. My questions are regarding its authenticity. The vin number on the ID tag on the front apron says 911S. The vin number digits do match with what a ‘72S should have. The tag appears unmolested. The vin number stamping on the chassis in the trunk does match the ID tag. Those numbers also appear unmolested. The vin tag on the A pillar however does not appear to be original. It is a aluminum tag with authentic appearing numbers that match everything else, however the tag is only a flat stick-on plate, not the curved original type that is riveted to the A pillar. The A pillar itself appears to have original unmolested vinyl, with no evidence of any rivet holes, or evidence of an original style tag ever being there.

The bigger reasons that I question weather this is an actual S car are as follows:
-there is no front oil cooler, no any evidence whatsoever that there was ever one mounted. No oil lines, brackets, holes in the front of the rocker panel for oil lines, and the oil filter console is the non-thermostat type used on the T and E cars.
-the tach is a 6500 RPM “T” tach.
-the engine deck lid is steel, not aluminum
-the engine is a ‘72T MFI engine (obviously this could have been swapped out)

There are a couple of S things on the car….a correct steel S front bumper is there as well as the alloy one piece front calipers.

While I realize that technically everything noted is bolt-on things that theoretically could have been changed out to T stuff, why would anyone do that. And is the A pillar tag anything that someone has seen before?

For the most part I do believe it is an actual S, but I just want to have a little more certainty before moving forward.

Ultimately this could be cleared up by obtaining a COA, which either myself or the owner may do, but haven’t yet.

Thanks for any thoughts.

[HarryD]

You need to look at the VIN number. This Webpage may be helpful: https://web.archive.org/web/20170920133156/http://www.elferhelfer.de/fz-ident/1972-73.html

[HarryD]

[boxer246]

Yes. As I mentioned I’ve checked and the VIN number is correct for an S.

[HarryD]

Something is fishy. Why would anyone swap a 190 hp 911S motor for a 140 hp 911T motor?

The folks at the Early 911S Registry BBS may be helpful: https://www.early911sregistry.org/forums/forum.php

[HarryD]

Interesting discussion here: https://www.early911sregistry.org/forums/showthread.php?84257-911-S-without-external-oil-cooler-lines

check posts 15 and 16.

[gled49]

For me the stamped number in the front trunk takes precedence over the riveted ALU tag on the latch panel.

[boxer246]

Interesting info on this at the early S site. I appreciate the info.
By the sound of it, it’s possible some ‘72S cars didn’t have coolers. Perhaps this is a late build ‘72 I need to check the numbers again.
Both the vin numbers in the trunk appear not tampered with and match. It’s the VIN tag on the windshield “A” pillar that doesn’t look original to me.

[30westrob]

In 73 the front oil cooler was an option on The T E & S. My 73S did not come with the optional cooler. Rob

[70SATMan]

Originally Posted by boxer246

Interesting info on this at the early S site. I appreciate the info.
By the sound of it, it’s possible some ‘72S cars didn’t have coolers. Perhaps this is a late build ‘72 I need to check the numbers again.
Both the vin numbers in the trunk appear not tampered with and match. It’s the VIN tag on the windshield “A” pillar that doesn’t look original to me.

ROW car wouldn't have had the A pillar tag and I've seen odd VIN tags added when a ROW car is brought into the states.

[Rodney Nelson]

Get a picture of that vin plate in the trunk and post it here. Do the numbers look like the same font used in other cars? put a mirror under the vin panel in the trunk any eveidence of metal work?

If what others have said above is correct you could have an S.... but why change out the motor? Is there S brakes? You would never change those out?

[boxer246]

Interesting point about the ROW lack of VIN plate on the A pillar. That would definitely explain why the one that is there appears to be added, or unoriginal. And also explains the lack of rivet holes from any previous vin plate.

Yes the front brakes are S, alloy calipers. The VIN number fonts on the numbers stamped in the chassis, as well as on the front data plate do appear to be the correct font.

[Rosco_NZ]

An ‘(S)’ engine has value in an otherwise shabby car .. might help explain a possible swap ..