Cars as fun to drive as the air cooled?

[kyngfish]

I tried posting this in a more general car forum and when I got recommendations like the latest Aston SUV I realized they had no idea what I was talking about.

Basically I love driving my 911 and I’m keeping it but I want something else. I don’t necessarily need something that fast. The 911 is fast enough that it doesn’t feel slow with modern traffic but not so fast that I can’t use it on the street. I love the steering feel and I love the sound and the revs. So here are some things I am thinking.

1. Caterham- I love that it looks vintage but it has a modern motor that isn’t quite so precious. The downside is that it’s really a fairweather car while the 911 is all weather.
2. Lotus - I’d love an Emira but that isn’t in the budget probably for another few years. An Elise though is reachable.
3. TR6 - relatively inexpensive for one that’s well sorted. People say they drive well but I haven’t driven one so I don’t know how it compares to the 911
4. Cobra Replica - I’d like a 289 slab side but those get pricey really quickly and I’m not sure what the driving experience difference is between the 50k or 100k replicas are
5. Speedster replica - ditto for above.

Anyone have any experience with the cars above? Anything else I’m missing?

[wildthing]

Miata. GR86/BRZ. S2000.

[Matt at Pelican Parts]

A modern-ish roadster would fill the gap nicely. As mentioned above, Miata, but also you have BMW Z3 and Z4, Honda s2000, ad so on.

Admittedly I do love the TR6 but mechanically speaking it might be a maintenance nightmare. I know those old MBGs can come with headaches

[kyngfish]

Originally Posted by wildthing

Miata. GR86/BRZ. S2000.

Driven a few of those. Aside from the s2000 they are great cars but don’t feel special in the same way the 911 does.

Another thing I’m considering which really isn’t like the ones above is a w204 c63

[Funracer]

NA Miata is the best sports car FOR THE MONEY of the modern era. Nothing even close for cheap. Breaking a 911 is never cheap and something I keep in mind whenever I leave the driveway. You can drive an NA (early) Miata hard and if it breaks (very unlikely) the parts to fix it are a fraction what they are for Porsche. The handle like a slot car and have torque but not much power. Best OE shifter I’ve ever used. A set up Miata can push a Boxster hard on the track for a small percentage of the cost. I have owned 5 and raced them for a short while in the Spec Miata series. If they had a factory 6 cylinder engine I’d still be driving one. Buy one with 100,000 miles thats been maintained. Put 15 inch wheels and great tires on it. You will have a blast.

[PeteKz]

The answer always is "Miata."

That said, it sounds like you are looking for something outside the price/performance ratio. What you like is up to you. But start by driving a late model Miata, with more oomph. And if you buy one, drive the chit out of it. Try to break it.

"It's more fun to drive a slow car fast, than a fast car slow."

[plexiform]

Best bang for the buck car I ever had was a 2007 Subaru STI. Hard to find one now in good shape with low miles and low price but if you can, other than an air cooled 911, this is the next best thing. The 4wd makes it an incredible daily driver.

[chrisbruck]

I came from a NA Miata to the 911 since it had the little back seats for my 2 kids when they were small. They are different cars but I have to say the smile the Miata gave me is about on par with my 911.

I miss it a lot and frankly, given what the 911 is worth now, would consider selling it and going back to the Miata. The investment in dollars per smile is unbeatable.

[Shaun @ Tru6]

240Z, the Japanese equivalent of a 911, you get the same raw feel and you can swing the rear end around all day long and never get bored.

[2.7RS]

Track or street driving?

Makes a huge difference.

Vintage feel? or Modern reliability?

I had fun driving a Mini Cooper JCW and a GR86 right off the lot.

[Marine Blue]

I’m surprised no one suggested the 987.2 Boxster or Cayman. They aren’t as cheap to maintain as some of the Japanese cars mentioned but they’re very reliable if you find a well maintained example and annual maintenance costs are relatively low. They have maybe a touch too much power to use in its entirety on the street but still engaging at lower speeds. Not air cooled engaging but very communicative and capable.

They make a great stablemate to an aircooled as you get a tasted of old and modern analog Porsches.

[lindbhr]

+1 for the 240Z. I bought an Alfa Romeo Giulia Sprint GT to drive while my 911 is being restored. Fun to drive, unique styling, easy to work on, and not expensive to maintain.

[BrianC9379]

I juggle my ride time between a 1987 Targa and a 2017 Mazda MX-5. Similar in size, but nicely different driving experiences between them. Each one gives me an appreciation for the other.

[David Inc.]

Miata is the answer for steering feel and connection to the road, the combination of that feeling plus sound and revs? Much more difficult.

Edit: For me I just couldn't imagine loving the 911 in the same way if it didn't have that flat six.

[onboost]

Yeah, the 911 is a hard act to follow.. and to me, many of the cars mentioned are too modern.. unless that's what you're looking for? However, from your initial post, it doesn't see to be.

If that's the case then I would suggest something like a BMW 2002, or an Alfa GTV or Sprint GT like lindbhr posted. You better catch these quick though because they're getting spendy! Also, consider some of the larger BMWs like the e21 323i if you can find one.. its the 320i body with the M20 6cyl, I had a couple and they really put a smile on my face when the 911 was down. And since I'm on the BMW rant.. look at the e30 325 models.. I prefer 89 -91 they come in 2 and 4dr, make sure its a 5spd. They have a huge following now and are getting pricy too.. but they will give you what you're looking for in addition to a few more creature comforts.

[famoroso]

Good discussion.

Loved my '05:Elise for 17 years. It was primarily a track car. The adjustability of things like the suspension and the pedal box, from the factory was impressive. It's so small tho, apart from dawn patrol canyon carving runs, driving it on public roads legitimately felt like dancing with Elephants. It's pretty purposeful / unique tho. Light truly makes right tho, so, apart from the aforementioned Caterham, the chassis dynamics / feedback / feel are difficult to find elsewhere,

Honda S2000. Kind of an Elise for grownups. A friend, who raced Spec Miata, autocrossed her S2000. That covered the motorsports waterfront for her, which is hard to argue against. That's the best factory shifter that I've experienced.

E86 Z4M Coupe (or Roadster). When I first drove one in-period, I thought "If I ever grow-up and sell the Elise, I could see getting one of these." The S54 motor is special. I love it's high-strung character for a track / sports purpose car. In fact, writing this makes me want to acquire a Z4M Coupe, slap a KWV3 suspension on it and just drive.


Meanwhile, after hanging up my track shoes and selling my Elise, all I did was acquire another air cooled 911. I guess I'm swimming in that end of the pool for the foreseeable future

[Shaun @ Tru6]

I'm adding one of my future purchases, the Lancia Fulvia

[fallingat120mph]

Originally Posted by Shaun @ Tru6

240Z, the Japanese equivalent of a 911, you get the same raw feel and you can swing the rear end around all day long and never get bored.

+1, also.

Grew up in the back seat of our 280z 2+2 and then later helped my father restore old Datsun Z's.

Initially after college was debating hard on 260,240, 280z vs. 911.

911 won but....



Erik

[fallingat120mph]

Had a neighbor with a few TR6's in England. I had an MGBGT but really liked the TR6, especially with the hardtop.

Very fun to drive. Very British and to me very different than the 911. Especially with the top down...

Know a few people here in Texas that own and they will take them to their graves. Supposedly there is a good club system for the owners here in the US.

[wildthing]

I initially suggested 2 seater or 2+2 but since you mentioned C63, I will throw in an earlier E55 or even an E63, an older RS4, maybe a newer RS3, I saw an RS6 wagon the other day but that's too much money for me for that car.

Heck there's even an RHD Supra on Top Rank Imports...