993 Sanity Check - is this for real?
 

I had the 993 in to my local independent shop for a parasitic electrical problem, and while they had it on the rack I asked them to investigate a minor oil leak. Car is a ‘96 and has 30,000 miles on it. Anyways, this is what they reported:

"So after some inspection we figured it out. You're looking at the timing chain boxes leaking."

When I asked how much to fix, I received this reply:

"It's going to cost quite a bit to get rid of that leak. This is one of the worst case scenario leaks - it's about $7,000 or because it requires retiming the engine."

So I asked incredulously, "Taking the timing chain covers off makes it so the engine has to be re-timed?"

And the tech replied, "Well, you take the timing gears off the cams to get the chain housings off."

Is this true? The gears on the cams are outside of the covers? That just does not seem possible, but I've only owned a 901 prior to buying this 993 a few months back.

Any advice appreciated!

The timing chain carters have a front and a back. And they join the engine block as well. Where is the leak?

That is a ridiculously high quote. Yes, if the cam boxes are leaking behind the sprockets, then they would need to come off for the re-seal and yes, re-timed. But it is not that big of a deal to do so I would quickly move on from that shop.

Timing chain covers are two piece. As mentioned, depending where the leak is, you need to pull the sprockets, etc.

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1752580441.jpg
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1752580441.jpg

At $150 an hour that’s 46 hours.

At $200 an hour that’s 35 hours.

At $300 an hour that’s 23 hours

That’s a helluva lot of time…


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Are the dropping the motor? How severe is the leak? If you drop the motor, you might want to take care of other things while it's out.

I understand the car has low mileage, but at this point it's the age that makes things degrade. If the leak is minor, I would just live with it until you have a bunch of things that you need to take care of when the motor is dropped.

That’s very helpful - thank you.

Yeah, I went through the same arithmetic myself.

Thank you all for your insights - I appreciate it.
I guess it didn’t occur to me that the covers were two piece designs, but I can see why now.

I’m unclear exactly where the leak is. And it isn’t much of a leak. Just a little disappointing TBH.

Anyways they did forward one pic - see below:

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1752600838.jpg

I had a leak in the same area that required removal of the casting as shown, yes retime the camshafts. I did other work while engine was out but I doubt I had more than 8 hours total to remove / replace engine and repair this oil leak.

Have you used this independent before for any significant work? I recently bought another 911 which required some attention that was beyond my present capabilities. First, and most well known, independent in my area gave me an outrageous quote. I know it was particularly absurd as they gave me a $2k plus quote for additional project that I was thinking of doing myself, one that is known to be a ~3 hour project with ~$200 in parts. That really reinforced my decision to look elsewhere, unfortunately not a lot of Indy shops (or even Porsche dealers) in my area. Fortunately with some research I was able to get in touch with a highly regarded mechanic who isn’t as highly publicized who gave much more reasonable numbers.

Good news is you live in SoCal and there are a lot more options for independent shops. Unless you have a longstanding relationship with this one I would simply move on. If they are possibly ripping you off on this project what about the next one when you might feel more reason because they have a history with your car?

It was a few years ago, but I had a 3.2 pulled, broken head stud replaced, rebuilt all the heads and a bunch of other stuff while I was in there....and that was $7,200. Your quote sounds CRAZY to me.

Sure you have to re-time the motor, and if you are carful doing the removal that's not hard at all because you don't rotate the engine crank or cams doing the job. If they are marked well I don't think re-timing is THAT big of a deal, but others with more experience can chime in.

I would clean it well and try to isolate the leak before I spent any money or significant time on a repair. If it is the covers, easy fix. If it is behind the boxes, you might chose to live with a minor leak for a good many years.

When you consider the cost of doing business in LA the quote is not out of line
However I see no need of that repair based on the picture

At $7000, that minor leak just became nonexistent!

What oil are you using ?
Maybe find an oil that has gasket/seal replenish properties, eg; some folk have experienced gasket and seal seepage after going over to fully synthetic oil from good old mineral oil, got to be worth a try ?
Ant.

The car is new to me (6 months) but was serviced right before I got it. And I have the records, so I will check - good point.

I was advised on my '72 911 not to use synthetic as it was more likely to leak. IDK what's recommended for a '96, but I will look into that as well.

As for the cost, interestingly a '96 993 just popped up on BAT yesterday, and in the write up they mentioned the time chain covers/case and lower valve covers had been resealed. And I got lucky (or maybe not, sometimes the truth hurts...) in the photos they included the receipt for the work!


http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1752688366.jpg

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1752689834.jpg

So I guess that may be the going rate for the job if you're in the LA area...

Not the answer I wanted, but I do appreciate all a y'all's help - thanks for the education!

:)
Ant.

Had the same leak on an 86...same procedure to repair. Setting the timing is "scary" to a novice but not difficult at all for anyone with a basic mechanical understanding and reading comprehension.

I understand the charge but would NEVER pay that. I did them myself. If DIY is not an option, ignore the oil weep. Wash it off every few months and save the money.